Arun Rao

hi folks - i am in the market for my 1st porsche. i am looking at both caymans and boxsters. as far as boxsters go, i have the following promising candidates. thoughts on each one of them would be greatly appreciated:

"budget choice" - https://www.facebook.com/marketplace...ssenger_banner (2001 boxster, tiptronic, 99k miles)

"premium choices":

http://www.cammisa.net/detail-2004-p...-19133458.html (2004 boxster s, tiptronic, 28k miles)
https://www.porschelivermore.com/inv...ca29836u713233 (2006 boxster, tiptronic, 63k miles)
https://www.magautoinc.com/details/u...xster/56903670 (2006 boxster, tiptronic, 70k miles)
https://www.frontierford.com/used/Po...earchDepth=1:1 (2008 boxster, tiptronic, 80k miles)

thoughts/advice on the cars above would be greatly appreciated. thx.

mikefocke

It would help if we knew a bit about you, where you live, your mechanical ability, do you know a Porsche mechanic already, how long you think you will own the car, what kind of driving you will do.

I see Livermore mentioned so I presume the SF area.

I notice you are listing 4 cars that are being sold by dealers. I bought my 2 Boxsters at private sales from the owner where I could understand why they were being sold and what their maintenance history was. I don't like paying dealer commissions.

I'd trade miles driven (within reason) for a good maintenance history any day.

Look at this one https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/cto/d/san-jose-2006-porsche-boxster-excellent/6971777331.html or similar on craigslist or even ebay. It is a private sale, looks well maintained, seems straight forward. Is automatic. Only thing I notice about it is the tires for the 19" will be more expensive when you replace them.

Arun Rao

ahh, sorry about that. yes, some details about me: (1) sf bay area; (2) mechanical ability = nil; (3) yes, know a porsche mechanic already; (4) i keep my cars for a long time (i currently still drive 2000 honda civic that i purchased new in 2000); (5) this will become by daily driver; i won't be taking it out on the track.

good points, re: private sales v. dealers. how detailed a maintenance record should i look for?

thx for pointing me to the craigslist listing; i have reached out to the poster! that actually looks like my ideal car!

mikefocke

A history of a mechanic looking at the car on a regular basis, changing the oil about every 5k miles is ideal, and evidence of the mechanic finding a problem and solving the problem the first time is ideal.

Since you know a P-car mechanic, they are often a great source of recommendations if you let them know what you are looking for.

Brian in Tucson

What Mike says! He is a Porsche Sage. I guess I'd start with the $6000 one, gauge the seller. Have the PPI done (pre purchase inspection.) Don't get the cheapest PPI done, take it to a good Indie shop, there are lots of them in SF, San Jose, and the east bay. Anything it needs will add to the purchase price, repairs, seats, tires etc. Do you think the previous owners beat it? Hard to do, but possible with the tiptronic, but it can be done. 99,000 miles isn't that high for an 18 year old and for me at least money is a somewhat scarce commodity. I don't finance.

Which brings us to financing. Are you borrowing the money? In that case, I look for a combination of good price and lowest mileage. It's easiest to make monthly payment if the car isn't a nickle and dime money pit. And easier if the car isn't sitting 'cuz it's broken down. And shop for your financing, here in Tucson, I think I can do best at the Credit Union. Financing at used car dealers is usually obscene. Good credit and a good down payment with the credit union will go a long way.

Money you save will provide a stake for romantic trips with the top down (ie, down to Big Sur on Hwy. 1.)

Arun Rao

great advice! thx brian and mike.

i will be paying cash for the car.

i have dropped the $6000 car from consideration; it's a very nice car (well-maintained, etc.) but it seemed to lack power (it was mentioned to me that the 2001 version is better in manual form).

my top boxster candidate is now the one that mike pointed me to: https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/cto...971777331.html. i have settled on focusing on an "s" version after test driving a few more boxsters this past weekend..

sgt1372

Seems like you have your heart set on a mid-engine Porsche but if you like the Boxster front end you may also want to consider a 996 (which is criticized for looking like a Boxster) but has a real (albeit water cooled) 911 engine.

I just bought a 2000 C4 Cab for $15k (below low book) in SF. It was a consignment sale listed by a dealer on Craigslist. It needs a little work (mostly electronics and a few niggles here and there) but the car is cosmetically and mechanically sound, the IMS and clutch were recently done and the work that I think needs to be done does not affect the operation of the car and can be deferred. So, good deals on can be found, even at a dealer.

OBTW, if you are considering Gen 1 (1996-2004) Boxters/Caymans that use the same single row IMS bearing that was used on the 996, you need to make sure that the IMS upgrade was done on it.

Most IMS bearings do not fail but some do and you don't want to be the one of those w/one that fails. Make sure they can show you a service record proving that the IMS was done. If not, take a hard pass on the car no matter how much you like it. Catastrophic failure of the IMS will almost certainly require an engine replacement that will cost you (by most estimates) $10-15k; maybe $5-10k if you can find a good deal on a used engine and are handy.

