Cayenne Crusher - FX45
02-08-2003, 06:28 PM
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I went and checked out the FX yesterday at the local dealer. I gotta say, the styling was not the best IMO. The car has the "overstyled" look that the japanese love so well. Kinda cartoonish or like a characiture. The toothy grill kinda reminded me of a 50's buick.
Every panel except for the roof, had some kind of exaggerated feature. That's part of the trouble with Japanese cars IMO, they are either styled way to blandly, or the offer some radical styling, that turns funny looking before the last payment is made.
I predicted heavy discounting, and/or incentives, and just yesterday, a couple of guys here were bragging about the great deals they got, in CA, no less.
Im sure the Fx's will find homes, just like the thousands of I30's, and G20's before it, but there is nothing memorable or lasting in this package. IMO
Every panel except for the roof, had some kind of exaggerated feature. That's part of the trouble with Japanese cars IMO, they are either styled way to blandly, or the offer some radical styling, that turns funny looking before the last payment is made.
I predicted heavy discounting, and/or incentives, and just yesterday, a couple of guys here were bragging about the great deals they got, in CA, no less.
Im sure the Fx's will find homes, just like the thousands of I30's, and G20's before it, but there is nothing memorable or lasting in this package. IMO
02-09-2003, 05:56 PM
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Originally posted by Ken2KS:
<strong>Silverbullet951, you do know that the Murano and the FX are completely different platforms right?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Your point being?
<strong>Silverbullet951, you do know that the Murano and the FX are completely different platforms right?</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Your point being?
02-10-2003, 09:30 AM
#50
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Originally posted by mpm '95 C4:
<strong>...Sometimes I wonder if there isn't marketing people in Stuttgart just pouring over sites like Rennlist. I know I sure would...</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Have you seen the new GT3?
380hp, 'stripped', is coming to US (same ride heigh in US as in Europe) and even the tail (lower part) kinda reminds a ducktail!
I'd say they are listening us...
<strong>...Sometimes I wonder if there isn't marketing people in Stuttgart just pouring over sites like Rennlist. I know I sure would...</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Have you seen the new GT3?
380hp, 'stripped', is coming to US (same ride heigh in US as in Europe) and even the tail (lower part) kinda reminds a ducktail!
I'd say they are listening us...
02-10-2003, 10:27 AM
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My point being that while you can denegrate the FX based on styling that doesn't match your tastes because after all that is a purely subjective basis and may only apply to you, you shouldn't denegrate the car on performance, ride, handling, etc. as compared to a Murano since the Murano and the FX are two completely different vehicles. That's all, just making sure you understood they were different.
The same logic would apply if someone was slamming on a 951 because they said it was just like the 911. True, both are Porsches, and you might not like the look of either, but the performance, ride, handling, etc. will be different because they are different cars.
If it is simply the subjective things you don't like about a car, styling, color choices, controls layout, etc. then the FX probably isn't the car for you. The same way you might not like the looks of the Boxster S, but I think it would be fun for you to go test drive both cars just to see how they drive. In the case of the FX at least you'll have some first hand experience with an SUV that puts the emphasis on the "S"...
The same logic would apply if someone was slamming on a 951 because they said it was just like the 911. True, both are Porsches, and you might not like the look of either, but the performance, ride, handling, etc. will be different because they are different cars.
If it is simply the subjective things you don't like about a car, styling, color choices, controls layout, etc. then the FX probably isn't the car for you. The same way you might not like the looks of the Boxster S, but I think it would be fun for you to go test drive both cars just to see how they drive. In the case of the FX at least you'll have some first hand experience with an SUV that puts the emphasis on the "S"...
02-10-2003, 11:24 AM
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Originally posted by Ken2KS:
<strong>P-Seller,
Would you lump the G35 in with the FX as being an Infiniti that isn't memorable???</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Let's see......Infiniti has been in business for 13 years.
G-35 available for a few months.
FX a few weeks.
It'll take more than two products for me to change my mind about infinitis purpose or mission.
It also depends on how fast the FX turns funny looking.
Peace
PS
<strong>P-Seller,
Would you lump the G35 in with the FX as being an Infiniti that isn't memorable???</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Arial,Helvetica,Geneva">Let's see......Infiniti has been in business for 13 years.
G-35 available for a few months.
FX a few weeks.
It'll take more than two products for me to change my mind about infinitis purpose or mission.
It also depends on how fast the FX turns funny looking.
Peace
PS
02-10-2003, 02:32 PM
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I went to dilliards department store last week and bought me some new boxer briefs. I resisted the temptaion to spend a whole lot of money on tommy and all that other frou frou stuff, and got the cheapest ones I could find there.(i was in a dept store cause I had a gift card left over from last year)
I get home, put em on, and the waist band says murano all the way around them. They do feel kind of trim and comfortable, and I do look kinda sexy in em, but when it clicked, I couldnt help but wonder if nissan realized their car is named after some underwear. They say careful research goes into naming cars, but this just cracked me up.
