718 Boxter S, as fast as GT4 at Streets of Willow..
04-10-2017, 06:29 PM
#16
http://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/s...-10225323.html
Apologies for possibly taking this thread in a different direction BUT does the Ring track map in that article point to speed limits on the track being in effect when they ran the Spyder?
Apologies for possibly taking this thread in a different direction BUT does the Ring track map in that article point to speed limits on the track being in effect when they ran the Spyder?
04-11-2017, 07:08 AM
#17
Advanced
Yes. They had speed limits for a while after a fatal accident in 2015, removed after some track work in 2016.
Looks like that time was set in late 2015. Don't know if they Spyder would have hit any of those limits, they are quite high.
Looks like that time was set in late 2015. Don't know if they Spyder would have hit any of those limits, they are quite high.
04-15-2017, 05:05 PM
#18
Burning Brakes
Hmmm. I just got back from Buttonwillow (Speed District event) with my GT4. I didn't take a transponder but I did record a few laps and my best was 2:16 13CW.
Now keep in mind I had never been on the track before, and my car is absolutely stone stock. Aside from my lack of knowledge of the track, and my lack of driving skill I found that I never could find the right gear to be in on much of the back section of the track. Always seemed to be right between 2nd and 3rd.
As luck would have it Fresno Porsche had a 718S and a pro driver to take it around the track and give people rides. So I took a ride with her (Christina Nielson) and I recorded it. I did not get the entire lap but I was able to extrapolate her lap time to about 2:03.
What does it mean? Well, taking into account the vast difference between my driving skill and hers, I would say the cars are capable of relatively equal lap times in stock form.
My assessment of the 781S is that it felt softer but somehow seemed to have more grip. I could feel the tires flexing in the corners, and I could feel Christina using that to keep it right at it's limit. She was also able to find the perfect gear most of the time.
So aside from my one huge complaint I love the 718, but I still prefer my GT4.
The biggest, and I mean biggest problem with the 718 is the sound. I had read a lot about it sounding pretty pretty good. I can't disagree more. I spent a lot of time standing right by the pits watching GT4 after GT4 and various 911's take off from a standing start, and go by down the straight at full throttle. Every NA Porsche sounded fantastic taking off, and even better down the straight whether stock or with aftermarket exhaust,
The 718 barely growled off the line no matter how hard Christina got on it. It took off fast... just quietly... like a detuned Subaru. Coming down the straight it sounded like wind. Really no discernible engine noise at full chat. I am sure things can be done about that.
But the car is fast for sure. No doubt about that.
EDIT: Clarification. This was a 718 Cayman S. Just noticed this thread is about Boxster.
Now keep in mind I had never been on the track before, and my car is absolutely stone stock. Aside from my lack of knowledge of the track, and my lack of driving skill I found that I never could find the right gear to be in on much of the back section of the track. Always seemed to be right between 2nd and 3rd.
As luck would have it Fresno Porsche had a 718S and a pro driver to take it around the track and give people rides. So I took a ride with her (Christina Nielson) and I recorded it. I did not get the entire lap but I was able to extrapolate her lap time to about 2:03.
What does it mean? Well, taking into account the vast difference between my driving skill and hers, I would say the cars are capable of relatively equal lap times in stock form.
My assessment of the 781S is that it felt softer but somehow seemed to have more grip. I could feel the tires flexing in the corners, and I could feel Christina using that to keep it right at it's limit. She was also able to find the perfect gear most of the time.
So aside from my one huge complaint I love the 718, but I still prefer my GT4.
The biggest, and I mean biggest problem with the 718 is the sound. I had read a lot about it sounding pretty pretty good. I can't disagree more. I spent a lot of time standing right by the pits watching GT4 after GT4 and various 911's take off from a standing start, and go by down the straight at full throttle. Every NA Porsche sounded fantastic taking off, and even better down the straight whether stock or with aftermarket exhaust,
The 718 barely growled off the line no matter how hard Christina got on it. It took off fast... just quietly... like a detuned Subaru. Coming down the straight it sounded like wind. Really no discernible engine noise at full chat. I am sure things can be done about that.
But the car is fast for sure. No doubt about that.
EDIT: Clarification. This was a 718 Cayman S. Just noticed this thread is about Boxster.
04-16-2017, 09:09 AM
#19
Originally Posted by stout
For me, it's 991.2 C2S > 991.1 GTS.
