Mandatory Reading Assignment
02-01-2008, 02:45 PM
#31
Where did you see a Panamera in person?
One thing I've wondered about... is it possible that people who buy a Cayenne as their first Porsche vehicle go on to buy another model later? Could the Cayenne introduce more people to the brand and ultimately increase sales for other models? Of course the opposite could also be true - based on Cayenne experience people may run away from the brand. I guess it all depends on what your expectations are when you buy a Cayenne, and on your individual experience.
One thing I've wondered about... is it possible that people who buy a Cayenne as their first Porsche vehicle go on to buy another model later? Could the Cayenne introduce more people to the brand and ultimately increase sales for other models? Of course the opposite could also be true - based on Cayenne experience people may run away from the brand. I guess it all depends on what your expectations are when you buy a Cayenne, and on your individual experience.
I can see purchasing another Porsche in the future. The Cayenne Turbo was my first Porsche, sort of. My 500E was actually designed and built by Porsche. How many of the Porsche Purists know that?
The Cayenne S, Turbo and I'm sure the Cayenne GTS and Hybrid will be amazing vehicles for what they have been designed for. I'm so tired of hearing Porsche purists saying the Cayenne is not a Porsche. It is not a sports car, it is a SUV, and a damn good one at that.
Porsche is a corporation that must earn a profit. So what is wrong with selling a vehicle that brings in a nice revenue/profit?
02-01-2008, 04:40 PM
#32
I've owned a number of Porsches since the early 90's. I've got a Cayenne GTS on order, and am looking forward to it getting here. I find a lot of the negative comments about the Cayenne in general, and the GTS in particular, pretty entertaining.
For those who feel betrayed because Porsche built something that's not a sports car (yes, the Cayenne is big and heavy - it's supposed to be), I'd ask: why? Did building the Cayenne somehow detract from the rest of the line? Is a 997TT or Cayman S less of a car than it would have been had Porsche not been building the Cayenne? I certainly don't think so. And in fact, the income generated by the Cayenne helped Porsche design and build those other cars. I'm not seeing a negative here. Unless you just feel Porsche is therefore less "exclusive", in which case I have no idea what to say, because that factor means nothing to me. I don't care if soccer moms are driving Cayennes, too....that doesn't affect me. Why should it affect anyone?
For those that claim an SUV is only for offroad use, I gotta disagree. How about as a tow vehicle? How about as a family hauler that can accomodate a couple of kids and a 160 lb. dog, and do well in snow and rain? How about a utility vehicle that can carry a lot of stuff? The Cayenne can do all those - as can many SUVs. And I looked at almost all of them. The big advantage that the Cayenne S and Turbo have (obviously haven't driven a GTS yet, but I like living on the edge and ordered one anyway
) is that they're actually *fun* to drive. None of the other SUVs are. Even the X5, which is the only thing that comes moderately close, doesn't compare. For me, that's the most important factor. I LIKE to drive. And with a family, etc., I'm going to be in whatever SUV/family hauler I own a lot. I'd much rather have a Cayenne and enjoy that drive, than go out and buy any other SUV/station wagon/whatever and not enjoy the drive. So from that standpoint Porsche has done a great job. No, the Cayenne is not a sports car. But they've built a sporty, fun to drive SUV that at least puts some of the pleasure back in taking the car out on the road.....can't wait for mine to show up!!
For those who feel betrayed because Porsche built something that's not a sports car (yes, the Cayenne is big and heavy - it's supposed to be), I'd ask: why? Did building the Cayenne somehow detract from the rest of the line? Is a 997TT or Cayman S less of a car than it would have been had Porsche not been building the Cayenne? I certainly don't think so. And in fact, the income generated by the Cayenne helped Porsche design and build those other cars. I'm not seeing a negative here. Unless you just feel Porsche is therefore less "exclusive", in which case I have no idea what to say, because that factor means nothing to me. I don't care if soccer moms are driving Cayennes, too....that doesn't affect me. Why should it affect anyone?
For those that claim an SUV is only for offroad use, I gotta disagree. How about as a tow vehicle? How about as a family hauler that can accomodate a couple of kids and a 160 lb. dog, and do well in snow and rain? How about a utility vehicle that can carry a lot of stuff? The Cayenne can do all those - as can many SUVs. And I looked at almost all of them. The big advantage that the Cayenne S and Turbo have (obviously haven't driven a GTS yet, but I like living on the edge and ordered one anyway
) is that they're actually *fun* to drive. None of the other SUVs are. Even the X5, which is the only thing that comes moderately close, doesn't compare. For me, that's the most important factor. I LIKE to drive. And with a family, etc., I'm going to be in whatever SUV/family hauler I own a lot. I'd much rather have a Cayenne and enjoy that drive, than go out and buy any other SUV/station wagon/whatever and not enjoy the drive. So from that standpoint Porsche has done a great job. No, the Cayenne is not a sports car. But they've built a sporty, fun to drive SUV that at least puts some of the pleasure back in taking the car out on the road.....can't wait for mine to show up!!
