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Hello all,
Question if anyone knows? Why is the base price of the Panamera in most cases 10,000 more then the equivalent Cayenne? I'm referring to before options.
Just thought it was interesting as to why that was they use same engines and in similar interiors etc?
Thanks.
Hello all,
Question if anyone knows? Why is the base price of the Panamera in most cases 10,000 more then the equivalent Cayenne? I'm referring to before options.
Just thought it was interesting as to why that was they use same engines and in similar interiors etc?
Thanks.
PDK? Halo car? (non-911 division)
Note that if you happen to prefer the Panamera, existing 2018s on the lot can be had for major discounts though I suppose the same could be said of Cayennes.
Note that if you happen to prefer the Panamera, existing 2018s on the lot can be had for major discounts though I suppose the same could be said of Cayennes.
True, but 2018 Cayennes are a model generation older than 2019s. However, I think you're right that, generally, Pannys are discounted a lot more than Cayennes if all else is equal.
Cayennes are a much better deal than a comparatively specked Panny. I think the delta is actually more than the 10k the OP states.
True, but 2018 Cayennes are a model generation older than 2019s. However, I think you're right that, generally, Pannys are discounted a lot more than Cayennes if all else is equal.
Cayennes are a much better deal than a comparatively specked Panny. I think the delta is actually more than the 10k the OP states.
I think you're right in general. But in my case, I was going to order a 2019 Cayenne Turbo with a +/- $145k build, but found a new 2018 PTT Sport Turismo with a $182k MSRP, spec'd almost exactly as I would've ordered, offered to me for $152k, plus the dealer ate $12-13k in negative equity on my trade, and $2500 in round trip transport for our vehicles, and I saved sales tax on $55k worth of vehicle (the value of my trade in, a lease on which the dealer paid sales tax in the buy-out). I couldn't find any dealer to do anything remotely approximating that for a 2019 Cayenne (and I had a broker help me look).
I really like the new Cayenne, but I'm totally in love with the Panamera Sport Turismo.
My answer re: OP's question is that the Panamera's pricing is positioned where the marketing department wants it slotted. The Cayenne still is and always has been a less expensive vehicle than the Panamera. However, since the Macan was released, Cayenne pricing has crept upward steadily, even though it may be less costly to build nowadays. (It shares a platform with the Q7 / Q8 / Urus / Bentayga and God knows what else. Economy of scale and all that.) But I don't think the company has ever been a big proponent of passing down cost savings to customers. It just means one of the most profitable volume car manufacturers in the world pulls in an even more unconscionable windfall per car on the 2019 Cayenne versus the 2018 Cayenne. Hey, nobody is forcing us to pay their asking price, right? If you don't want to hand it over, the Honda dealer is right down the street...
My wife and I did the same thing, spec'ing out nearly identical Cayenne Turbo / Panamera Turbo builds. They were always $15K apart. We went with the "value" proposition. What a bargain!
Originally Posted by pokingaround
I think you're right in general. But in my case, I was going to order a 2019 Cayenne Turbo with a +/- $145k build, but found a new 2018 PTT Sport Turismo with a $182k MSRP, spec'd almost exactly as I would've ordered, offered to me for $152k, plus the dealer ate $12-13k in negative equity on my trade, and $2500 in round trip transport for our vehicles, and I saved sales tax on $55k worth of vehicle (the value of my trade in, a lease on which the dealer paid sales tax in the buy-out). I couldn't find any dealer to do anything remotely approximating that for a 2019 Cayenne (and I had a broker help me look).
Funny you say that. When we were picking up our Turbo, our SA turned to me at one point while my wife was engaged with the sales manager. He asked me, "Do you know anybody who would be interested in a Sport Turismo?" I gave him a puzzled look and asked why he was posing this question to me.
"We can't give them away. Nobody wants them. They hate the styling. We've got several that are just sitting there collecting dust," he replied. "I thought maybe you might have some friends or business acquaintances..."
I was floored. I had no idea. I personally love the styling. Then I got to thinking about how I couldn't convince my wife to consider an AMG E63S Wagon even though I thought it was the most awesome damned thing ever created. "Looks like a hearse," she'd tell me.
I told her about the ST conversation after we got home. "You mean that wagon-looking one? Oh no. Those are godawful," she told me, then pranced over to her new Cayenne in the garage like it was as sexy a thing as a 1962 E-Type.
As I've posted elsewhere, taste is quite subjective.
