Ray G

That PR is really misleading. And how can they say it's "the most successful high-performance sports car of all time"? By what measure? There were more F40s made. There were faster cars made. Maybe it's successful because it's the most money per car that Porsche ever made!

Ray G

Ferrari has much more brand prestige than lowly Porsche. And in my experience, Ferrari buyers want image more than anything.

Nick

I was speaking with a Porsche dealer a couple of days ago regarding the sales plight of the CGT. The response was Porsche made their money and the dealers were left holding the bag. Many lost money and most will not get entrapped again should Porsche try to sell a "supercar" in the future. Apparently it has created a point of friction between Porsche and its dealers.

1AS

Makes sense,
If Porsche got about $400,000 for each of 1250 cars (give or take), they got $500,000,000 in revenue to offset development and manufacture costs. If you presume each car gets built for about half that sales price (much less for the mass produced Cayenne which I understand costs no more than $26,000 made in Brataslava), that leaves $250mm for development. Seems a little thin (based on figures generally quoted for a new model) but possible. Since they had a sunk cost in the racer platform, they had a running start. Has Porsche published their development cost? AS

Nick

The fact that Porsche quoted an initial price of $350,000 and then raised it by a $100,000 should tell you all you need to know.

If Porsche is a company truly interested in valued customer relationships, given what has happened to CGT prices, it should extend the warranty on the CGT for another two years and an additional 20,000 miles. It is the least they should do for the owners and it would help stablize the price of the car.

PogueMoHone

Actually Nick, it's just a little different.

The original price was $375K and US quantity was 500 cars.

Now to the second part about Dealer/Porsche friction:

It was the Dealers through their greed that killed the car, they wouldn't take deposits from real customers, but created their own lists and provided their own deposits. This caused interested buyers to look elsewhere, made it look like inflated demand (and further increased the Dealer greed), and subsequently drove up the production numbers. The Dealers were telling Porsche that they had real buyers for the deposits. Example, when one dealer wouldn't take my deposit, and I went to try somewhere else, I was considered as two buyers.

With regard to the price increase, Porsche when they increased it from $375K to $448K, compounded the problem based upon false information, they should have know better. If they had stuck to 500 cars and the original price the car would have been a rip roaring success.

Nick

Colm if i recall Porsche only gave an estimated price and it was in the mid-300,000's. Additional they wanted a signed deposit contract from a customer before processing the order. When initially there was interest in the car, Porsche jacked the price up and relaxed their deposit requirements. This enabled the dealers to speculate but they were not told how many were to be built. Also, Porsche used incentives for the dealers to commit to allocations of the CGT.

Bottom line greed did both of them in. Porsche may have made money but its image has be tarnished not only with the public but many buyers. Dealers lost money and learned a hard lesson.

PogueMoHone

Nope,

Initially the estimated price was $375K, and the quantity was 500 for the US. Early on, relaxed deposits were OK, that's when the Dealers got cute and tried to manipulate the Factory and the Customers, by putting up their own money.

Then it went to signed deposit contracts, after the price increase and volume increase (dealer volume inspired! (and feared by Porsche!)), and non-refundable deposits entered the picture, further upping the ante for interested parties.

The Dealers, as a group, did it to themselves...and now they try to cry to anyone who will listen.

Oh, the heady days of the .bomb!

Les Quam

I agree with Colm dealers caused this problem if there is one?

I am not sure from a consumer standpoint if I am so unhappy that I was able to buy a new CGT at or below dealer cost?

After speaking to Ben and other CGT owners and going for a test drive in a CGT I knew I had to have one. It is probably the only new Porsche that I will be able to buy and subsequently be the original owner of at or below dealer cost?

Colm who was intially on the CGT buyer list was I think able to get his deposit back and if he intends to purchase a CGT on the secondary market will get it substantially below what he was going to originally pay for the same car. And I don't know if that's such a terrible problem? For driving enthusiasts the CGT will be an outstanding performance value as the CGT goes through it's depreciation cycle in the next few years.

For those who purchased early and paid MSRP the current value's are a concern if they intend to sell the car in the near future. However most every new car purchased brand new and sold in the next few years results in a substantial loss. However if the 1994 turbo S and 1997 Turbo S are a value guide within ten years the CGT will have recovered it's intial value.

So history and the very positive word of mouth being spread by people who actually own a CGT will I think be kind to the CGT. Being able to buy a 448K car with a few miles on it for about 325K is not so terrible for those prospective patient buyers in my humble opinion

PogueMoHone

If only I knew my own mind, I'm back and forth on this car like a yo-yo!

jay72

About what is dealer cost on CGT's?

Sloane

Rasta

That being said, I know of at least two '05 cars with sub-500 miles being sold for the upper 3's.

If you deal with the fact that an *** besides yours has touched the seat, this is the way I would go.

GT3 Nut

I know of a NEW 05 that sold for $360K - $365K. There was no deposit forfeited either. They really took a beating on that car. I wish I could have bought it.

jay72

How many are CGT's are dealers sitting with? There is a dealership here in S. Florida who has three of them and they are not moving much off of the price. They claim the "weaker" dealers are moving them at substantial discounts but they are in a financial position to hold them and get their price. I made them an offer in January of $380,000 and they turned it down and said the bottom is $440,000. I went to see them again and there position has not changed.

I would think that the longer they hold them the harder it will be to get top dollar for them as anybody in the market for a CGT would know that by now there are deals on them.

Jay
1979 930
1989 930S cab
2004 West Coast Chopper El Diablo II

W8MM

Why?

Once the supply of new Carrera GTs is narrowed to the dealers who won't discount, the only sales possible will be at MSRP.

If the buyers who hold out for discounts are not 100% of buyers, then they will hold out forever and not purchase a car.

The market can only absorb so many really expensive cars in a given period of time. As the days go by, new buyers trickle into the market and as the supply gradually goes down, the market comes into balance.

Feel lucky?

Well, do ya?