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lol! I’ve installed a few GT3 suspension pieces as well as aftermarket mods with coilovers a couple years ago. 😜 The car also was ordered with pccbs that are same as gt3 as well as RAS and I have put wider wheels and tires on the car. The big adjustable GT3 sway bars just went in. I had weeny non adjustable stock Swaybars with oem end links prior. Now the car is pretty dang close to GT3 in terms of handling. Something I observe over and over with good gt3 drivers is that they can come out of turn full power and hold rear end in a power slide . I could never do that in my Carrera prior to big front bar. It was like magic in autocross this weekend I came out of turn dropped hammer and I could feel both rear tires staying hooked up and rather than needing to let off I just stayed on go pedal with no drama . I know it’s the bar as that’s only change I made recently. I had just underestimated how critical bigger bar on the car would be.
I absolutely love your car and what you've done to it! As for a big bar on the front, S2000 guys had to do this in auto-x to basically keep the inside rear tire down giving them traction out of the turns. Seems to be similar with the 911.
I absolutely love your car and what you've done to it! As for a big bar on the front, S2000 guys had to do this in auto-x to basically keep the inside rear tire down giving them traction out of the turns. Seems to be similar with the 911.
There's more to unpack here than the correlation to the S2000. There are a bunch of SCCA street class cars that the go-to formula involves a huge front bar, because the rules encourage you to build a car using the only ***** you have to turn. Not necessairly the way one should build a car if they wanted a well rounded sports car.
In this case, it's nice that the front sway bar helped out! We've found there to be a limit to what the cars will tolerate for large front sway bar and still be *fun to drive*. Seems like the OP didn't reach that limit for his driving style, so that's great.
SCCA addage: Put the biggest front sway bar you can on the car, and do whatever it takes with the shocks and bump stops to make sure the car will still rotate, and put times on the clock.
Old timer's suspension setup addage: Make changes to the end of the car that has the problem - ie, not necessarily adding a huge front bar to fix a probelm at the rear end of the car.
There's more to unpack here than the correlation to the S2000. There are a bunch of SCCA street class cars that the go-to formula involves a huge front bar, because the rules encourage you to build a car using the only ***** you have to turn. Not necessairly the way one should build a car if they wanted a well rounded sports car.
In this case, it's nice that the front sway bar helped out! We've found there to be a limit to what the cars will tolerate for large front sway bar and still be *fun to drive*. Seems like the OP didn't reach that limit for his driving style, so that's great.
SCCA addage: Put the biggest front sway bar you can on the car, and do whatever it takes with the shocks and bump stops to make sure the car will still rotate, and put times on the clock.
Old timer's suspension setup addage: Make changes to the end of the car that has the problem - ie, not necessarily adding a huge front bar to fix a probelm at the rear end of the car.
YMMV
Not exactly a huge front bar relative to GT3 - Just OEM GT3 bar with ability to adjust settings. The car currently has less tire and more torque than most SSP prepped gt3s which puts a real premium on getting rear tires to stay planted. I’m working on getting more tire under the car - pretty sure can get 325 rear and 295 front eventually. Im working on fender roll. My driving at SCCA sucks as I can never get up to speed in 3 runs. When I have more time I can set ttod at some local events . My first event with bigger bars was able to do ttod. Still biggest mod will be more seat time which I am working on now.
…..as far as car goes it’s a blast! Has about same feeling as my 2000 lb prepared class race cars and it’s faster in straight line. The newer 911s are just amazing once they are setup properly. The difference between the stock Carrera t to what it is now is amazing.
Not exactly a huge front bar relative to GT3 - Just OEM GT3 bar with ability to adjust settings. The car currently has less tire and more torque than most SSP prepped gt3s which puts a real premium on getting rear tires to stay planted. I’m working on getting more tire under the car - pretty sure can get 325 rear and 295 front eventually. Im working on fender roll. My driving at SCCA sucks as I can never get up to speed in 3 runs. When I have more time I can set ttod at some local events . My first event with bigger bars was able to do ttod. Still biggest mod will be more seat time which I am working on now.
…..as far as car goes it’s a blast! Has about same feeling as my 2000 lb prepared class race cars and it’s faster in straight line. The newer 911s are just amazing once they are setup properly. The difference between the stock Carrera t to what it is now is amazing.
All the power and tire in the world will never make up for this.
Yup. "Get it done in three" is the name of that game and, compared to everything else, the hardest part by far.
Take the results at any regional/local and rework them for only 3 runs and you find a big gap.
yep I’m a slow learner but have decent car control. I understand game for SCCA events. Most of my enjoyment comes from 10-12 run days where I figure it out. The car is right in there once I get course figured out.. I can occasionally rip off a fast run in 3 but just haven’t been doing enough in past 4 years between Covid and my home being damaged in wild fires . I’m back driving now so really hoping to get my ability to figure things out quickly back.
All the power and tire in the world will never make up for this.
