Quick Question for Cayenne Owners/Enthusiasts....
04-17-2003, 11:28 PM
#16
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</font><blockquote><font size="1" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">quote:</font><hr /><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Originally posted by Cay-ute:
<strong>John D., I concur with EuroCarNut's post, the time for speculation on the Cayenne is now over since a number of the contributor's to the current forum are now driving them, it's time to explore real live information about owner experiences. Learning more about the Cayenne's capabilities, problems/fixes, what's going to come out in the aftermarket, and whether Porsche is ever going to make the accessories available is of true value to the Cayenne owner's community.....</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Hi Cay-ute,
Excellent post - and I fully support your comments. Well said...
I've never posted my view of the Cayenne before, but here goes. It, too - may be early - but here goes....
I think - in my view - that the Cayenne is and was a departure for Porsche. But - in my view, so was the first front-engine/water cooled Porsche, which most 356 and early 911 owners were appalled at as well. Today - however, the Cayenne is a natural extension of the automotive market. Many forget that Porsche is NOT a subsidiary or been bought out by another larger manufacturer. Look at most German and Italian manufacturers who have been "acquired". Porsche has not. Their Marque and name remain undimished and untainted.
And they are in the "transportation" industry - sports cars, to be sure. When the industry shifted from sports cars to practical transportation, Porsche responded in the single best way an independent manufacturer could. They diversified. Good for them. Hopefully, it will rejuvenate their customer base and take them into new market segments.
As for the racing program being "ousted" in favor of the Cayenne - give me a break. Sponsoring the winning team (The Racers Group) and the Porsche Cup winning team, does give me certain insights and privileged information. I can assure you that Porsche is - and will remain - competitive. They will not abandon their heritage. I sort of chuckle when I read those posts along that line, that they have abandoned their racing effort. Porsche has not.
As well - some folks forget what it costs - in real dollars - to run a race at a tier 1 level. It is expensive. You know what it takes to run 3 cars as a leader in ALMS? The costs would shock you. But, Porsche is there - as a factory, backing the independents. That's the way Porsche is.. It's a small company by comparison to other "global" manufacturers - but it is huge by way of the camaraderie and support.
Porsche is special.
And it has a wonderful customer base and an image that not a single manufacturer can engender nor mimic.
If that were not so - there wouldn't be Rennlist. There wouldn't be the brand "Porsche". And simply - there wouldn't be the Cayenne - which has a deserving place in both worlds....
In my view - ask me what I think about the Cayenne sometime...
<strong>John D., I concur with EuroCarNut's post, the time for speculation on the Cayenne is now over since a number of the contributor's to the current forum are now driving them, it's time to explore real live information about owner experiences. Learning more about the Cayenne's capabilities, problems/fixes, what's going to come out in the aftermarket, and whether Porsche is ever going to make the accessories available is of true value to the Cayenne owner's community.....</strong></font><hr /></blockquote><font size="2" face="Verdana,Tahoma,Helvetica">Hi Cay-ute,
Excellent post - and I fully support your comments. Well said...
I've never posted my view of the Cayenne before, but here goes. It, too - may be early - but here goes....
I think - in my view - that the Cayenne is and was a departure for Porsche. But - in my view, so was the first front-engine/water cooled Porsche, which most 356 and early 911 owners were appalled at as well. Today - however, the Cayenne is a natural extension of the automotive market. Many forget that Porsche is NOT a subsidiary or been bought out by another larger manufacturer. Look at most German and Italian manufacturers who have been "acquired". Porsche has not. Their Marque and name remain undimished and untainted.
And they are in the "transportation" industry - sports cars, to be sure. When the industry shifted from sports cars to practical transportation, Porsche responded in the single best way an independent manufacturer could. They diversified. Good for them. Hopefully, it will rejuvenate their customer base and take them into new market segments.
As for the racing program being "ousted" in favor of the Cayenne - give me a break. Sponsoring the winning team (The Racers Group) and the Porsche Cup winning team, does give me certain insights and privileged information. I can assure you that Porsche is - and will remain - competitive. They will not abandon their heritage. I sort of chuckle when I read those posts along that line, that they have abandoned their racing effort. Porsche has not.
As well - some folks forget what it costs - in real dollars - to run a race at a tier 1 level. It is expensive. You know what it takes to run 3 cars as a leader in ALMS? The costs would shock you. But, Porsche is there - as a factory, backing the independents. That's the way Porsche is.. It's a small company by comparison to other "global" manufacturers - but it is huge by way of the camaraderie and support.
Porsche is special.
And it has a wonderful customer base and an image that not a single manufacturer can engender nor mimic.
