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Stock, for straight line cruising stuff on wide open roads, the Camaro is great!
Stupid trunk access issues aside.
Fun, loud, everything it is supposed to be.
Just not for corners or agility.
I've spent 1000s of km in each, and each does a different job well...
I have over 20 de days in both. GT4 higher quality and better for overall use. For primary track day car would take ZL1 1LE any day - significantly faster - well driven Gt3 fast - consumables are much less expensive across the board - full set of brake pads $300 etc, track insurance is half as much, no need for any aftermarket parts, just align, change brake fluid and you are ready to go although you may find yourself quickly adding safety equipment given on track speeds. Also was more confident to push the car because it wasn’t $100k car. Only downside is very thirsty on track. In my experience car is bulletproof, just fluid changes and tires and this seems consistent with several other owners I have spoken to. Good luck with your decision.
I wonder about tire and brake consumption? Those two are my biggest expense right now.....not considering the ZL1 but would like to know.
Forget about a grand sport (no disrespect to poster above) - 1LE is superior platform in every way, except weight, but regardless will destroy a GS on the track.
I test drove all the american comparables before buying my GT3. I have to say the Camaros are pretty fantastic, and I was somewhat impressed with the vettes, however: When driving the Corvette it's painfully obvious that it's a plastic body on frame car with no roof. If the negatives of that don't bother you when driving then it maybe an ok car for someone, but I can't stand the lack of body rigidity. I like the looks and visibility on the Corvette better, but at the end of the day I had to stay with Porsche.
I traded my c7 z06 vette in on the gt4 considering the poularity of the c8 will certainly tank values for all c7 and probably c6 zr1. And at $60k starting price i bet a bunch of camaro zl1 1le's will be coming in to teade for a c8 and tank the value on those cars as well. Holding Value wise the gt4 is an easy win.
All that said the c7 and camaro zl1 1le are absolute track weapons and the c8 will be a force to recon with especially when the z06 version comes out.
I’ve owned a cayman (S not GT4) and a ZL1. Currently cross shopping .1 GT3 (2015+) v ZL1 1LE primarily for track use.
A few pertinent points.
The ZL1 is warrantied by GM for track use. The Porsche NA website explicitly excludes track use. Had a long conversation with my dealer about this and was not reassured.
There are many positive comments about Porsche track reliability, but there have been a number of issues tbf... leaking shocks, strut tower failures, manual trans, cyl scoring, D-chunck failures etc. My gut says you can probably track both and never have a major issue, but to argue the ZL1 is more likely to fail on track simply is not true. Moreover, the key point is that if you do suffer a mechanical on track the ZL1 is infinitely cheaper to repair (assuming you modded your car and voided the GM factory warranty).
Also, with respect to handling, the ZL1 is excellent out of the box. Extremely neutral balance. Both cars stock, the balance of the ZL1 is better. The reason the car spins the rear tires (and/or oversteers) off apex has little to do with engine placement and much more to do with 650 ft-lbs. If you prefer less need for throttle modulation, cool! I enjoy both approaches tbh. But moving the LT4 to the location currently occupied by the rear seats would not be enough to avoid wheel spin under later loading with high trq demand i.e. throttle position.
I’ve owned a cayman (S not GT4) and a ZL1. Currently cross shopping .1 GT3 (2015+) v ZL1 1LE primarily for track use.
A few pertinent points.
The ZL1 is warrantied by GM for track use. The Porsche NA website explicitly excludes track use. Had a long conversation with my dealer about this and was not reassured.
There are many positive comments about Porsche track reliability, but there have been a number of issues tbf... leaking shocks, strut tower failures, manual trans, cyl scoring, D-chunck failures etc. My gut says you can probably track both and never have a major issue, but to argue the ZL1 is more likely to fail on track simply is not true. Moreover, the key point is that if you do suffer a mechanical on track the ZL1 is infinitely cheaper to repair (assuming you modded your car and voided the GM factory warranty).
Also, with respect to handling, the ZL1 is excellent out of the box. Extremely neutral balance. Both cars stock, the balance of the ZL1 is better. The reason the car spins the rear tires (and/or oversteers) off apex has little to do with engine placement and much more to do with 650 ft-lbs. If you prefer less need for throttle modulation, cool! I enjoy both approaches tbh. But moving the LT4 to the location currently occupied by the rear seats would not be enough to avoid wheel spin under later loading with high trq demand i.e. throttle position.
Both good cars, both good choices.
