PDK Failure (2014 CS) after Guards LSD Install
#1
Track Day
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PDK Failure (2014 CS) after Guards LSD Install
The car has been tracked regularly (30 days - 12/year). It had the failure 1 session after I picked it up from the shop (picked up Friday and failed Sunday). The 1st session was great and the LSD completely transformed the car. It had an open diff not PTV. But as I was backing up for the 2nd session, there was no reverse. The dealer dropped the pan and found a seal from reverse in it. In other words I need a new gearbox.
I had the dealer service the PDK for the 1st time early this year and tracked it 4 times since. Had blackstone analyze the old fluid with flying colors. I purposely did this to make sure the gearbox is in good shape before the LSD install.
The car was in the shop for 3 weeks for 15 hours of labor??? (LSD and another PDK fluid service). They've done a couple LSD's on GT4's. So this is their first on a PDK. I think 1st time for PDK service too.
The $20k question now is what caused the failure:
1. PDK wear and tear
2. Guards LSD
3. Bad LSD Install
4. Bad PDK Fluid Service
I had the dealer service the PDK for the 1st time early this year and tracked it 4 times since. Had blackstone analyze the old fluid with flying colors. I purposely did this to make sure the gearbox is in good shape before the LSD install.
The car was in the shop for 3 weeks for 15 hours of labor??? (LSD and another PDK fluid service). They've done a couple LSD's on GT4's. So this is their first on a PDK. I think 1st time for PDK service too.
The $20k question now is what caused the failure:
1. PDK wear and tear
2. Guards LSD
3. Bad LSD Install
4. Bad PDK Fluid Service
#2
Race Car
Wow. I had the same thing happen with my Cayman R. First day with the Guard LSD - ran great and could feel the change from the LSD. Then I came off track and had no reverse. Needed a new PDK box.
I'm sure there are PDK cars with a Guard LSD with no issues, but it makes one wonder. And it's more like a $15k question. . .
I'm sure there are PDK cars with a Guard LSD with no issues, but it makes one wonder. And it's more like a $15k question. . .
#3
Nordschleife Master
In over 80 Pdk lsds this is the first we have ever heard of such a failure. I would be interested to hear how the lsd, in the front differential housing is causing a failure out in reverse on the gearstack. You don't even enter that part of the gearbox doing the install. It would be akin to dropping a valve on your engine right after you installed a deep sump on the pan. I will follow this thread hoping for more thoughts and the mechanical basis for the theory.
#5
Rennlist Member
Could heat be the culprit?
#6
Nordschleife Master
Heat is to blame for almost all Pdk failures I hear about. We always recommend an additional cooler on any car installing an lsd. It adds about 20-25 degrees F to already hot gearbox temps. We do see heat failures on many track cars without lsds as well.
#7
Rennlist Member
To say a guard LSD caused a failure I think is disingenuous. Adding any LSD to any transmission will create additional heat, and heat is the enemy of stuff.
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#8
Race Car
Mine had the additional Setrab cooler installed as well as the factory 3rd radiator. Was not a hot day when it failed.
Never said it was the cause, just temporally related.
It just happened to fail after two sessions the first track day after the LSD and diff cooler were added. Circumstantial evidence, not proof. I did get to see two 575 LT's crash into each other right in front of me, so the day wasn't a total waste!
Never said it was the cause, just temporally related.
It just happened to fail after two sessions the first track day after the LSD and diff cooler were added. Circumstantial evidence, not proof. I did get to see two 575 LT's crash into each other right in front of me, so the day wasn't a total waste!
Last edited by Dr.Bill; 06-22-2017 at 04:35 PM.
#10
I haddah Google dat
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Do manual transmissions with LSD require a cooler?
#11
Nordschleife Master
On the Cayman and Boxster absolutely. Its the midengine design. The oil goes out into the gearstack and the ring and pinion runs hot and dry. On some early Interseries cars without cooler they were reporting diff temps in excess of 250 F.
The pdks carry their own set of cooling issues, but again, the midengine ones have more heat problems than the Carerras. Both fail, with and without lsd, but caymans fail more.
The pdks carry their own set of cooling issues, but again, the midengine ones have more heat problems than the Carerras. Both fail, with and without lsd, but caymans fail more.
#12
Track Day
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This is what I was getting at. I know several of your LSD on PDK cayman cars but they all have additional coolers added and have been perfect. Of course these are mostly track focused cars. I think it's BGB that makes a really nice kit that is pretty unobtrusive.
To say a guard LSD caused a failure I think is disingenuous. Adding any LSD to any transmission will create additional heat, and heat is the enemy of stuff.
To say a guard LSD caused a failure I think is disingenuous. Adding any LSD to any transmission will create additional heat, and heat is the enemy of stuff.
The 1st and only session I was able to drive the car with the LSD was only driven at 80%. And I find it suspicious why the shop took 3 weeks to install it. I took it out the next day then kaboom.
#14
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QQ, does the gearbox fluid need to be replaced/serviced after installing the LSD? The shop did and the dealer said that if improperly done, it could cause air pockets and overheating.