Also, if you don't know anything about cars generally and Porsches specifically, a PPI (pre purchase inspection) would be highly recommended, preferably by an authorized Porsche dealer or at least a specialized Porsche indie shop. Here's a link to an article that offers some useful tips on what to look for in buying a used Boxster: Everything You Need To Know To Buy a Used Boxster.

Good luck!

Brian in Tucson

:Pretty decent price for an 06, and if all the maintenance has been done, 89,000 miles isn't that much. Good luck with it.

Macster

Don't have the time to evaluate the choices.

My advice is you need to decide if you want a Boxster -- the top down experience is that important to your enjoyment of driving -- or if a Cayman will float your boat. While I owned a 2002 Boxster and loved it I was not a top down driving fan. I wanted the rear engine layout and the Cayman was not yet available. In 2008 I bought a Cayman S but an accident claimed it after just 4 weeks.

While I have not bought a used Boxster or Cayman I bought a used 996 Turbo. In my shopping I wanted a factory stock car with paperwork documenting good servicing and showing the car received some "love". I didn't get the documentation but with a CarFax report I knew where the car spent its 6 years -- SF bay area -- and I called the dealers in the area and found some who had worked on the car and without my trying to learn anything about the owner shared the car's history. I was satisifed the car had been serviced reasonably well. That it was low miles (<10K) and came with a 2 year/100K miles CPO warranty also eased my concerns.

In your case you need to subject the car to a thorough used car check out. Below is something on this you might find of some value:
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My general advice is to visit the car cold, check the oil level from inside the car, which should only require 5 seconds. (Or use the dipstick if one present.)

In the car start the engine. Be sure all warning lights come on and then go off once the engine has started. Pay particular attention to the CEL. Be sure the A/C is off. You test the A/C later.

Let the engine idle from cold. You want to listen for any signs of ticking/noises or any other signs the engine may not be healthy. A rough idle, backfires, spitting back, anything out of the ordinary.

Get out of the car and walk around the car checking body panel finish, alignment, and gaps. Note the condition of the wheels, looking for any curb rash. Check the tires. Ideally they should be factory sanctioned tires and in good condition. Check the brakes, look at the rotors for signs of damage/excessive wear. A 1mm lip around the rotor outer diameter is a sign of the rotor being worn enough to be replaced.

Check the hood and trunk hinges for any signs the fasteners have had wrenches on them. At the front carefully the bolts that hold the fenders to the chassis/tub and check the fasteners at the top of the struts for any sign of wrenching.

Look inside the radiator ducts. If full of trash budget for a bumper removal and a trash clean out. The trash won't affect cooling but can lead to corrosion of the condenser and radiator.

After some few minutes -- the longer the better -- of the engine idling and with the engine still running ok and sounding ok have the seller take you on a test ride. The route should be around 15 miles long and chosen to give the driver a chance to demo the car as you intend to use it. What is wanted is a mix of city driving with stop and go, steady moderate speed cruising on like a boulevard, and some highway/freeway driving.

If equipped with an automatic while it is still "cold" have the driver perform an K-turn to see how the transmission responds to repeated and rapid changes in direction.

Ideally there should be some opportunities -- once the engine is up to temperature -- for some rather hard acceleration with the driver starting out from a standstill or a slow roll and accelerating hard up through at least a couple of gears. No need to smoke the tires or try to duplicate the factory's 0 to 60mph time but you want to experience the engine under hard acceleration to verify it pulls good, runs right, and afterwards shows no ill effects from the hard acceleration.

While a passenger of course pay attention to how the transmission shifts, how the car rides, feels. The car should not want to pull to one side or the other and the hard acceleration should give the driver a chance to perform a hard braking. No tire lock up but you want to verify the brakes have plenty of bite and the car tracks straight under hard braking.

With the automatic transmission up to temperature, or at least warmer -- have the driver do the K-turn test again.

After the 15 mile test ride then back at the starting point -- leaving the engine running -- get behind the wheel and drive the car over the same 15 mile test route and drive it pretty much the same way although since the car is unknown to you you can dial back on the hard acceleration test. You don't want to let the car get away from you and wrap it around a telephone pole.

After your 15 mile test drive then at the starting point if you still like the car confirm all systems work. From the head lights to the tail lights. From the horn to the back up camera (if fitted). The A/C. Check all the controls. The wipers. Manually operate the spoiler. Operate the top. Check everything.

Ideally you would want to show up able to remove the Torx fasteners that secure the plastic covers on either side of the battery so you can remove these covers and check for any signs of water backing up in the front body water drains.

When you check the top as you open the top when the clam shell gets as elevated as it can be stop and get out and check the rear body water drains. There is one located on either side of the top under the clam shell arm.

Check the door bottoms for any signs of dampness. If damp this is a sign the door membrane is bad and should be replaced. (If one bad both should be replaced.)

While you are checking for dampness check under both seats for any signs of moisture. A water drain overflow, a leaking door membrane, a leaking top, a leaking weather strip seal can let water in the cabin and the security module is on the cabin floor under I think the driver's seat. So if you detect any signs of moisture my advice is to walk away from the car.

At this point if you still like the car and believe you can buy it for a good price -- based on your market research -- it is good idea to arrange to have the car given a pre-purchase inspection (PPI) by a tech who is qualified to evaluate the car. A Porsche dealer tech can be used. These guys evaluate trade ins all the time.