02-02-2008, 12:34 PM
#33
Rennlist Member
I've owned a number of Porsches since the early 90's. I've got a Cayenne GTS on order, and am looking forward to it getting here. I find a lot of the negative comments about the Cayenne in general, and the GTS in particular, pretty entertaining.
For those who feel betrayed because Porsche built something that's not a sports car (yes, the Cayenne is big and heavy - it's supposed to be), I'd ask: why? Did building the Cayenne somehow detract from the rest of the line? Is a 997TT or Cayman S less of a car than it would have been had Porsche not been building the Cayenne? I certainly don't think so. And in fact, the income generated by the Cayenne helped Porsche design and build those other cars. I'm not seeing a negative here. Unless you just feel Porsche is therefore less "exclusive", in which case I have no idea what to say, because that factor means nothing to me. I don't care if soccer moms are driving Cayennes, too....that doesn't affect me. Why should it affect anyone?
For those that claim an SUV is only for offroad use, I gotta disagree. How about as a tow vehicle? How about as a family hauler that can accomodate a couple of kids and a 160 lb. dog, and do well in snow and rain? How about a utility vehicle that can carry a lot of stuff? The Cayenne can do all those - as can many SUVs. And I looked at almost all of them. The big advantage that the Cayenne S and Turbo have (obviously haven't driven a GTS yet, but I like living on the edge and ordered one anyway ) is that they're actually *fun* to drive. None of the other SUVs are. Even the X5, which is the only thing that comes moderately close, doesn't compare. For me, that's the most important factor. I LIKE to drive. And with a family, etc., I'm going to be in whatever SUV/family hauler I own a lot. I'd much rather have a Cayenne and enjoy that drive, than go out and buy any other SUV/station wagon/whatever and not enjoy the drive. So from that standpoint Porsche has done a great job. No, the Cayenne is not a sports car. But they've built a sporty, fun to drive SUV that at least puts some of the pleasure back in taking the car out on the road.....can't wait for mine to show up!!
For those who feel betrayed because Porsche built something that's not a sports car (yes, the Cayenne is big and heavy - it's supposed to be), I'd ask: why? Did building the Cayenne somehow detract from the rest of the line? Is a 997TT or Cayman S less of a car than it would have been had Porsche not been building the Cayenne? I certainly don't think so. And in fact, the income generated by the Cayenne helped Porsche design and build those other cars. I'm not seeing a negative here. Unless you just feel Porsche is therefore less "exclusive", in which case I have no idea what to say, because that factor means nothing to me. I don't care if soccer moms are driving Cayennes, too....that doesn't affect me. Why should it affect anyone?
For those that claim an SUV is only for offroad use, I gotta disagree. How about as a tow vehicle? How about as a family hauler that can accomodate a couple of kids and a 160 lb. dog, and do well in snow and rain? How about a utility vehicle that can carry a lot of stuff? The Cayenne can do all those - as can many SUVs. And I looked at almost all of them. The big advantage that the Cayenne S and Turbo have (obviously haven't driven a GTS yet, but I like living on the edge and ordered one anyway
) is that they're actually *fun* to drive. None of the other SUVs are. Even the X5, which is the only thing that comes moderately close, doesn't compare. For me, that's the most important factor. I LIKE to drive. And with a family, etc., I'm going to be in whatever SUV/family hauler I own a lot. I'd much rather have a Cayenne and enjoy that drive, than go out and buy any other SUV/station wagon/whatever and not enjoy the drive. So from that standpoint Porsche has done a great job. No, the Cayenne is not a sports car. But they've built a sporty, fun to drive SUV that at least puts some of the pleasure back in taking the car out on the road.....can't wait for mine to show up!!I agree and it cracks me up as I have seen this over the past 25+ years of Porsche ownership. The same blind mentality that could not accept a front engined water cooled Porsche or a water cooled 911 has now nothing to bash but the poor Cayenne. I find it ironic that so many Porsche fans couldn't handle the 996's water cooled engine (Which Porsche had to build because of increased HP and emissions regulations) Yet they had no issue with the 959, 962, GT1 cars having partially water cooled engines.
Who says Porsche has to build only 911's or only sports cars. IMO the 996 and 997 N/A cars are far more GT's than true sports cars. So why can't Porsche build a sport SUV. MB throws a monster engine in their G wagon which is the ugliest box on the road today and looks no different than the one I drove 30 years ago. The cayenne is a great vehicle and I am looking forward to the introduction of the Panamera. Not saying i am going to buy one but this is a new direction for the company and so far IMO whatever tangent they take they have conquered.
I have driven almost every model Porsche made to date and I for one prefer my CT over a N/A 996 any day of the week. Why? It offers me similar driving experience and has the room I need to carry my family and stuff that no 911 could ever match, even better it is one of the best cars in inclement weather I have ever driven. Last night i had a 50 mile drive in a torrential downpour. The CT was amazing. As other cars were driving 30 mph below the speed limit, the CT cut through it like nothing. No concern for emergency braking as it handled everything perfectly. My Chevy would have been a nightmare to drive under the same conditions.
I said it in the other thread the author has his head up his **** and I guess the funny rhino comment amuses some but just shows his ignorance of the vehicles abilities to me.
Long live the Cayenne.
02-02-2008, 12:52 PM
#34
Rennlist Member
I have driven almost every model Porsche made to date and I for one prefer my CT over a N/A 996 any day of the week. Why? It offers me similar driving experience and has the room I need to carry my family and stuff that no 911 could ever match, even better it is one of the best cars in inclement weather I have ever driven. Last night i had a 50 mile drive in a torrential downpour. The CT was amazing. As other cars were driving 30 mph below the speed limit, the CT cut through it like nothing. No concern for emergency braking as it handled everything perfectly. My Chevy would have been a nightmare to drive under the same conditions.
Long live the Cayenne.
Long live the Cayenne.
Excellent post Anthony! Agree with you 101%.
I just hate to read another Cayenne bashing post. The author is extremely short-sighted and probably depressed and has too much free time. There are too many cars and trucks on the road that I don't like and will never buy, but I will never, and don't have any time to bash about them. I would rather spend my time enjoying my CTT drive...
02-02-2008, 11:08 PM
#35
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Excellent post Anthony! Agree with you 101%.
I just hate to read another Cayenne bashing post. The author is extremely short-sighted and probably depressed and has too much free time. There are too many cars and trucks on the road that I don't like and will never buy, but I will never, and don't have any time to bash about them. I would rather spend my time enjoying my CTT drive...
I just hate to read another Cayenne bashing post. The author is extremely short-sighted and probably depressed and has too much free time. There are too many cars and trucks on the road that I don't like and will never buy, but I will never, and don't have any time to bash about them. I would rather spend my time enjoying my CTT drive...
...the guy CLEARLY never driven Cayenne for more, than an hour of test drive...he probably drives his own VW Golf "like" every day and tries to OVEREXAGGERATE Cayenne negatives... Cayenne is NOT perfect, but CLOSER to the ideal practical EVERYDAY allweather utility CARlike behaving SUV.
http://www.rennteam.com/showflat.php...&page=0#414340
OZRacing
02-04-2008, 05:37 PM
#37
Still plays with cars.
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Bravo to COBRIEN. My wife will be one of the first to get a GTS 6 spd manual in about a month. She likes to drive. Her "other" car is a 997GT3RS. The lack of a manual tranny has been the show stopper for several years now. Finally a car which is properly involving.
The SUV is a practical vehicle. She wants to space to haul stuff. I want to weight and power to pull stuff. We won't go offroad and I doubt that many SUVs ever go offroad - this is to say, places where I could not drive a regular car. That being said, why not lower it and improve its on road handling? Because it is an "SUV" does it have to be on stilts?
DeLorenzo has been angry with Porsche ever since they dropped out of the Detroit auto show. His ranting about Weideking ruining the brand is nonsense. Porsche was on the verge of bankruptcy in the early 90's. Now they are very healthy, thus assuring us of a supply of things like the GT3 and the RS.
For those who bemoan the fact that the 997 and TT have become too comfortable and civilized, have you noticed the GT3? Since 1973, how many RS cars have ever made it to North America? There was the RS America in the 964 series and that was it until 2004 and the 996 GT3.
Back to the Cayenne, yes it is heavy. Try towing a race car or a horse with an SUV which weighs the same or less than the load it is pulling.
A lightweight Cayenne with a tow rating of 2000 lbs would be a station wagon, more or less. How does that play with those who complain about the mass of the Cayenne?
Regards,
The SUV is a practical vehicle. She wants to space to haul stuff. I want to weight and power to pull stuff. We won't go offroad and I doubt that many SUVs ever go offroad - this is to say, places where I could not drive a regular car. That being said, why not lower it and improve its on road handling? Because it is an "SUV" does it have to be on stilts?
DeLorenzo has been angry with Porsche ever since they dropped out of the Detroit auto show. His ranting about Weideking ruining the brand is nonsense. Porsche was on the verge of bankruptcy in the early 90's. Now they are very healthy, thus assuring us of a supply of things like the GT3 and the RS.
For those who bemoan the fact that the 997 and TT have become too comfortable and civilized, have you noticed the GT3? Since 1973, how many RS cars have ever made it to North America? There was the RS America in the 964 series and that was it until 2004 and the 996 GT3.
Back to the Cayenne, yes it is heavy. Try towing a race car or a horse with an SUV which weighs the same or less than the load it is pulling.
A lightweight Cayenne with a tow rating of 2000 lbs would be a station wagon, more or less. How does that play with those who complain about the mass of the Cayenne?
Regards,