I will let you know, Doug. Ironically, we're discussing the market in a couple of threads on the forum right now. Consensus is that it's tight. Not many cars out there right now.

Gary

Awesome stuff, Gary. You're getting me really hyped up to experience what the C2S has to offer! Now, to find one. I have my local PCA rep from Rusnak on the case, but inventory is very low right now. If you come across a clean, low mileage 997.1 C2S, please let me know.
Have a great holiday weekend.
Doug

Had to break this up to meet the length limit. I also experimented that second day, until a late "open session" as PCA calls them. That's when I ended up behind that prepared 930 Turbo, an older car but about as fast as an M3 I'd say offhand. I kept slowing at the skidpad, as I said, and letting him get a lead so I could have fun playing "hare and hounds" with a younger driver who actually did have a slower car. (You wont' believe how fast a C2S can be until you watch one.) I considered turning off PSM for that, not having had my "think about this" time yet, but I left it on and ended up asking a lot more than I had because I was damned if I was going to let him keep ahead of me for as much as half a lap. That's when I saw how well PSM responded to late braking and some other techniques we'll talk about.

Yes, I do leave it on. I was experimenting with PSM on and off that first day. Then I added my results to discussion with other owners who had recent models. Older forms of traction control (and probably the current ones from other mfrs) are nothing like PSM. This is more like the stuff we put on fighter aircraft, several of which could not fly -- literally crashed -- if their flight control computer crashed in a software sense. First one I remember was the F-16 and you never saw a whole squadron of engineers go into overdrive so fast.

Incidentally, meant to give you my e-mail address: simsgw@cs.stanford.edu, because these guest messages are so darned short by design.

Let me think about the question of whether you can learn the true art with all this stuff turned off. The answer isn't obvious. I need some consideration of that.

Gary

Interesting. PSM is far more sophisticated than I gave it credit. So you leave it engaged when track racing? My experience has been to turn all computer aids off to learn true car control, but perhaps the C2S brings it to the next level in partnering with the driver vs. attempting to shut you down.

I don't want to tempt anyone to a fatal sin on list, but just between us, the secret to driving a C2S very fast is remembering that it has computer monitoring of body roll, rotation around the vertical axis, steering input, throttle position, braking input, rate of change of all those, and probably a couple of sensors I've forgotten.

If you drive like you've gotten in over your head and you're sweating profusely, the stability management just finds a way to bail you out. If you start driving with controlled aggression, PSM responds in the same spirit: what we might call "let's get it on" mode. Unlike even a top racing driver, the PSM has independent control of each wheel and ample time (in computer terms) to take advantage of that to do whatever you ask of it, physics permitting.

More when we meet,

Gary