Peace
PS
I get home, put em on, and the waist band says murano all the way around them. They do feel kind of trim and comfortable, and I do look kinda sexy in em, but when it clicked, I couldnt help but wonder if nissan realized their car is named after some underwear. They say careful research goes into naming cars, but this just cracked me up.
Peace
PS
02-10-2003, 03:46 PM
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Murano Boxers... hmmm maybe they have a flat 6 in them? 
That is funny, wonder if they will have any tie-ins, maybe buy the car, get the boxers free!
As for changing your mind about Infiniti's cars or mission, that's not what I asked. What I asked was whether or not you think the G35 will be a memorable car? In fact the root question is really whether or not you think the G35 is a good car.
I could care less about corporate "missions" or past "history" when it comes to cars. What I care about is whether or not what I am buying meets my needs at that time. If Yugo produced a 400hp 4 seat convertible that beat the M3 hands down I'd buy it if that's what I was looking for regardless of what happened in the past.
In my opinion, people put too much stock in what a company has done in the past vs. what it is doing right now. Unless a car is a derivative of a previous version, then there really isn't much of a connection. The factory probably has new equipment, there are probably different workers on the line, heck it may even be a completely different factory, the designer may be different, even the materials used to produce the car may be substantially different in some way. The only thing keeping the 'transition' in tact is the badge on the hood.
Has Infiniti produced cars in the past that I wouldn't buy? Sure. Until the G35 I don't think I was interested in any of them. Then the G35 filled the criteria of what we were looking for better than any other car on the market at that time. Sure something new will come out next year or the year after, but that's true of any make and any model. The FX also filled a set of criteria we had again better than other vehicles on the market.
As they say past performance is no guarantee of future success. BMW might have made the best SAV last year, but that doesn't mean it is the best this year, or that it will be next year, etc. etc. In fact MANY memorable cars were on-offs, either made only for a year or for very limited runs, AC Cobras, GT40's,'73 911 RS, etc. etc.
Now I'm not thinking that either the G35 or the FX will go down in automotive history as the penultimate car of its time, but given the awards that the G35 has won already I'd say that it is at least going to be "memorable" and I think over time will be seen as a better 3 series than BMW's 3 series right now. I fully expect BMW to respond by upping the anti and that's a good thing because we all benefit from it in the long run.
Keep in mind that history isn't always kind to some cars either. A prime example is the Pontiac Fiero, really an engineering exercise that somehow saw the light of day. Pontiac sold them like hot cakes in 1984, I believe over 120,000 units in the first year. Then 60 minutes shows an engine catching fire and blam the car is dead by '89. Is that memorable? I sure remember it, but probably not for the right reasons in that some things experimented with in that car ended up in other cars and the Fiero is what launched the MR2 which in turn launched the Miata which in turn ultimately launched the BMW Z3 and Porsche Boxster. Has the Fiero not sold over 100,000 in its first year and inspired other car makers to bring competing products to market we likely never would have seen many of those and that's a shame.
Given that according to JD Power Lexus and Infiniti run 1-2 in terms of quality and reliability (flip flopped on those), I'd say that's a pretty good record for only being around 13 years. Even so, the quality of a previous Q45 or J30 doesn't mean squat for a G35 or FX unless Infiniti builds it correctly in the present. So far, they seem to be doing a pretty good job. Can they continue the momentum? Who knows, if they can, great there might be some even better cars coming in the future, if not, then I'm sure someone else will capture that spotlight if Infiniti doesn't.
If there is one constant, it is change.
That is funny, wonder if they will have any tie-ins, maybe buy the car, get the boxers free!
As for changing your mind about Infiniti's cars or mission, that's not what I asked. What I asked was whether or not you think the G35 will be a memorable car? In fact the root question is really whether or not you think the G35 is a good car.
I could care less about corporate "missions" or past "history" when it comes to cars. What I care about is whether or not what I am buying meets my needs at that time. If Yugo produced a 400hp 4 seat convertible that beat the M3 hands down I'd buy it if that's what I was looking for regardless of what happened in the past.
In my opinion, people put too much stock in what a company has done in the past vs. what it is doing right now. Unless a car is a derivative of a previous version, then there really isn't much of a connection. The factory probably has new equipment, there are probably different workers on the line, heck it may even be a completely different factory, the designer may be different, even the materials used to produce the car may be substantially different in some way. The only thing keeping the 'transition' in tact is the badge on the hood.
Has Infiniti produced cars in the past that I wouldn't buy? Sure. Until the G35 I don't think I was interested in any of them. Then the G35 filled the criteria of what we were looking for better than any other car on the market at that time. Sure something new will come out next year or the year after, but that's true of any make and any model. The FX also filled a set of criteria we had again better than other vehicles on the market.
