Cayenne S vs. X5 4.4
07-09-2003, 03:47 PM
#16
Moderator !x4
LSM don't know what kind of S you drove but what you said is absurd, and so far away from the 24hr tests I did, I actually believe you made it up. sorry jmho.
Even my 18 yr old daughter could tell the difference between a tight S demo against 3 month old 4.4 demo.
Even my 18 yr old daughter could tell the difference between a tight S demo against 3 month old 4.4 demo.
07-09-2003, 03:54 PM
#17
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
George - 4.4 is getting the new engine with the start of 2004 model year production in September/October. Allocations might show as early as later this month. Engine change is confirmed for 4.4 and 3.0.
X5 will be totally revamped in 2006 or 2007.
It is my understanding that the non-sport suspension in the 4.4 is softer than the Cayenne but the Sport makes a huge improvement.
Looking forward to a test drive soon...
X5 will be totally revamped in 2006 or 2007.
It is my understanding that the non-sport suspension in the 4.4 is softer than the Cayenne but the Sport makes a huge improvement.
Looking forward to a test drive soon...
07-09-2003, 04:43 PM
#18
Racer
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Chicago
Posts: 344
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by mudman2:
<strong>LSM don't know what kind of S you drove but what you said is absurd, and so far away from the 24hr tests I did, I actually believe you made it up. sorry jmho.
Even my 18 yr old daughter could tell the difference between a tight S demo against 3 month old 4.4 demo.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Slow your role mudman. The hard data is in my favor, check the test of the 4.6is and Cayenne turbo. Even my 5 year old cousin can read hard data which has the 4.6is that has the indentical set-up as the 4.4 sport, out-braking and out-handling the Cayenne Turbo. What do you think the results would have been with a Cayenne S? I can tell you, the S would have also lost in all acceleration tests. So, mudman, check your data, I was merely expressing my opinion. Judging from your stable of soft-utes and over-priced toyotas's it seems you must have a real handle on handling characteristics of different vehicles. Did you test your Cayenne after climbing out of your Toyota RX and proclaim what a great handler??
<strong>LSM don't know what kind of S you drove but what you said is absurd, and so far away from the 24hr tests I did, I actually believe you made it up. sorry jmho.
Even my 18 yr old daughter could tell the difference between a tight S demo against 3 month old 4.4 demo.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Slow your role mudman. The hard data is in my favor, check the test of the 4.6is and Cayenne turbo. Even my 5 year old cousin can read hard data which has the 4.6is that has the indentical set-up as the 4.4 sport, out-braking and out-handling the Cayenne Turbo. What do you think the results would have been with a Cayenne S? I can tell you, the S would have also lost in all acceleration tests. So, mudman, check your data, I was merely expressing my opinion. Judging from your stable of soft-utes and over-priced toyotas's it seems you must have a real handle on handling characteristics of different vehicles. Did you test your Cayenne after climbing out of your Toyota RX and proclaim what a great handler??
07-09-2003, 05:02 PM
#19
A lot of automotive experts have stated that they prefer the X5 to the Cayenne hence I don't think what LSM said was off base. I haven't driven a Cayenne so I can't speak from experience but I would bet the numbers are darned close and the "feel" would be a matter of preference. A review in this weeks Autoweek (don't remember who) stated basically the same thing.
I prefer the X- primarily because of the looks- secondarily because I think its a better value- but I wouldn't be surprised if I liked the way Cayenne drove better. I've never been disappointed in any Porsche once behind the wheel. But just because I may like it doesn't mean the next guy will.
I prefer the X- primarily because of the looks- secondarily because I think its a better value- but I wouldn't be surprised if I liked the way Cayenne drove better. I've never been disappointed in any Porsche once behind the wheel. But just because I may like it doesn't mean the next guy will.
07-09-2003, 06:03 PM
#21
Racer
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Chicago
Posts: 344
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by Jack Ennuste:
<strong>I think, You should compare X5 4,6is with Cayenne S, not 4,4. First mentioned has far better suspension and driveability.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">I agree, the Cayenne S and the 4.6is are in the same price range. The 4.4 typically comes in about $10k cheaper. The question posed was 4.4 vs Cayenne S. The suspension and set-up as you say are identical between the 4.6is and the 4.4 sport. It is the same sport package(less wheels, 19in. 4.4, 20in.4.6is) same suspension etc. It would be safe to assume like handling between the 4.6is and 4.4sport. BTW in case there is any confusion, I am comparing the X5 4.4 with sport package to the Cayenne S. Also, i do not know how many of you know this but, on the X5 with sport package, when in drive if you tip the **** to the left, D S is displayed on the dash and you are in sport mode without having to shift through the gears manually. This increases trottle response and holds shift points to redline. I honestly must say, and I could be wrong that many people who say the Cayenne S handles much better/is faster must be driving non-sport package X5's. I myself hate how non-sport X5's handle and it feels slower. It is a night and day difference between the sport package and non-sport package equipped cars. I am being presumptious so maybe most of you just feel that it does handle much better and is faster. I respect your opinion even if my experience differs. Again not to sound like an ***, but to answer the question posed, if it were me I would wait for the 04 X5 with performance numbers that are supposed to be similar to the out going 4.6is.(6.2 sec to 60)The 04 X5 is much faster,lighter, handles better, brakes better and imo looks better than the Cayenne S and save the $10k more that it costs for a Cayenne S. I guess my problem is, Munich seems to have built what should have been the Porsche of SUV's. Porsche should have dropped all the off-road prowess, lightened the car and made it look a little better, and they would have had an even bigger hit on there hands. I mean how can a truck with off-road prowess be a good handler?? The answer is it can't, if you equip the Cayenne S with the 19's or 20's it won't do squat off-road as evidensed in the autoweek test when they got stuck in mud and had to be saved by a pick-up truck. Just my .02. Enjoy your vehicles