I like sports cars as whole package, with FUN as the most important "metric." Some packages just click, and one that does is 991.2 Carrera. The fact it kept a flat six that revs but added two turbos and real torque with an elastic power curve unlike any 911 Turbo to date—one more like an NA engine's—plus a better MT and a chassis that feels roughly perfect makes it really compelling. The 718 gained a lot in performance and dynamic terms in the move to turbocharging, but the move to a flat four is an uphill battle when it comes to one of the most compelling reasons to buy a Porsche sports car over the last 20 years: Every one of them had a sonorous flat six. 991.1 GTS was a really nice car, and man did that 3.8-liter X51 engine SING, but I'd still take the 991.2. There is plenty of noise for me. YMMV, but sometimes I think the latest GT cars and even some 991.1 and 981 models are "showy loud" instead of offering nice sounds for the DRIVER to enjoy without assaulting others, a not-so-subtle balance shift away from some 986/987 and 996/997 models.
Some folks are anti-convertible, anti-turbo, anti-non-911, anti-911, etc. I just like fun cars, and cars that really "click." So, for me, it leads to some odd and unpredictable preferences (most of which are based on 1000-2500 miles in the cars in varied conditions) such as:
996.2 GT3 > 997.1 GT3
987 Spyder > 987 R
981 GT4 > 981 Spyder
997.2 RS 4.0 > 991.1 GT3/RS (for street)
997.1 GT2 > 997.2 GT2 RS (for street)
991.2 C2S > 991.1 GTS
981.1 GTS > 982 S
All of the above assumes all cars are factory. Start modding the cars to address or amplify traits and all bets are off. Nor is this to say that any of the Porsches noted above are anything less than amazing, and some examples are splitting hairs! Let's be clear: No modern Porsche is a Chevy Citation X-11. Very curious to try 991.2 GTS, but one thing I like a lot about the 991.2 Carrera/S is slimmer hips on a 911 that is pushing the boundaries of size for me.
Again, YMMV. Just my view from here.
I like sports cars as whole package, with FUN as the most important "metric." Some packages just click, and one that does is 991.2 Carrera. The fact it kept a flat six that revs but added two turbos and real torque with an elastic power curve unlike any 911 Turbo to date—one more like an NA engine's—plus a better MT and a chassis that feels roughly perfect makes it really compelling. The 718 gained a lot in performance and dynamic terms in the move to turbocharging, but the move to a flat four is an uphill battle when it comes to one of the most compelling reasons to buy a Porsche sports car over the last 20 years: Every one of them had a sonorous flat six. 991.1 GTS was a really nice car, and man did that 3.8-liter X51 engine SING, but I'd still take the 991.2. There is plenty of noise for me. YMMV, but sometimes I think the latest GT cars and even some 991.1 and 981 models are "showy loud" instead of offering nice sounds for the DRIVER to enjoy without assaulting others, a not-so-subtle balance shift away from some 986/987 and 996/997 models.
Some folks are anti-convertible, anti-turbo, anti-non-911, anti-911, etc. I just like fun cars, and cars that really "click." So, for me, it leads to some odd and unpredictable preferences (most of which are based on 1000-2500 miles in the cars in varied conditions) such as:
996.2 GT3 > 997.1 GT3
987 Spyder > 987 R
981 GT4 > 981 Spyder
997.2 RS 4.0 > 991.1 GT3/RS (for street)
997.1 GT2 > 997.2 GT2 RS (for street)
991.2 C2S > 991.1 GTS
981.1 GTS > 982 S
All of the above assumes all cars are factory. Start modding the cars to address or amplify traits and all bets are off. Nor is this to say that any of the Porsches noted above are anything less than amazing, and some examples are splitting hairs! Let's be clear: No modern Porsche is a Chevy Citation X-11. Very curious to try 991.2 GTS, but one thing I like a lot about the 991.2 Carrera/S is slimmer hips on a 911 that is pushing the boundaries of size for me.
Again, YMMV. Just my view from here.
Drove the 991.2 last year for extended time. Love the performance of the car. The only thing missing for me is the sound and the trip to high RPM.
That matters for me, it's a big part of the Sports car experience for me.
I have bone stock 997rs4.0 and 996rs sitting next to each other in my garage. 95% of the time I grab the keys for the 4.0. The 996rs is equally as fun to drive but lacks the sound.
04-16-2017, 09:51 AM
#20
Hmmm. I just got back from Buttonwillow (Speed District event) with my GT4. I didn't take a transponder but I did record a few laps and my best was 2:16 13CW.
Now keep in mind I had never been on the track before, and my car is absolutely stone stock. Aside from my lack of knowledge of the track, and my lack of driving skill I found that I never could find the right gear to be in on much of the back section of the track. Always seemed to be right between 2nd and 3rd.
