MWP

I've always been a car enthousiast in the most broad sense: owning a sportscar is nice, driving it full blast is better. I enjoy my Porsches on a daily basis, mainly on the road, sometimes on track, totalling in about 40.000 combustion-engine 'Porschemiles'/year.
But here's the paradox: at the same time, I went to great lengths to make my house CO2-neutral and I prefer to invest in 'sustainable' businesses. I try to raise my children to be respectful for mother nature...

I don't feel guilty because I'm owning Porsches (they give me too much fun), but the least you can say is that my behaviour is inconsistent. I wonder whether there are other people puzzled by the same paradox? Or is it a non-issue on Rennlist?

As I am expanding my humble fleet with a 993TT this week, I decided to offset the carbon footprint of my fleet (using the CO2logic.com tool). I guess it will give me a bit of peace of mind. WDYT?

IainM

It’s an important consideration for sure. However, I’m not convinced a simple ride A vs ride B comparison is valid. As an engineer I’ve been trained to understand the full system which includes manufacture and final disposal.

having said that, I would be interested in any data you have researched. When I look at the smog test data for my car I see it is an almost perfect conversion of hydrocarbons to carbon dioxide with an output CO2 of 15%, complete combustion. The desire for power output drives combustion efficiency and Porsche engineers are very good at this.

how do you judge the carbon footprint of a 15mile commute in a 993? Is a 100mile romp through the backwoods proportionately worse?

complex question.

MWP

You are absolutely right. It is a complex matter, especially if you want to have a 100% accurate calculation of the actual carbon footprint of one's fleet. Almost impossible to calculate, so in the end, you risk of not even trying it.

Therefore, I'd prefer to simplify it, by taking some general assumptions like annual mileage, average fuel consumption and calculate the average CO2 emission based on publicly available calculators. The result will be biased (eg. because Porsches burn their fuel more efficient), but at least you have a starting point to know how many 'emission rights' you should purchase to offset your theoretic CO2 emission.

So far for usage based carbon footprint. When it comes to 'lifecycle' carbon footprint, I guess we're all doing the right thing, keeping our 25 year old machines up and running. Circular economy at its best!

Railmaster.

No! My 993 is my only car and I drive it less than 500 miles a year.

pp000830

Personally I see carbon off-sets for automotive use as a silly idea. As soon as cars began to be equipped with oxygen sensors & catalytic converters, in my mind, automotive pollution had been laid to rest from a parts-per-million standpoint. My view is the world is filled with Carbon-based life forms and CO2 is not a pollutant and throughout modern history there have been massive natural emissions such as those from volcanic eruptions that dwarf the cumulative effect of automotive technology over the last 100 years and to the environmentalists' surprise life goes on, so to speak. In the last 15 years or so the public debate on the subject has become completely politicized and disingenuous as governments' have shown the willingness to throw Billions at what has become the Environmental Industry and real science has left the building. Some of these government-sponsored environmental initiatives are done at a staggering expense to citizens, for example in Germany and take on a scale that they almost look like national economic suicide. if you had it the way some environmentalists want you to one should feel guilty for even breathing. Personally I won't go for that pill when bated to take it:
Andy

tstafford

I vote that the mods move this thread out of the 993 forum and in to the politics/off-topic/debate area.

MWP

My intention of this thread is not to convert people into environmentalists, even less to say we should feel guilty. The environmentalists who play the blamegame will generate the opposite effect they are aiming for: people will feel attacked, and will not change behaviour at all.

Whether you like it or not, climate change is an issue (either a real, scientifically proven issue for some, or a 'politicised' issue for others) and it will affect our hobby. The three largest cities in my home country have already banned 993's from their roads. I see big car collectors starting to sell off their collections because they think prices will go south because of stringent emission regulations, etc.... We cannot neglect the impact of emission regulation on our hobby.

As for moving the thread elsewhere, I do not object. I started off here because the purchase of a 993TT made me reflect on carbon footprint. The funny coincidence is that we all cherish 993's partly because they were the last air-cooled Porsches. But, if I'm not mistaken, its in a large extent due to emission regulations that Porsche had to switch to water-cooled engines. So previous emission rules did bring in some ways bring extra value to our cars....

HalfGerman

I never understood why they don't FIRST go after low hanging fruit, Maritime shipping, from what I understand is largely unregulated. Supertankers, burning bunker fuel (waste oil, left over after refining process). Read somewhere that something like 8 to 12 supertankers produce more pollution than all the cars in the world.. In Belgium, Euronav in 2017 bought a US company and created a large supertanker group. Does Belgium pressure that company for improvements?

I bought my 993 used, so I recycled. I am in the process of keeping it running right, so it will pollute the least amount possible.

MWP

Very good point. Maritime transport is extremely polluting. They seem to benefit from the fact they can easily flag out their ships to countries with low emission regulation pressure.

Euronav happens to be majority-owned by a family who is quite conscious on environmental impact. They just made this announcement on being CO2 neutral in 2020 and full CO2 free by 2050, without any pressure from the Belgian government. See http://www.cmb.be/en/new/cmbs-co (CMB is owned by same family as Euronav)

There will always be more polluting things compared to our cars, and in an ideal world, governments should focus on those. Cars & car ownership have always been the sitting duck when it comes to taxation & regulation. Nevertheless, you could argue that only if you have have taken care of your own carbon footprint, you are entitled to comment others...

mike cap

I second this request.

Mark in Baltimore

Moving this to General Porsche Discussions, but if it goes off the rails into politics, it will be moved to Off Topic/P&C (or possibly Abyssed).

cgfen

I've been commuting to work by bicycle for decades and have plenty of carbon credits.
enjoy the new turbo

MWP

that's the spirit!