If you could configure a New Porsche specifically for Autocrossing, which model would you choose and what options would you pick? I'm thinking about a Cayman. I'm confused whether to order pdk, pasm, pccb etc. Not going to be tracking the car, just autox in a stock class. Any suggestions would be helpful.

 

What are the class rules? Are you looking for the best time or best time in class?

Budget?

 

Classing is a big issue because one Porsche may be faster than another, but if classed against
even faster cars, may make you less happy... For brand-new cars, the Cayman S and R, and
GT3 are likeliest candidates, and as to options, lighter is better.

 

Is PDK an advantage in Autox? PCCB's reduce weight, will they hold up in repeated use for autox?

 

It doesn't look like there are many nationally competitive new models, however a Cayman is decent regional level A stock car.

 

A fully restored 914-6 would be my preference ...

 

Autocross doesn't stress brakes at all. I've seen guys modify their cars
to have smaller brakes to save weight. Shifting gears is so rare in autocross
that it would not be worth the extra weight.

 

True, but the reasons is the time to shift often takes longer than gain from the lower gear. If can shift very very fast and very accurately then changing gears during a run may become and effective tool to maximize power to the ground.

 

I'd go for a Cayman hands down. Something like a GT3 would obviously be much faster on the open track but doesn't seem to work as well for the tight corners on an autocross course. Let me put it this way, whenever my local PCA sets up a tighter course I end up beating this guy with a brand new GT3 RS in my '87 944 every time.

Of course driving ability has a big role in autox too. I don't know how experienced you are but if you are just starting a higher end 911 will actually slow you down since they are much harder to drive.

 

I will look for a used Cayman S. Thanks

 

Extremely unlikely. It is just rarely worth it to be off the gas, even for that little (micro)second.

 

It's been discussed on some other threads lately also, so you should be able to find some info by searching or just reading some of the newer threads. You haven't specified enough however -- "best" meaning most fun, fastest raw time, or most competitive in its class? Which series (SCCA, PCA, other)? I'll assume SCCA and competitive in class.

997 GT3 goes straight to ASP, so unlikely to be competitive out of the box. The 996 GT3 (2004-2005) is very competitive in SS, arguably one of the top 3 cars (lumping all the Corvettes together, and the Elises). All assuming very good drivers. I've heard the new Boxster Spyder is good in SS, but no data to back that up. A new Cayman S for SS will do well regionally, but I think it's outclassed at the national level. I think any of the SS 997's will get beat handily by the 996 GT3 if they're both class legal.

For AS, the 996 40th AE is probably the best 911. Regionally and at some tours the 2006-2008 Cayman S does very well. How do they compete against each other? I'd love to see. Both sound good to me, the C5 Corvette being the prime opposition.

I haven't heard of the BS Porsches doing real well. The S2000's are good for autocross, classed advantageously, there are lots of them, and they're relatively easy to acquire and set up. Probably not the easiest to drive at top speed (narrow power band and tendency to oversteer), but drivers can adapt.

For Rudeboy's comparison, based solely on SCCA classing: GT3's being in SS and ASP, and 944's being in CS/ES and BSP, with GT3's being competitive in both classes and 944's not so much as far as I can see, given equal drivers and setup, any GT3 should be trouncing a 944 (at least until we go into prepared or mod classes). Of course they're not equal drivers and setup. With my factory stock 2004 C4S on street tires I've regularly beaten an A-mod car and big Hoosier-shod ASP Corvettes, but I know the cars are easily capable of beating me. I've also had a poor track record against an STS Miata, which I attribute solely to his car setup .

PCCB would be great for the weight savings, but dang that's expensive weight loss. The only time autocross stresses brakes is if you're learning to left-foot brake and doing it wrong. But PCCB's point for autocross is the big reduction in rotating mass (about 44 pounds, 34 pounds total unsprung, different on different models). If you have the money.... Perhaps better spent on tires, seat time, and instruction.

I'll fall in the PDK would be nice if it were free camp. I didn't realize it had a weight penalty (~66 pounds I hear) which is too bad. The launch control would be spiffy but probably not worth much at regular autocrosses. On the courses we run here I used to have to shift in the STi, occasionally to third (would be much rarer in my 911), and tight cones sometimes would be best in 1st even though I hated doing it. It could be done while braking so there was no real loss, just risk and loss of concentration, plus the car got super squirrely in 1st, then you had to shift back to 2nd which typically is a bit of a loss. In 7 autocrosses here with the C4S I've only shifted on one of them, which had a long decreasing sweeper that ended in a opposite direction tight slow sweep to the finish. I went to first during the braking on the decreasing radius and stayed there until the finish, hitting rev limiter as or after I crossed the lights. With R compounds I could have had more speed and perhaps could better use 2nd gear, or maybe just better driving (another 0.4s and I would have got top PAX, but no national champs at the event either). As it was, I think 1st gained me time in the last bit, but was annoying as all heck to shift to while trail braking then smoothly getting back on the power. PDK would have done it far better than my shaky skills. If it didn't have the weight penalty I'd say definitely worth it even if you only use it every 5th autocross. With 66 pounds ... much more dubious.

Edit: Noting that I have never driven a PDK Porsche, never autocrossed one, never ridden in one, and have heard no comments from well-known SCCA drivers who have used one. Most of the comments on PDK I've heard have been either spirited-driving or track use, where my takeaway is that objectively PDK is faster, but subjectively the manual is preferred by most. But now we're into a whole different discussion. My thought is (1) I believe there are cases where going to 1st gear for certain sections on some courses is faster if all other things are equal, and (2) PDK removes most of the bothersome issues with shifting (time, concentration, rev matching, mis-shifts). I'll grant that #1 might be less common than some believe.

 

I've never mastered the SCCA rules.. but I don't think you could get a cayman with a LSD till '10? maybe '09? Having an LSD would be key to getting the HP down. Not sure you can "add" one to an earlier car and still stay in the stock class.

imho, the $$ premium for PCCBs isn't worth the wieght savings vs the steel brakes. (then again, I don't run top level SCCA )

PDK can get paired with Launch control, and Porsche specs tend to show PDK car accelerates quicker than a stick. So you would launch out of the start gate better. Also, with PDK, you might be more inclined to LFB more/easier than a Manual trans car. So, maybe the 66lb weight penalty cancels out over the run as well.

924S can do well in E-stock.. if its an '88 "lemans" edition that came with larger wheels, lighter interior, sports suspension etc. Still, against MR2s and Miatas it'd be a tough road. Cheaper budget though

 

Riz: Good decision on the used Cayman S (or Boxster S) for SCCA A Stock. They were quite competitive nationally in AS last season, while the newer models were not competitive in Super Stock. The SS class earlier Boxster S and Cayman S were moved down from SS (where they were not at all competitive nationally) to AS. Fortunately, the Honda S2000 that dominated AS previously was also moved down to BS where it's even more dominant.

As for configuration, I ordered my '06 CS new with autocrossing and track in mind. I ordered PASM, Sport Chrono, sport steering wheel, sport seats, and 18" wheels/tires. I run in Sport Mode with PSM off. In SCCA stock classes, we're allowed to run R-comp tires. We can also change shocks (but not springs), exhaust (cat-back only), and a few other things, but I've been running the CS as it came, except for as an aggressive alignment as I can get with the stock configuration.

 

For A Stock either a Cayman S with no options maybe only sport seats and sports steering wheel, or a 996 Anniversary Ed. for SS a cayman R, Boxster Spyder or a 996 GT3