If that were not so - there wouldn't be Rennlist. There wouldn't be the brand "Porsche". And simply - there wouldn't be the Cayenne - which has a deserving place in both worlds....
In my view - ask me what I think about the Cayenne sometime...
04-17-2003, 11:32 PM
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Actually, if I were in the market for an upscale vehicle, the "debates" provided interesting alternatives. And now that there are actual owners, contrary points of view can be either confirmed or dismissed by actual experience. But, I am just an old retired guy with an older 944; what do I know?
04-18-2003, 12:54 AM
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Bob - Point well taken on the "debates", I looked at many when my patience began to waiver during the pre-delivery, lack of real infomration period prior to the Cayenne launch. I learned from alot of folks experience with other vehicles, many of which I went out to drive after reading the posts.
The angst in my earlier post about this forum were concerning (1) those mortified that Porsche would build a truck, and that it was going to be the end of Porsche, and (2) those that used the forum to pose silly little questions in effort to draw attention to themselves or their vehicle of choice. These folks, with too much time on their hands, simply clogged the pipe with garbage and made it more difficult for Cayenne enthusiasts from easily finding information and opinions on the Cayenne.
I love a good debate, gets the blood rushing, but some of it got so tangential to the topic that it became tedious, rather than instructive to use the forum. I like what John D has offered to do for the Cayenne forum.
The angst in my earlier post about this forum were concerning (1) those mortified that Porsche would build a truck, and that it was going to be the end of Porsche, and (2) those that used the forum to pose silly little questions in effort to draw attention to themselves or their vehicle of choice. These folks, with too much time on their hands, simply clogged the pipe with garbage and made it more difficult for Cayenne enthusiasts from easily finding information and opinions on the Cayenne.
I love a good debate, gets the blood rushing, but some of it got so tangential to the topic that it became tedious, rather than instructive to use the forum. I like what John D has offered to do for the Cayenne forum.
04-18-2003, 05:13 AM
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John D.,
I'm a newbie to Porsche and this forum (will get my "S"-Pepper next week in exchange for an Audi S4). So I'm probably the exact type of customer Porsche is aiming at with the Cayenne.
I've been following this forum for a couple of weeks now. It's been a great source for advise and insights to me. The responsiveness and engagement of some of the members is astonishing. Being new to the Porsche World, your site is really helpful to me and the separation will make it even better. It also gives me the possibility to get in touch with other Pepper-Owners on the other side of the Atlantic.
As regards the eternal debates as to whether Porsche should have done "it" or not and whether the FX or any other object on 4 wheels is better: I wouldn't have become a Porsche customer, if there was no Cayenne. And so will a lot of others. This will help Porsche remain independent and keep on build great sports car for the enthusiasts. So I think it's a win-win situation. And the debates and "attitudes" your talking about, they won't change my opinion on this vehicle, they are just entertaining and make me smile (which is also a good thing, at least for me ;-).
Matt C
Pepper-Newbie from Switzerland
(excuse my English, it's not my mother-tongue)
I'm a newbie to Porsche and this forum (will get my "S"-Pepper next week in exchange for an Audi S4). So I'm probably the exact type of customer Porsche is aiming at with the Cayenne.
I've been following this forum for a couple of weeks now. It's been a great source for advise and insights to me. The responsiveness and engagement of some of the members is astonishing. Being new to the Porsche World, your site is really helpful to me and the separation will make it even better. It also gives me the possibility to get in touch with other Pepper-Owners on the other side of the Atlantic.
As regards the eternal debates as to whether Porsche should have done "it" or not and whether the FX or any other object on 4 wheels is better: I wouldn't have become a Porsche customer, if there was no Cayenne. And so will a lot of others. This will help Porsche remain independent and keep on build great sports car for the enthusiasts. So I think it's a win-win situation. And the debates and "attitudes" your talking about, they won't change my opinion on this vehicle, they are just entertaining and make me smile (which is also a good thing, at least for me ;-).
Matt C
Pepper-Newbie from Switzerland
(excuse my English, it's not my mother-tongue)
04-18-2003, 12:43 PM
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John D.
Thanks for your articulate insights and opinions. As a new Cayenne S owner (I went over 200 miles last night on my way to the Maverick Region Happy Hour here in Dallas), I read these posts in this forum with a great deal of interest. Having owned a 1974 Ducktail Carrera and still owning a 1979 Petrol Blue 930, I was interested in gauging reactions last night from PCA members.
Surprisingly, the reaction was pretty positive. I was fully prepared to defend my honor as the owner of a "real" Porsche in addition to becoming a "heretic" for buying a Cayenne. The topic never came up and I confess I was surprised.