As luck would have it Fresno Porsche had a 718S and a pro driver to take it around the track and give people rides. So I took a ride with her (Christina Nielson) and I recorded it. I did not get the entire lap but I was able to extrapolate her lap time to about 2:03.
What does it mean? Well, taking into account the vast difference between my driving skill and hers, I would say the cars are capable of relatively equal lap times in stock form.
My assessment of the 781S is that it felt softer but somehow seemed to have more grip. I could feel the tires flexing in the corners, and I could feel Christina using that to keep it right at it's limit. She was also able to find the perfect gear most of the time.
So aside from my one huge complaint I love the 718, but I still prefer my GT4.
The biggest, and I mean biggest problem with the 718 is the sound. I had read a lot about it sounding pretty pretty good. I can't disagree more. I spent a lot of time standing right by the pits watching GT4 after GT4 and various 911's take off from a standing start, and go by down the straight at full throttle. Every NA Porsche sounded fantastic taking off, and even better down the straight whether stock or with aftermarket exhaust,
The 718 barely growled off the line no matter how hard Christina got on it. It took off fast... just quietly... like a detuned Subaru. Coming down the straight it sounded like wind. Really no discernible engine noise at full chat. I am sure things can be done about that.
But the car is fast for sure. No doubt about that.
EDIT: Clarification. This was a 718 Cayman S. Just noticed this thread is about Boxster.
Now keep in mind I had never been on the track before, and my car is absolutely stone stock. Aside from my lack of knowledge of the track, and my lack of driving skill I found that I never could find the right gear to be in on much of the back section of the track. Always seemed to be right between 2nd and 3rd.
As luck would have it Fresno Porsche had a 718S and a pro driver to take it around the track and give people rides. So I took a ride with her (Christina Nielson) and I recorded it. I did not get the entire lap but I was able to extrapolate her lap time to about 2:03.
What does it mean? Well, taking into account the vast difference between my driving skill and hers, I would say the cars are capable of relatively equal lap times in stock form.
My assessment of the 781S is that it felt softer but somehow seemed to have more grip. I could feel the tires flexing in the corners, and I could feel Christina using that to keep it right at it's limit. She was also able to find the perfect gear most of the time.
So aside from my one huge complaint I love the 718, but I still prefer my GT4.
The biggest, and I mean biggest problem with the 718 is the sound. I had read a lot about it sounding pretty pretty good. I can't disagree more. I spent a lot of time standing right by the pits watching GT4 after GT4 and various 911's take off from a standing start, and go by down the straight at full throttle. Every NA Porsche sounded fantastic taking off, and even better down the straight whether stock or with aftermarket exhaust,
The 718 barely growled off the line no matter how hard Christina got on it. It took off fast... just quietly... like a detuned Subaru. Coming down the straight it sounded like wind. Really no discernible engine noise at full chat. I am sure things can be done about that.
But the car is fast for sure. No doubt about that.
EDIT: Clarification. This was a 718 Cayman S. Just noticed this thread is about Boxster.
I ran my first GT4 there and a 981CS i had and basically it was a third gear track. i mean no shifting tried to use second on sunset but it really wasn't any faster and added 2 shifts. . i think i was 210+ even though i knew the track. Trouble now i leave room for error because i make a lot of mistakes. i went out with a kid that had a stock GT4 that ran 155 on the edge,all in. next time you go let me know. Been a long time since our ride up the 33. carl
04-16-2017, 12:16 PM
#21
Burning Brakes
Good job for not knowing the track! 13cw can be tricky to get to know. The sweeper can be scary and phil hill has a tricky line. I ran the Exige S i had there and got down to a 206 few years ago the fast lotus guys were sub 2.
I ran my first GT4 there and a 981CS i had and basically it was a third gear track. i mean no shifting tried to use second on sunset but it really wasn't any faster and added 2 shifts. . i think i was 210+ even though i knew the track. Trouble now i leave room for error because i make a lot of mistakes. i went out with a kid that had a stock GT4 that ran 155 on the edge,all in. next time you go let me know. Been a long time since our ride up the 33. carl
I ran my first GT4 there and a 981CS i had and basically it was a third gear track. i mean no shifting tried to use second on sunset but it really wasn't any faster and added 2 shifts. . i think i was 210+ even though i knew the track. Trouble now i leave room for error because i make a lot of mistakes. i went out with a kid that had a stock GT4 that ran 155 on the edge,all in. next time you go let me know. Been a long time since our ride up the 33. carl
I was also just making a disaster out of Bus Stop (I think ti is Bus Stop). It is that corner on the back side that in the middle. I had been lifting and sort of just weaving through that. Then I passengered in the 718 with Christina and she came into Bus Stop floored, braked very hard, and then on the gas at the apex like any other corner rather than taking it like the last in a series of "esses" so I learned a lot there too.