As they say past performance is no guarantee of future success. BMW might have made the best SAV last year, but that doesn't mean it is the best this year, or that it will be next year, etc. etc. In fact MANY memorable cars were on-offs, either made only for a year or for very limited runs, AC Cobras, GT40's,'73 911 RS, etc. etc.
Now I'm not thinking that either the G35 or the FX will go down in automotive history as the penultimate car of its time, but given the awards that the G35 has won already I'd say that it is at least going to be "memorable" and I think over time will be seen as a better 3 series than BMW's 3 series right now. I fully expect BMW to respond by upping the anti and that's a good thing because we all benefit from it in the long run.
Keep in mind that history isn't always kind to some cars either. A prime example is the Pontiac Fiero, really an engineering exercise that somehow saw the light of day. Pontiac sold them like hot cakes in 1984, I believe over 120,000 units in the first year. Then 60 minutes shows an engine catching fire and blam the car is dead by '89. Is that memorable? I sure remember it, but probably not for the right reasons in that some things experimented with in that car ended up in other cars and the Fiero is what launched the MR2 which in turn launched the Miata which in turn ultimately launched the BMW Z3 and Porsche Boxster. Has the Fiero not sold over 100,000 in its first year and inspired other car makers to bring competing products to market we likely never would have seen many of those and that's a shame.
Given that according to JD Power Lexus and Infiniti run 1-2 in terms of quality and reliability (flip flopped on those), I'd say that's a pretty good record for only being around 13 years. Even so, the quality of a previous Q45 or J30 doesn't mean squat for a G35 or FX unless Infiniti builds it correctly in the present. So far, they seem to be doing a pretty good job. Can they continue the momentum? Who knows, if they can, great there might be some even better cars coming in the future, if not, then I'm sure someone else will capture that spotlight if Infiniti doesn't.
If there is one constant, it is change.
02-10-2003, 04:26 PM
#57
Ken,
I'm sorry but I dont agree that the FX even comes close to the Cayenne.
Basically, I hate the Cayenne. But I have to admit that after reading the article in Porsche and 911 World the Cayenne is such a competant vehicle.
To appreciate it, you have to read the article.
Read the article first. The Cayenne is light years ahead of any SUV out there. All other SUV's are cars. The Cayenne was built to go off road and to handle the off road competantly - no other SUV can do what the Cayenne does.
The FX 45 doesnt even come close...as much as I hate the Cayenne.
I'm sorry but I dont agree that the FX even comes close to the Cayenne.
Basically, I hate the Cayenne. But I have to admit that after reading the article in Porsche and 911 World the Cayenne is such a competant vehicle.
To appreciate it, you have to read the article.
Read the article first. The Cayenne is light years ahead of any SUV out there. All other SUV's are cars. The Cayenne was built to go off road and to handle the off road competantly - no other SUV can do what the Cayenne does.
The FX 45 doesnt even come close...as much as I hate the Cayenne.
02-10-2003, 05:26 PM
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RR,
I've driven both the Cayenne S (have not had a chance to drive turbo yet) and the FX35 and 45. Is the Cayenne a better off-road vehicle than the FX? I believe so. Does off-road use matter to me? No, if it did, I'd buy a Jeep Wrangler or some other off-road vehicle. The Cayenne is ahead of other SUV's for off-road use, but is BEHIND other SUV's for on-road use, namely the FX and the X5.
Ask yourself where will you be driving your Cayenne most? On road or off?
I've driven both the Cayenne S (have not had a chance to drive turbo yet) and the FX35 and 45. Is the Cayenne a better off-road vehicle than the FX? I believe so. Does off-road use matter to me? No, if it did, I'd buy a Jeep Wrangler or some other off-road vehicle. The Cayenne is ahead of other SUV's for off-road use, but is BEHIND other SUV's for on-road use, namely the FX and the X5.
Ask yourself where will you be driving your Cayenne most? On road or off?
02-10-2003, 05:55 PM
#59
Ken you are absolutely right, but I have to give respect where respect is due, and I tell you, Porsche has put a lot of thinking into the Cayenne's off road ability. Once you read the article, I promise you, you will have a renewed respect for the vehicle.
Ignorance is a strong word, and I could say that prior to reading that article, I had an ignorant view. Honestly do yourself a favour and find the magazine with that article. It is truly a wonderous machine.
It is in no way in the same league as the FX 45 irregardless of off-road vs on-road ability, its an SUV.
Ignorance is a strong word, and I could say that prior to reading that article, I had an ignorant view. Honestly do yourself a favour and find the magazine with that article. It is truly a wonderous machine.
It is in no way in the same league as the FX 45 irregardless of off-road vs on-road ability, its an SUV.
02-10-2003, 06:12 PM
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Maybe a better summation (and trust me I am familar with words like "locker" and "transfer case") would be that the FX emphasizes the "S" in SUV whereas the Cayenne emphasizes the "U" giving you greater utility off-road. Oh I've read plenty of articles on the Cayenne, but not that particular one you speak of, I'll have to check it out.