-Lou
<strong>I think, You should compare X5 4,6is with Cayenne S, not 4,4. First mentioned has far better suspension and driveability.</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">I agree, the Cayenne S and the 4.6is are in the same price range. The 4.4 typically comes in about $10k cheaper. The question posed was 4.4 vs Cayenne S. The suspension and set-up as you say are identical between the 4.6is and the 4.4 sport. It is the same sport package(less wheels, 19in. 4.4, 20in.4.6is) same suspension etc. It would be safe to assume like handling between the 4.6is and 4.4sport. BTW in case there is any confusion, I am comparing the X5 4.4 with sport package to the Cayenne S. Also, i do not know how many of you know this but, on the X5 with sport package, when in drive if you tip the **** to the left, D S is displayed on the dash and you are in sport mode without having to shift through the gears manually. This increases trottle response and holds shift points to redline. I honestly must say, and I could be wrong that many people who say the Cayenne S handles much better/is faster must be driving non-sport package X5's. I myself hate how non-sport X5's handle and it feels slower. It is a night and day difference between the sport package and non-sport package equipped cars. I am being presumptious so maybe most of you just feel that it does handle much better and is faster. I respect your opinion even if my experience differs. Again not to sound like an ***, but to answer the question posed, if it were me I would wait for the 04 X5 with performance numbers that are supposed to be similar to the out going 4.6is.(6.2 sec to 60)The 04 X5 is much faster,lighter, handles better, brakes better and imo looks better than the Cayenne S and save the $10k more that it costs for a Cayenne S. I guess my problem is, Munich seems to have built what should have been the Porsche of SUV's. Porsche should have dropped all the off-road prowess, lightened the car and made it look a little better, and they would have had an even bigger hit on there hands. I mean how can a truck with off-road prowess be a good handler?? The answer is it can't, if you equip the Cayenne S with the 19's or 20's it won't do squat off-road as evidensed in the autoweek test when they got stuck in mud and had to be saved by a pick-up truck. Just my .02. Enjoy your vehicles
-Lou
07-09-2003, 06:04 PM
#22
Addict
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
No difference in suspension if you get the sport package on the 4.4.
4.6 is being dropped from the lineup - I don't think there are anymore open allocations anywhere.
4.6 is being dropped from the lineup - I don't think there are anymore open allocations anywhere.
07-09-2003, 07:10 PM
#25
Pro
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 620
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Munchen built no such thing. BMW have built a great BMW SUV, and Porsche have built a great Porsche SUV. Each have some real strengths, and some minuses. I must say that the Cayenne's offroad capability is the kicker for me, while my wife prefers the steering feel of the C over the X5.
So - if you like the X5, go for it! I'll take the C.
J
(actually, my wife is pushing for the C in place of the Boxster, but that's another story)
So - if you like the X5, go for it! I'll take the C.
J
(actually, my wife is pushing for the C in place of the Boxster, but that's another story)
07-09-2003, 07:39 PM
#27
Racer
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Chicago
Posts: 344
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by mudman2:
<strong>lsm ...go drive something will you</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Can I borrow your toyota??
<strong>lsm ...go drive something will you</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Can I borrow your toyota??
07-09-2003, 07:59 PM
#29
Racer
Join Date: Jun 2002
Location: Chicago
Posts: 344
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by mudman2:
<strong>childish</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Please review your previous posts and reflect on the irony of the above statement. The bottom line is if you need valdiation for your purchase go elsewhere, I am not going to give it to you. I simply answered a question posed on this forum. The answer is based on mostly facts and some opinion. I challenge you to come up with any facts other than your seat of the pants conparison between your Cayenne to your toyota or non-sport package X5 that will validate your beliefs. Facts are in my corner on this one. What possible qualification could you have. I mean you have driven a toyota and an ML 430 for God's sake. Thankfully, there are professionals that can quantify results and publish them putting any of your opinions to rest.
-Lou
<strong>childish</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Please review your previous posts and reflect on the irony of the above statement. The bottom line is if you need valdiation for your purchase go elsewhere, I am not going to give it to you. I simply answered a question posed on this forum. The answer is based on mostly facts and some opinion. I challenge you to come up with any facts other than your seat of the pants conparison between your Cayenne to your toyota or non-sport package X5 that will validate your beliefs. Facts are in my corner on this one. What possible qualification could you have. I mean you have driven a toyota and an ML 430 for God's sake. Thankfully, there are professionals that can quantify results and publish them putting any of your opinions to rest.
-Lou
07-09-2003, 08:07 PM
#30
Pro
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Northern VA
Posts: 620
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
This may be a really stupid question, but in this case what is better than seat of the pants? We can throw facts at each other until sunrise, yet prove nothing.
I'm lucky enough to be able to buy either. Unless BMW do something spectacular, the C will wind up in my driveway. That's why I hang out here, and not on an X5 board.
My .03
J
I'm lucky enough to be able to buy either. Unless BMW do something spectacular, the C will wind up in my driveway. That's why I hang out here, and not on an X5 board.
My .03
J