I wil llet you know next tome. I am eager to go back and try and take a few seconds off that time for sure. There were a few GT4's there, both street and clubsports.
04-17-2017, 12:03 AM
#22
Rennlist Member
Agree with you on most counts,
Drove the 991.2 last year for extended time. Love the performance of the car. The only thing missing for me is the sound and the trip to high RPM.
That matters for me, it's a big part of the Sports car experience for me.
I have bone stock 997rs4.0 and 996rs sitting next to each other in my garage. 95% of the time I grab the keys for the 4.0. The 996rs is equally as fun to drive but lacks the sound.
Drove the 991.2 last year for extended time. Love the performance of the car. The only thing missing for me is the sound and the trip to high RPM.
That matters for me, it's a big part of the Sports car experience for me.
I have bone stock 997rs4.0 and 996rs sitting next to each other in my garage. 95% of the time I grab the keys for the 4.0. The 996rs is equally as fun to drive but lacks the sound.
Bless you for driving it...so sad to hear how many sit in garages now.
04-17-2017, 12:30 AM
#23
Rennlist Member
Hmmm. I just got back from Buttonwillow (Speed District event) with my GT4. I didn't take a transponder but I did record a few laps and my best was 2:16 13CW.
Always seemed to be right between 2nd and 3rd.
As luck would have it Fresno Porsche had a 718S and a pro driver to take it around the track and give people rides. So I took a ride with her (Christina Nielson) and I recorded it. I did not get the entire lap but I was able to extrapolate her lap time to about 2:03.
But the car is fast for sure. No doubt about that.
Always seemed to be right between 2nd and 3rd.
As luck would have it Fresno Porsche had a 718S and a pro driver to take it around the track and give people rides. So I took a ride with her (Christina Nielson) and I recorded it. I did not get the entire lap but I was able to extrapolate her lap time to about 2:03.
But the car is fast for sure. No doubt about that.
I ran my first GT4 there and a 981CS i had and basically it was a third gear track. i mean no shifting tried to use second on sunset but it really wasn't any faster and added 2 shifts. . i think i was 210+ even though i knew the track. Trouble now i leave room for error because i make a lot of mistakes. i went out with a kid that had a stock GT4 that ran 155 on the edge,all in. next time you go let me know. Been a long time since our ride up the 33. carl
Martin did a 154.8 in his GT4 on RE71 tires (and some basic suspension/setup mods). Our buddy in a club sport did a 150! She's a hell of a driver!
Buttonwillow is a mostly 3-4 track. I grab 2nd once, martin grabs is 2x. Manual cars are always a balance of shifts, being in the meat of the power band, etc.
I too rode with Christina in the 718 Cayman S. That car is VERY good. Missing some emotion, but very fast. She's a hell of a driver too.
04-17-2017, 10:05 AM
#24
I'm just a weekend hack, but here's a 158.
Martin did a 154.8 in his GT4 on RE71 tires (and some basic suspension/setup mods). Our buddy in a club sport did a 150! She's a hell of a driver!
Buttonwillow is a mostly 3-4 track. I grab 2nd once, martin grabs is 2x. Manual cars are always a balance of shifts, being in the meat of the power band, etc.
I too rode with Christina in the 718 Cayman S. That car is VERY good. Missing some emotion, but very fast. She's a hell of a driver too.
https://youtu.be/bZsbUiLg8hc
Martin did a 154.8 in his GT4 on RE71 tires (and some basic suspension/setup mods). Our buddy in a club sport did a 150! She's a hell of a driver!
Buttonwillow is a mostly 3-4 track. I grab 2nd once, martin grabs is 2x. Manual cars are always a balance of shifts, being in the meat of the power band, etc.
I too rode with Christina in the 718 Cayman S. That car is VERY good. Missing some emotion, but very fast. She's a hell of a driver too.
https://youtu.be/bZsbUiLg8hc
04-18-2017, 07:03 PM
#25
Basic Sponsor
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Hmmm. I just got back from Buttonwillow (Speed District event) with my GT4. I didn't take a transponder but I did record a few laps and my best was 2:16 13CW.