I must also say that it is quite interesting to watch folks as I drive by. Lots of double-takes and pointing. That just makes owning my Cayenne that much more fun. Of course, I get the same looks when I bring my 930 out as well.
Finally, I want to say thanks for providing a forum such as Rennlist to foster discussion on the Cayenne and other favorite cars. I think your idea regarding the newer forum is a good one and I will continue to be an active viewer and contributor. Being the CTO at a major airline, I understand what it takes to run a board like this. Keep up the good work, and thanks once again!
Toby Pennycuff
Thanks for your articulate insights and opinions. As a new Cayenne S owner (I went over 200 miles last night on my way to the Maverick Region Happy Hour here in Dallas), I read these posts in this forum with a great deal of interest. Having owned a 1974 Ducktail Carrera and still owning a 1979 Petrol Blue 930, I was interested in gauging reactions last night from PCA members.
Surprisingly, the reaction was pretty positive. I was fully prepared to defend my honor as the owner of a "real" Porsche in addition to becoming a "heretic" for buying a Cayenne. The topic never came up and I confess I was surprised.
I must also say that it is quite interesting to watch folks as I drive by. Lots of double-takes and pointing. That just makes owning my Cayenne that much more fun. Of course, I get the same looks when I bring my 930 out as well.
Finally, I want to say thanks for providing a forum such as Rennlist to foster discussion on the Cayenne and other favorite cars. I think your idea regarding the newer forum is a good one and I will continue to be an active viewer and contributor. Being the CTO at a major airline, I understand what it takes to run a board like this. Keep up the good work, and thanks once again!
Toby Pennycuff
04-18-2003, 04:29 PM
#21
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Hi Matt, Toby and all....
First - Matt, your English is extremely well written! If I could speak German 1/100th as well, I might be able to *almost* pass for a Tourist
. Seriously, it is excellent!
As well, I appreciate all the positive comments to the proposed Rennlist dedicated Cayenne site, so I will definitely move ahead on that effort. As I'm sure you can tell, it is something that I had hoped would be of value to all Cayenne owners - both present and future. When it goes "live" - I will post a permanent link to it at the top of this General Cayenne Forum (above the Rennlist Banner) so folks can easily navigate to that new site. Also, so there is no confusion - this present Forum will remain "open" as well, for more "general" conversations (and "debates" ).
On the new site specifically - what is planned is an Owner's Picture Gallery, the owners Forum, an off-road Forum, calendar, news and updates. I am also writing a FAQ on what resources are open to Cayenne Owners - both within Rennlist as well as how to get assistance from Porsche (PCNA specific right now), for any general information, warranty or owner support, COA, and/or general assistance for your questions. I hope to supplement that FAQ as the Rennlist area for the Cayenne area grows.
I guess from my perspective - if I were a new Cayenne owner - I would want an area that was specific to my Porsche model and needs, while leaving this current Forum intact. And with your help, suggestions and guidance - I think we can accomplish that goal extremely well...
My thanks again for your comments and support...!!!
First - Matt, your English is extremely well written! If I could speak German 1/100th as well, I might be able to *almost* pass for a Tourist
. Seriously, it is excellent!As well, I appreciate all the positive comments to the proposed Rennlist dedicated Cayenne site, so I will definitely move ahead on that effort. As I'm sure you can tell, it is something that I had hoped would be of value to all Cayenne owners - both present and future. When it goes "live" - I will post a permanent link to it at the top of this General Cayenne Forum (above the Rennlist Banner) so folks can easily navigate to that new site. Also, so there is no confusion - this present Forum will remain "open" as well, for more "general" conversations (and "debates"
).On the new site specifically - what is planned is an Owner's Picture Gallery, the owners Forum, an off-road Forum, calendar, news and updates. I am also writing a FAQ on what resources are open to Cayenne Owners - both within Rennlist as well as how to get assistance from Porsche (PCNA specific right now), for any general information, warranty or owner support, COA, and/or general assistance for your questions. I hope to supplement that FAQ as the Rennlist area for the Cayenne area grows.
I guess from my perspective - if I were a new Cayenne owner - I would want an area that was specific to my Porsche model and needs, while leaving this current Forum intact. And with your help, suggestions and guidance - I think we can accomplish that goal extremely well...
My thanks again for your comments and support...!!!
04-18-2003, 06:08 PM
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John D.,
Thanks for all your hard work and support for the model. If there is anything that we can do to help out, please let us know. I'm sure that we will all benefit from this in the end.