If it's a GT model they do cover as long as it's not "abuse"....you do get a separate "Circuit Driving Manual" with recommendations...By Abuse I mean like instead of going into forth gear sliding into 2nd gear (money shift) or off track excursions, etc, etc.
I know several early 991.1 GT3 owners that had the infamous engine problem at the track and the engine was replaced, no questions asked and they knew it happened at the track...but in general I have seen very few modern Porsche failures at the track.
As an engineer, i just want to clarify that of two cars with the same gear ratio, the car with more weight on the rear tires will transfer more torque to the ground. It's a bit irrelevant what the max torque measures on a dyno. This is true even if you measure torque at the flywheel or the roadwheel. That's what kills me about today's cars. You are only using about 2 or 3 hundred foot pounds at the flywheel on street tires when you are in first gear. That's because 2 or 3 hundred foot pound is all it takes to break the tires loose, depending on which gear is selected. Traction control holds back the rest. You are not going to beat my stupid 92 corvette 0-20 mph if you are on street tires unless you have weight transfer to the rear tires or awd. A light rear end is an incurable defect. Unless you are a drag racer and you know how to transfer weight to the rear tires.
I was shopping for a GT4, but ended up picking up a ZLE this week to (possibly) replace my aging M3 track car. I contacted a few GT4 sellers on RL, but never got a response so I moved on. So far, I’m impressed. The 1LE version is the real deal when it comes to a track toy. It’s certainly not ideal on the street, with ride quality approaching that of my M3. There are YouTube videos of owners turning sub 2:00 at VIR and around 1:30 at Road Atlanta right off the showroom floor. It may only be a short term affair, and I may end up with a 718 GT4 by this time next year, but it it will definitely be an experience to get this thing on track. After watching the Chevy video of the ‘Ring lap, I’m pretty much convinced it is way more car than I am driver.
I was shopping for a GT4, but ended up picking up a ZLE this week to (possibly) replace my aging M3 track car. I contacted a few GT4 sellers on RL, but never got a response so I moved on. So far, I’m impressed. The 1LE version is the real deal when it comes to a track toy. It’s certainly not ideal on the street, with ride quality approaching that of my M3. There are YouTube videos of owners turning sub 2:00 at VIR and around 1:30 at Road Atlanta right off the showroom floor. It may only be a short term affair, and I may end up with a 718 GT4 by this time next year, but it it will definitely be an experience to get this thing on track. After watching the Chevy video of the ‘Ring lap, I’m pretty much convinced it is way more car than I am driver.
Congrats! Breaking 1:30 at Road Atlanta in a street car is no easy feat. How many of those laps can it do before something gives?
Congrats! Breaking 1:30 at Road Atlanta in a street car is no easy feat. How many of those laps can it do before something gives?
From everything I’ve read, as many as you can stand. My experience may prove otherwise, but I’ve been studying the forums, and have seen no real weaknesses other than the challenge of keeping fuel in it. The cooling issues that continue to plague the C7 seem to have been exorcised.
From everything I’ve read, as many as you can stand. My experience may prove otherwise, but I’ve been studying the forums, and have seen no real weaknesses other than the challenge of keeping fuel in it. The cooling issues that continue to plague the C7 seem to have been exorcised.
a couple of local ZLEs continue to terrorize at VIR for the last couple years. Haven’t seen them have any issues at all other then melting tires.
Sorry for reviving this old thread... again. I own a zl1 as well. I happily traded in a late model ss and a vette z51 stingray in on it. The zl1 has the lunacy of the ss and the refinement of the vette. Its a fantastic car, and anyone bashing it, definitely hasn't driven one. This is NOT the previous Camaro (which was turd), its an entirely new car and a truly a great sports car. It'll best the 911 in most ways, including the interior and electronics IMO.
Sorry for reviving this old thread... again. I own a zl1 as well. I happily traded in a late model ss and a vette z51 stingray in on it. The zl1 has the lunacy of the ss and the refinement of the vette. Its a fantastic car, and anyone bashing it, definitely hasn't driven one. This is NOT the previous Camaro (which was turd), its an entirely new car and a truly a great sports car. It'll best the 911 in most ways, including the interior and electronics IMO.
I'm going to bash it right here. It depends on what 911 your going to compare it to for interior wise. The porsche interior is far superior. If you compare this car to a like vehicle probably a GT3 or a Carrera S Those interiors are far superior with quality of components and fitment. I am not say that the ZL1 isn't nice because it is, but the german world of cars have a far superior quality of interior. I will say this without having seen a new C8 top trim, that the Camaro ZL1 has the best interior of any Chevy car out there.
05-23-2019, 07:16 AM