Now keep in mind I had never been on the track before, and my car is absolutely stone stock. Aside from my lack of knowledge of the track, and my lack of driving skill I found that I never could find the right gear to be in on much of the back section of the track. Always seemed to be right between 2nd and 3rd.
As luck would have it Fresno Porsche had a 718S and a pro driver to take it around the track and give people rides. So I took a ride with her (Christina Nielson) and I recorded it. I did not get the entire lap but I was able to extrapolate her lap time to about 2:03.
What does it mean? Well, taking into account the vast difference between my driving skill and hers, I would say the cars are capable of relatively equal lap times in stock form.
My assessment of the 781S is that it felt softer but somehow seemed to have more grip. I could feel the tires flexing in the corners, and I could feel Christina using that to keep it right at it's limit. She was also able to find the perfect gear most of the time.
So aside from my one huge complaint I love the 718, but I still prefer my GT4.
The biggest, and I mean biggest problem with the 718 is the sound. I had read a lot about it sounding pretty pretty good. I can't disagree more. I spent a lot of time standing right by the pits watching GT4 after GT4 and various 911's take off from a standing start, and go by down the straight at full throttle. Every NA Porsche sounded fantastic taking off, and even better down the straight whether stock or with aftermarket exhaust,
The 718 barely growled off the line no matter how hard Christina got on it. It took off fast... just quietly... like a detuned Subaru. Coming down the straight it sounded like wind. Really no discernible engine noise at full chat. I am sure things can be done about that.
But the car is fast for sure. No doubt about that.
EDIT: Clarification. This was a 718 Cayman S. Just noticed this thread is about Boxster.
Now keep in mind I had never been on the track before, and my car is absolutely stone stock. Aside from my lack of knowledge of the track, and my lack of driving skill I found that I never could find the right gear to be in on much of the back section of the track. Always seemed to be right between 2nd and 3rd.
As luck would have it Fresno Porsche had a 718S and a pro driver to take it around the track and give people rides. So I took a ride with her (Christina Nielson) and I recorded it. I did not get the entire lap but I was able to extrapolate her lap time to about 2:03.
What does it mean? Well, taking into account the vast difference between my driving skill and hers, I would say the cars are capable of relatively equal lap times in stock form.
My assessment of the 781S is that it felt softer but somehow seemed to have more grip. I could feel the tires flexing in the corners, and I could feel Christina using that to keep it right at it's limit. She was also able to find the perfect gear most of the time.
So aside from my one huge complaint I love the 718, but I still prefer my GT4.
The biggest, and I mean biggest problem with the 718 is the sound. I had read a lot about it sounding pretty pretty good. I can't disagree more. I spent a lot of time standing right by the pits watching GT4 after GT4 and various 911's take off from a standing start, and go by down the straight at full throttle. Every NA Porsche sounded fantastic taking off, and even better down the straight whether stock or with aftermarket exhaust,
The 718 barely growled off the line no matter how hard Christina got on it. It took off fast... just quietly... like a detuned Subaru. Coming down the straight it sounded like wind. Really no discernible engine noise at full chat. I am sure things can be done about that.
But the car is fast for sure. No doubt about that.
EDIT: Clarification. This was a 718 Cayman S. Just noticed this thread is about Boxster.
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__________________
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John@Fabspeed.com
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Porsche Performance Specialist
John@Fabspeed.com
215-618-9796
Fabspeed Motorsport USA
155 Commerce Drive Fort Washington, PA 19034
www.Fabspeed.com
04-20-2017, 12:16 AM
#27
Yeesh don't get me started on Subarus.
"See STi's are for King Lear br0s who have reigned so long on the alpha throne that their minds have dissolved into one perpetual, victory-brewing fist pump. They're neutral drifting out of the student parking lot EVERYDAY with their MOUTHS OPEN, tossing the word '***' around like it's 1995. They took life drawing class until a 60 year old townie showed up as the model and STi br0 excused himself to the bathroom and never came back for the rest of the semester" - RCR
"See STi's are for King Lear br0s who have reigned so long on the alpha throne that their minds have dissolved into one perpetual, victory-brewing fist pump. They're neutral drifting out of the student parking lot EVERYDAY with their MOUTHS OPEN, tossing the word '***' around like it's 1995. They took life drawing class until a 60 year old townie showed up as the model and STi br0 excused himself to the bathroom and never came back for the rest of the semester" - RCR
04-20-2017, 04:40 PM
#30
No it wasn't. The new powerkit GTS just beat the GT3, but I've never seen a C2S time faster than the 7:25 posted by the .1 GT3. Where did you see such a time posted?