Karl
Thanks for all your hard work and support for the model. If there is anything that we can do to help out, please let us know. I'm sure that we will all benefit from this in the end.
Karl
04-19-2003, 08:38 AM
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John D.,
I also want to thank you for your efforts on this forum and voice my support to your plans on enhancing it. I really like the idea of a gallery. I like to see Cayenne pics in all the different colorschemes as I consider the decision on choosing colors the most difficult part of buying a car. Watching different photos makes it a bit easier, at least to get a better impression than with a catalogue.
When I discovered this forum in early January I usually enjoyed the discussions here although a few debates I felt pretty harrassing (it bothered me that there are a few people out there who go to a discussion forum of a product they absolutely dislike and start a flame war which has nothing in common with a respectful discussion of different opinions...). For the good, I considered them a good training for my self-conciousness <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> . However, I always stayed with this board and although it's in English (not my native language as with Matt - but I knew that Anglo-Saxonians are very relaxed on that <img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" /> ) I always felt and still feel that this is THE best Cayenne board on the net with a great number of dedicated and enthusiastic people <img border="0" alt="[king]" title="" src="graemlins/r.gif" /> . It makes me feel like a big family, especially after March 15 2003, when this forum's attitude turned to discussing the specifics of the Cayenne .
<img border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" title="" src="graemlins/drink.gif" />
I also want to thank you for your efforts on this forum and voice my support to your plans on enhancing it. I really like the idea of a gallery. I like to see Cayenne pics in all the different colorschemes as I consider the decision on choosing colors the most difficult part of buying a car. Watching different photos makes it a bit easier, at least to get a better impression than with a catalogue.
When I discovered this forum in early January I usually enjoyed the discussions here although a few debates I felt pretty harrassing (it bothered me that there are a few people out there who go to a discussion forum of a product they absolutely dislike and start a flame war which has nothing in common with a respectful discussion of different opinions...). For the good, I considered them a good training for my self-conciousness <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> . However, I always stayed with this board and although it's in English (not my native language as with Matt - but I knew that Anglo-Saxonians are very relaxed on that <img border="0" alt="[cheers]" title="" src="graemlins/beerchug.gif" /> ) I always felt and still feel that this is THE best Cayenne board on the net with a great number of dedicated and enthusiastic people <img border="0" alt="[king]" title="" src="graemlins/r.gif" /> . It makes me feel like a big family, especially after March 15 2003, when this forum's attitude turned to discussing the specifics of the Cayenne
.<img border="0" alt="[cherrsagai]" title="" src="graemlins/drink.gif" />
04-20-2003, 11:47 PM
#24
John D., I think the idea of a Cayenne Portal is a good one, I concur with Cay-ute and EuroCarNut's posts. I debated the Cayenne decision as much as any P-car nut. That was last year. Now that it's here, I'm more interested in tracking how it's doing, and how the brave pioneers who bought one in year 1 of production are doing.
(I gave up on buying Porsches in year 1 of prouction after my 1983 944). <img border="0" alt="[grrrrrrr]" title="" src="graemlins/cussing.gif" />
I support the direction you're heading.
Robin
(I gave up on buying Porsches in year 1 of prouction after my 1983 944). <img border="0" alt="[grrrrrrr]" title="" src="graemlins/cussing.gif" />
I support the direction you're heading.
Robin
04-21-2003, 10:18 AM
#25
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John D,
What a great idea this is !! A Cayenne portal would really be good for owners and enthusiasts and I highly commend you on it <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> Mine will be here after the delays shortly ( I hope ) and then I can really give realistic opinions on the experience. I enjoyed the debates even though I didn't agree with what was being said, but I could understand where the other side was coming from. The rennlist experience as a whole has been a great sourse for information and experiences for me. I seriously benefited by joining and you can be sure that I'm not the only person voicing this opinion. The very best of luck to you and the people working for rennlist <img border="0" alt="[thumbsup]" title="" src="graemlins/bigok.gif" />
What a great idea this is !! A Cayenne portal would really be good for owners and enthusiasts and I highly commend you on it <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" /> Mine will be here after the delays shortly ( I hope ) and then I can really give realistic opinions on the experience. I enjoyed the debates even though I didn't agree with what was being said, but I could understand where the other side was coming from. The rennlist experience as a whole has been a great sourse for information and experiences for me. I seriously benefited by joining and you can be sure that I'm not the only person voicing this opinion. The very best of luck to you and the people working for rennlist <img border="0" alt="[thumbsup]" title="" src="graemlins/bigok.gif" />
04-22-2003, 01:29 PM
#26
Hi John,
while I am not a Cayenne owner yet (in my dreams!) I think the portal is a great idea. One thing though. Can I request that we are able to log in with our normal Rennlist IDs, rather than having to re-register ?