I have been going quicker since I added tire and power. Both driving and car setup go hand in hand in this sport. Certainly driving is a big part of it but can’t ignore optimized setup. Most of cars I’ve setup have podiumed at national/regional tour events and hillclimbs. This car won’t be any different once I’m finished I just got delayed with recovering from wild fires that hit my home. Now I have time to build this thing into fast street legal class autocross and hillclimb car.
the 991.2 Carrera is under appreciated platform that once I get it figurEd out will be quite fast.
Grantsfo, thanks for posting. This is very useful and fun information. Have you made any further development on your car? I too am getting back into autocross and trying to decide on making changes to my 992T, RAS, Manual or getting a vette for about the price of mods on the 992. I autocrossed a C5 fixed roof coupe for a couple of years. It was fast, fun reliable and cheap. Certainly no T but still fun.
Fun read and I appreciate your persistence, but your last sentence stating you now have time to build a fast street legal autocross and hillclimb car. I would add Time Trials to the list, as you will find ( whether running with SCCA or NASA ) that your autocross time will translate to feeling a road course is a slow motion film. You will know what spots you need to hit as all those cones taught you where you needed to be second after second, and now you will have a multitude of time to set up for the next corner or braking zone. I may be going down the same road , as I will likely be setting up my Cayman GTS to the point that I would have to run in SSP, but as that would be a secondary focus I am not too concerned as I am already fully aware it is not the right car for the Class. I have had plenty experience, of late, realizing what cars are stout in SSP as I am the " Official Tirewarmer " for my son in SSP, and we drive a .............EVO 9.
Nasty Class with lots of uber talent and it sounds like you have already conquered the main goal of many who autocross, you are having fun. Keep posting and I have a strong feeling we will have a kinship, as neither of our cars is the Alpha Dog , but on those days we do beat others they have to go home and tell their friends they got beat by the mutt, ha!
Fun read and I appreciate your persistence, but your last sentence stating you now have time to build a fast street legal autocross and hillclimb car. I would add Time Trials to the list, as you will find ( whether running with SCCA or NASA ) that your autocross time will translate to feeling a road course is a slow motion film. You will know what spots you need to hit as all those cones taught you where you needed to be second after second, and now you will have a multitude of time to set up for the next corner or braking zone. I may be going down the same road , as I will likely be setting up my Cayman GTS to the point that I would have to run in SSP, but as that would be a secondary focus I am not too concerned as I am already fully aware it is not the right car for the Class. I have had plenty experience, of late, realizing what cars are stout in SSP as I am the " Official Tirewarmer " for my son in SSP, and we drive a .............EVO 9.
Nasty Class with lots of uber talent and it sounds like you have already conquered the main goal of many who autocross, you are having fun. Keep posting and I have a strong feeling we will have a kinship, as neither of our cars is the Alpha Dog , but on those days we do beat others they have to go home and tell their friends they got beat by the mutt, ha!
Thanks I have developed a couple national podium and hillclimb record setting level prepared class cars in past as well as a podium placing endurance road racing car. SSP is a tough nut to crack for sure if I had patience to develop car for SSP I’m sure it would be competitive . However now I think car is moving to SSM or XS in next phase of my build as I really enjoy tinkering with things that haven’t been done with Carrera platform. I run mostly pca events now and car already is running pretty much unlimited. I’m not a 3 run and get it done type of driver in autocross so no delusions of me ever doing well in a scca national level event. But I have tons of fun making the car faster regardless of class. Now just making car as fast as possible while staying street legal.
Love the color as I have owned my share of orange cars, and great shots lifting the wheels on the Carrera! I can completely understand your thoughts on developing your car in SSP and those of us who do Time Trials, Race, or autocross are always wondering where our cars may land with SCCA, ha. I am a bit spoiled living in Nebraska since the Cone Courses are often close to a mile long as we have access for Nebraska Region events at the Nationals site. Most weekends there is a test and tune on Saturday, with the autocross on Sunday , and we usually get 5 runs , so it is a bit more advantageous than the typical event. That said, I still want more time running, so I am not a 3 lap and done guy
for Time Trials, regardless of whether that is smart or not, I paid for 15-20 minute sessions and I plan to use all my entry fee, ha.
I look forward to hearing about your future mods and do you also run your Boxster S on track/autocross?
The 981 Boxster S is our weekend getaway car and is 100% stock on 300 treadwear tires. Both my wife and I have autocrossed the boxster S. Fun car right out of the box so to speak. I’m fairly spoiled too as we have a new venue that has 60 second autocross courses under an hour from my place. 2 hours away is crows landing which is like your surface in Lincoln and just as much room. I get about 12 runs at pca autocrosses which really makes me lazy when it comes to 3 and done . I also have two premiere tracks Laguna Seca and Sonoma close by for track days. Hillclimbs are few hours north of me. Hoping to do more next season as my car is almost ready. Just need my cage installed and I need to get new driving suit and HANS device before I hit the hills again.
Here is my previous boxster autocross and hillclimb car with me at wheel at solo nationals about a decade ago.
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05-30-2023, 02:24 AM