For what it's worth, I think the styling of the new Cayenne is okay when hunkered down in Sport Plus mode on 21" or larger wheels. Sitting in Normal mode, or on steel springs, with 20" or smaller wheels it looks a little tippy and nerdy, and by association should drive like a Geo Tracker. (Note: It doesn't. Said it before and I'll say it again -- the base Cayenne rolls spectacularly!) See our latest service loaner (don't ask) below relative to our Turbo, which we only see occasionally as it finds its way out of the hospital. The Cayenne will not go down in the pantheon of fine automotive design. Neither will the Panamera, ST or otherwise. I guess the reason the cool ST moulders on dealer lots while Cayennes and Macans fly off the second they land is because we fat Americans are infatuated with SUVs and DESPISE station wagons. I never have quite understood it. I have never purchased an SUV for me. But my wife (NOT a fat American; just a regular one)... she loves 'em -- and rolls her eyes at every wagon that comes into her field of vision.
FWIW, were it my choice I'd have gone after your sort of fugly ST, taken the big discount and twisted even more until blood ran out of our dealer's ears, signed the deal, and enjoyed the lower center of gravity and better handling that goes with it. I'd also close my eyes to what the resale might be. Based on what I've seen from two- and three-year-old E63S Wagons, prepare to lose your butt. Hey, it's only money. Unless you're buying a GT-class Porsche, as a general rule you're gonna flush a lot of money down the Porsche toilet (optional feature: seat and flush handle in High Gloss Black, $520) in depreciation anyway.
I told her about the ST conversation after we got home. "You mean that wagon-looking one? Oh no.
Love the ST as well. They had an Agate 4S with Turbo wheels on it sitting in the forecourt of the mall. I was drooling on it.
What disappointed me, and I consider a major fukup on Porsche’s part. - the rear cargo area. It’s really too small to put a normal sized dog in (Lab etc.). There’s also a massive lip on the edge of the rear hatch. What sort of Porsche designer, engineers a Shooting Brake or wagon, and you can’t put a German Shepherd in it ? It’s very non German. Maybe it’s still the war ? Don’t mention the war
Funny you say that. When we were picking up our Turbo, our SA turned to me at one point while my wife was engaged with the sales manager. He asked me, "Do you know anybody who would be interested in a Sport Turismo?" I gave him a puzzled look and asked why he was posing this question to me.
"We can't give them away. Nobody wants them. They hate the styling. We've got several that are just sitting there collecting dust," he replied. "I thought maybe you might have some friends or business acquaintances..."
I was floored. I had no idea. I personally love the styling. Then I got to thinking about how I couldn't convince my wife to consider an AMG E63S Wagon even though I thought it was the most awesome damned thing ever created. "Looks like a hearse," she'd tell me.
I told her about the ST conversation after we got home. "You mean that wagon-looking one? Oh no. Those are godawful," she told me, then pranced over to her new Cayenne in the garage like it was as sexy a thing as a 1962 E-Type.
As I've posted elsewhere, taste is quite subjective.
For what it's worth, I think the styling of the new Cayenne is okay when hunkered down in Sport Plus mode on 21" or larger wheels. Sitting in Normal mode, or on steel springs, with 20" or smaller wheels it looks a little tippy and nerdy, and by association should drive like a Geo Tracker. (Note: It doesn't. Said it before and I'll say it again -- the base Cayenne rolls spectacularly!) See our latest service loaner (don't ask) below relative to our Turbo, which we only see occasionally as it finds its way out of the hospital. The Cayenne will not go down in the pantheon of fine automotive design. Neither will the Panamera, ST or otherwise. I guess the reason the cool ST moulders on dealer lots while Cayennes and Macans fly off the second they land is because we fat Americans are infatuated with SUVs and DESPISE station wagons. I never have quite understood it. I have never purchased an SUV for me. But my wife (NOT a fat American; just a regular one)... she loves 'em -- and rolls her eyes at every wagon that comes into her field of vision.
FWIW, were it my choice I'd have gone after your sort of fugly ST, taken the big discount and twisted even more until blood ran out of our dealer's ears, signed the deal, and enjoyed the lower center of gravity and better handling that goes with it. I'd also close my eyes to what the resale might be. Based on what I've seen from two- and three-year-old E63S Wagons, prepare to lose your butt. Hey, it's only money. Unless you're buying a GT-class Porsche, as a general rule you're gonna flush a lot of money down the Porsche toilet (optional feature: seat and flush handle in High Gloss Black, $520) in depreciation anyway.