Okay, just call me lazy <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />
This will however also avoid any likelihood of someone else joining just the Cayenne portal with the same login name as a different person in the main site.
(i.e. another 'John W' joins the Cayenne only forum, causing identity confusions for people that visit both sites).
Another thought. You mention specific areas for tuning etc. Would it be a good idea to sort or order the entries by location ? (for example by state in the US, or country if in Europe/Far East).
All the best. You are doing a cracking job.
Cheers,
John. (Cayenne wannabee)
Too many toys - too little time.
while I am not a Cayenne owner yet (in my dreams!) I think the portal is a great idea. One thing though. Can I request that we are able to log in with our normal Rennlist IDs, rather than having to re-register ?
Okay, just call me lazy <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />
This will however also avoid any likelihood of someone else joining just the Cayenne portal with the same login name as a different person in the main site.
(i.e. another 'John W' joins the Cayenne only forum, causing identity confusions for people that visit both sites).
Another thought. You mention specific areas for tuning etc. Would it be a good idea to sort or order the entries by location ? (for example by state in the US, or country if in Europe/Far East).
All the best. You are doing a cracking job.
Cheers,
John. (Cayenne wannabee)
Too many toys - too little time.
04-28-2003, 05:47 PM
#28
Race Director
I disagree with the idea of Cayenne Portal.
Here is why. Like it or not a Cayenne is a Porsche. Now that we have passed the debate stage and there are owners out there the rest of the Porsche community should welcome them and make them feel a part of the family rather than seperate them.
I own various 944 models. We have a number of 944 specific areas and these are located within the general Porsche community. I am happy that they are. I would not want 944 Portal as I think it does NOT make 944 owners feel welcome. I often visit and read posts on other forums and non 944 owner visit and post. Personally I like to read the review of the Cayenne from their owners and think that many other non-cayenne owner would as well.
True in the short term the debaters can scare off and make Cayenne owners NOT feel welcome. I believe it is better in the long run to make them a part of the overall Porsche community rather than making them feel like an out casts subgroup that needs to separated from "Proper Porsche Owners".
Just my $0.02
Here is why. Like it or not a Cayenne is a Porsche. Now that we have passed the debate stage and there are owners out there the rest of the Porsche community should welcome them and make them feel a part of the family rather than seperate them.
I own various 944 models. We have a number of 944 specific areas and these are located within the general Porsche community. I am happy that they are. I would not want 944 Portal as I think it does NOT make 944 owners feel welcome. I often visit and read posts on other forums and non 944 owner visit and post. Personally I like to read the review of the Cayenne from their owners and think that many other non-cayenne owner would as well.
True in the short term the debaters can scare off and make Cayenne owners NOT feel welcome. I believe it is better in the long run to make them a part of the overall Porsche community rather than making them feel like an out casts subgroup that needs to separated from "Proper Porsche Owners".
Just my $0.02
04-30-2003, 11:48 AM
#29
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Thread Starter
Hi all....
Thanks so much for all the input..! I'm still adding "content" and features to the new site, and I hope it's fully "on-line" the first week in May...
Just to answer a couple of concerns, though....
The new areas do not displace this current "general" forum, but they will provide areas out of the "spotlight" for Cayenne owners to discuss things about their Porsche's that may not have the same "general appeal" to a larger audience...
In these new areas - your current screen name, posts, profiles, login, etc., etc. - will be used, so you do not have to register there. In fact, if you make a post there - you will see your total number of posts *here* increase as well*.. In fact - you do not have to even "login" there, if you are logged in "here".. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />
Still looking for information to add - so feel free to comment back on what areas you may like to see in the new site, OK???
Thanks to all of you....!
Thanks so much for all the input..! I'm still adding "content" and features to the new site, and I hope it's fully "on-line" the first week in May...
Just to answer a couple of concerns, though....
The new areas do not displace this current "general" forum, but they will provide areas out of the "spotlight" for Cayenne owners to discuss things about their Porsche's that may not have the same "general appeal" to a larger audience...
In these new areas - your current screen name, posts, profiles, login, etc., etc. - will be used, so you do not have to register there. In fact, if you make a post there - you will see your total number of posts *here* increase as well*.. In fact - you do not have to even "login" there, if you are logged in "here".. <img border="0" title="" alt="[Wink]" src="wink.gif" />
Still looking for information to add - so feel free to comment back on what areas you may like to see in the new site, OK???
Thanks to all of you....!