This gets the car in the air so a check can be made for any leak sign. At the same time a check can be made for any signs of damage or damage repair.

The idle time, test ride followed by a test drive give you an opportunity to really experience the car in its natural state: engine running and on the road. All cars generally look good on the lot. But it is how they look and run and feel and sound and smell on the road, or after being on the road, that really matters.

Unless the seller can supply paper work the services are current make a list of services "due" and budget for various services: oil/filter, brake fluid flush/bleed (due every 2 years), plugs maybe, transmission/diff fluid change, maybe even a drain and refill of the cooling system. (This every 4 years or so really helps preserve the water pump seals and hoses.)

Tires should be factory sanctioned tires and in good condition. If tires are worn unevenly budget for new tires and an alignment assuming wear is not severe enough to suspect the car's bent. In this case you don't want an alignment you want to walk away from the car.

With my 2002 I never bothered to replace the IMSB. The car racked up 317K miles on the original IMSB. This of course is no guarantee the car you select will have the same luck. (You can of course shop 2009 and later Boxsters/Caymans which do not have the IMSB issue.)

My preference would be to get a car that has not had the IMSB addressed then have this done after you buy the car, if you believe this worth doing. My thinking is if you have this done you can pick the best IMSB "solution" based on your research and then pick where the work is done and what is done and have some feeling the job was done right.

Remember these things: Price is not fact only an opinion. And there is always another car. If you find something seriously negative about this car don't feel you have to buy it. There is another car out there you'll like just as much if not more than this one and it won't have any negatives.

Arun Rao

folks - thx a bunch for the great advice. i am still waiting to hear back from the person who posted https://sfbay.craigslist.org/sby/cto...971777331.html :-(

meanwhile i found this 2009 987.2 boxster - https://www.enzoautosales.com/inventory/view/11826139/ i was told on the cayman/cayman s forum that the 2009 model with the 2.9L engine and the PDK transmission has comparable performance to the S models with the tip transmission. any thoughts on this particular vehicle would be appreciated? the paint job (black stripes down the middle) give me pause, but i don't mind checking the car out in person.

feedback appreciated! :-) thx again, folks.

Shawn Stanford

I'm a little late to this thread, but I'm going to chime in.

1. 986 Boxsters are cheap right now. That '01 on FB Marketplace is a good deal, but just as good a deal will come along in a few weeks. Don't beat yourself up or pull the trigger on a car you don't really want because you feel like you're running out of time.
2. Don't be afraid of higher miles. I wouldn't touch a 986 Boxster with less than 80k miles. Two reasons: If the IMS goes, it normally goes in the 60k to 80k mile range, and a first gen car with low miles hasn't been driven hard enough. In my opinion, the sweet spot for early cars is 80k-110k miles. I have two at home, one with 116k (daughter's car) and one with 186k (my car). They both run great. (Bonus reason to look for a car with around 100k: People with low-mile early cars think that adds value, so the prices are a lot higher.)
3. Don't be afraid to wrench on it. These cars are easy to work on. There are forums with great people, a ton of YouTube videos, and some great reference books. Most of the repairs you're likely to need can be done in your driveway with $100 worth of Harbor Freight tools.
4. With normal maintenance, these cars are as reliable as any car in the world. Buy it and drive it like a Honda; you'll both be happier.

Good luck with your search!

wizee

Is there a particular reason you’ve been focused on Tiptronic? They’re cheaper, but that’s because people generally don’t want them. They’re slower, heavier, and less satisfying to drive than their manual counterparts. I won’t criticize the PDK, but a Tiptronic really detracts from these cars..

The direct drive and quick shifts of the 987.2 PDK should give it 0-60 times similar to a 987.1 S Tiptronic, but for different reasons. PDK is efficient and quick shifting, whereas the S just has more torque. At higher speeds, a 987.1 would easily pull away from a 987.2 PDK because of the torque, even with a Tiptronic, regarless of the quick shifting PDK.

Also be aware: 2007-2008 987.1 Boxster S models had increased risk for bore scoring, and unlike the IMS bearing there’s little you can do to prevent this failure. It just happens to some cars.

My suggestion: try to find a 2006 Boxster S with a manual transmission. 2006 avoids the single row IMS issues (2001-2005) and the bore scoring issues (2007-2008).

paulofto

Or look for a 2009 or 2010 987.2 with PDK if an automatic is what you want. They have none of the above issues and you get tha added bonus of a DFI engine. Downside is there are fewer of these cars available. Anything newer will start to cost appreciably more.

Brian in Tucson

Both my cars are automatics. I live in a city with no cross town freeways, the automatics really make living with traffic lites (every 3/4 to 1 mile) possible.

Arun Rao

Yes - this is the primary reason I would like an automatic. This car is likely to be both my "fun car" and my daily driver.

I found this listing for a 2009 Boxster S pdk:

https://www.pmautogroupsd.com/invent...oxster/730131/

Cons on this one: some damage (scrapes) on the left rear and not the color (blue) I exactly want.

Thoughts?