Yeah I think this whole exercise has shown that the only thing Americans want less than a $125k station wagon (AMG E63S) is a $180k station wagon LOL! But an SUV that price? America: "TAKE MY MONEY!" America is a funny place.Me? I prefer the driving experience in a car, even at the expense of some utility - which there's no doubt that the Cayenne provides in spades as compared to the ST. I do think people are willing to stretch budgets on SUVs because you (literally) get so much more vehicle for your $ than you do in a car. Certainly not a tide I'm able to fight beyond voting with my own dollars as I did. I agree too btw that the Cayenne needs at least 21" wheels - 22" even better - to look good to my eyes. Ride quality be damned...
As for my deal, yes I was more than happy to let the dealer take the first year+ of depreciation. All together I feel like ~$49k from combined discounts, eating negative equity, sales tax savings, and round trip transport was more than fair. About 27% off the ST = I'm very happy. And I didn't even mention the $5k penalty I would've hit at lease turn-in for going over in miles!
Originally Posted by Benedict14
Love the ST as well. They had an Agate 4S with Turbo wheels on it sitting in the forecourt of the mall. I was drooling on it.
What disappointed me, and I consider a major fukup on Porsche’s part. - the rear cargo area. It’s really too small to put a normal sized dog in (Lab etc.). There’s also a massive lip on the edge of the rear hatch. What sort of Porsche designer, engineers a Shooting Brake or wagon, and you can’t put a German Shepherd in it ? It’s very non German. Maybe it’s still the war ? Don’t mention the war
My 45 pound Aussie has "mad hops" as the kids say, so she can get in and out of the back of a ST without issue. I also have a Weathertech liner with a mat that rolls out over the edge as needed to help protect the car. She happily gets in and out of my wife's LR Discovery and that thing is TALL. BTW my ST is Agate Gray...
EDIT: to add that I think you may be thinking of the 'regular' Panamera in terms of the lip around the trunk. The Sport Turismo hatch comes down basically to the cargo floor.
Last edited by pokingaround; 02-27-2019 at 12:56 PM.
What sort of Porsche designer, engineers a Shooting Brake or wagon, and you can’t put a German Shepherd in it ? It’s very non German. Maybe it’s still the war ? Don’t mention the war
Now that's damned funny!
Pokingaround, I'd love to see some pics of your ST. It sounds pretty awesome.
Pokingaround, I'd love to see some pics of your ST. It sounds pretty awesome.
Thanks! Arriving tomorrow, though snow coming down may slow delivery until Friday grrr.
Had the dog at a dealership a while back to make sure she could make the leap, but now that I see her in/out of the Discovery...not remotely an issue Here are pix from the dealer:
Thanks much! I was very, very happy to find one configured nearly exactly the way I would've ordered one.
what's the exterior color? Love it.
I also love panamera st. If my wife doesn't force me to drive an suv as well, I'd definitely get a panamera st ehybrid. I think only Americans hate wagons for some reason.
panamera will always price higher from porsche because its direct competitors are 7series, s class and A8 while cayenne's direct competitors are x5, gle and q7.
I also love panamera st. If my wife doesn't force me to drive an suv as well, I'd definitely get a panamera st ehybrid. I think only Americans hate wagons for some reason.
panamera will always price higher from porsche because its direct competitors are 7series, s class and A8 while cayenne's direct competitors are x5, gle and q7.
Thanks! It’s Agate Gray which was offered in 2018 but not 2019. And agreed - it’s a 7/8/S type competitor and priced to match/exceed those flagships.
I love wagons but my jaw drops and I drive around the block when I see a Sport T. How could anybody not be floored by these things... Here is one with my E63 and the ST makes it look positively pedestrian!
I love wagons but my jaw drops and I drive around the block when I see a Sport T. How could anybody not be floored by these things... Here is one with my E63 and the ST makes it look positively pedestrian!
Wow that's some photo! I wouldn't say 'pedestrian' at all about the AMG - though certainly (relatively) understated and stealthy as compared to the ST. To me the E63S Wagon is the ultimate Q-ship, an 'in the know' type car for people who love cars. You may not get as many "Hey man what's that?!" type looks/approaches as in the Porsche, but those who approach you will be car nuts, already in awe of what you're driving! And the sound...don't even get me started!
I came extremely close to pulling the trigger on the AMG because it's such a superior value (IMO) as compared to the Porsche. For $125K MSRP you get a very well equipped, top of the line E63, which in many ways (both engine power and utility) outperforms the Porsche Turbo, whereas that same $125k only gets you a well optioned 'entry level' 4 ST, or a lightly (for Porsche...) optioned 4S ST. The AMG is truly an amazing car. Funny though - I ruffled some feathers over on the MBWorld forums for simply *mentioning* - in a thread about the virtues of wagons - that I had chosen the ST.
02-26-2019, 10:01 AM
Panamera Price vs Cayenne ?
Now that's damned funny!
Here are pix from the dealer:
