Notices
997 GT2/GT3 Forum 2005-2012
Sponsored by:
Sponsored by: Porsche North Houston

WOW!! A technical suspension question/discussion

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 09-30-2014 | 05:36 PM
  #16  
996FLT6's Avatar
996FLT6
Rennlist Member
 
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 14,762
Likes: 262
From: san francisco
Default

Go one more hole stiffer in the rear 1st maybe even one whole softer for the front. U are rt that is a pushy swaybar set up. U better trailbrake well : ). Mike
Old 09-30-2014 | 06:32 PM
  #17  
Tom@TPC Racing's Avatar
Tom@TPC Racing
Premium Sponsor
Rennlist
Site Sponsor

 
Joined: Apr 2014
Posts: 3,437
Likes: 998
From: Jessup, MD
Default

Originally Posted by Protocav
DSC will adjust rear compression damping for this situation?
Absolutely. That's the Dynamic in DSC(Dynamic Suspension Control). Based on inputs(vehicle speed, throttle angle, steering angle, and lateral, longitudinal, and vertical g-force) it changes the damping force on each shock. In this situation it will increase rear compression only until the acceleration g-force spike peaks and then the compression will taper off accordingly. When the input load range is high enough it will momentarily increase front rebound as well. DSC Mode 3 makes these changes more pronounced than in Mode 2.
__________________
PCA National Instructor

TPC Racing stats:
2023 Porsche Sprint Challenge 992 Cup Am Champion
2023 Porsche Sprint Challenge GT4 Pro-Am Team Champion
2022 Porsche Sprint Challenge 992 Cup & 991 Cup Champion
2020 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge 2nd Championship
2018 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge 2nd Championship
2016 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge Champion
2013 IMSA GT3 Cup Challenge Champion
2006 Rolex-24 @ Daytona GT Champion
2004 Grand-Am SGS Class Champion





















Old 09-30-2014 | 06:54 PM
  #18  
modoz61's Avatar
modoz61
Racer
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 369
Likes: 3
From: East Coast Australia
Default

You mention loosing the tail into braking points

Have you had the LSD checked, the stock LSD doesn't last all that well
Old 09-30-2014 | 08:15 PM
  #19  
Bill Lehman's Avatar
Bill Lehman
Three Wheelin'
 
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 1,934
Likes: 230
Default

I'm thinking like 996FLT6, Soften the front bar one hole and see how you like it. I wouldn't just dial in over- steer with the rear bar.
Old 09-30-2014 | 08:38 PM
  #20  
Gofishracing's Avatar
Gofishracing
Race Car
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 3,935
Likes: 9
From: New Jersey
Default

Check out Carroll Smith's Engineer in your Pocket is a good reference for handling issues.
Old 09-30-2014 | 10:02 PM
  #21  
TRT41's Avatar
TRT41
Burning Brakes
 
Joined: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,077
Likes: 67
From: Dallas
Default

Originally Posted by Veloce Raptor
Let the car rotate a tiny bit more before going to power...and go to power more gradually...in order to keep the front tires from unweighting so dramatically & shrinking the front contact patches...
+1
Old 09-30-2014 | 10:17 PM
  #22  
Horizontally Opposed Man's Avatar
Horizontally Opposed Man
Rennlist Member
 
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 431
Likes: 5
From: Southern Pines NC
Default

Sounds to me like the back end is really hooking up well and you have some room to get some more grip in the front .You can try a lot of what's been suggested just try the suggestions one at a time.It is really fun to fly into corner entry like you're talking about but the big differentiator is corner EXIT speed.
Easy change would be one hole stiffer in the rear .
Big change would be raise rear ride height.
Anything you do to add front grip reduces rear grip.have fun!
Old 10-01-2014 | 12:44 AM
  #23  
sbelles's Avatar
sbelles
I'm in....
Rennlist Member
 
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 12,129
Likes: 265
From: Here some and there some
Default

I've always been told if the problem is on entry, work on the front. If it's on exit, work on the rear.
Old 10-01-2014 | 03:49 AM
  #24  
mooty's Avatar
mooty
GT3 player par excellence
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
 
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 43,566
Likes: 5,898
From: san francisco
Default

u need to hire a better coach. not all pros can coach.
driving fast has NOTHING to do with coaching.
Old 10-01-2014 | 04:27 AM
  #25  
BBMGT3's Avatar
BBMGT3
Addict
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
 
Joined: Mar 2011
Posts: 1,233
Likes: 4
Default

lift rear ride height a pinch

or drop front

id say lift rear a couple of mm
Old 10-01-2014 | 07:27 AM
  #26  
RamVA's Avatar
RamVA
Racer
 
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 332
Likes: 0
Default

Do the bars - one stiffer in the rear and one softer in the front. It's free and easy to do, so I'd do that before you do anything else. Your setup is extremely pushy and seems to be covering up some other problem (rear toe or diff, I'd guess).
Old 10-01-2014 | 11:06 AM
  #27  
Mvez's Avatar
Mvez
Rennlist Member
 
Joined: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,665
Likes: 275
From: Louisville, KY
Default

Originally Posted by Veloce Raptor
Let the car rotate a tiny bit more before going to power...and go to power more gradually...in order to keep the front tires from unweighting so dramatically & shrinking the front contact patches...
+1.

Also, for a ~50mph corner, if you are in 3rd gear, you will have a ton of rear grip, and you can't get the car to rotate on throttle because you are too low in the powerband, and you will have to use the technique stated above.

Perfect example is the Keyhole at Mid-O. With our cars (gearing), the fastest way is using 2nd gear on entry to exit, but it requires you not overslow on entry, and be aggressive on throttle. It rotates the car perfectly, usually with a slight oversteer correction right at track out curbing, but you have to get comfortable with going flat a lot earlier than you think, to use the throttle to rotate the car more. In 3rd, you just can't do this, as the car will simply understeer because you are too low in the powerband to rotate on aggressive throttle.

For slow corners that allow it (on exit), try 2nd gear.....you have up to about 85mph. It's just a bit more difficult because people tend to overslow the car when going down to 2nd.

Plus, slow 2nd gear corners are just fun when you get bored with trying for fast laps and just want to be a hooligan
Old 10-01-2014 | 01:04 PM
  #28  
Protocav's Avatar
Protocav
Thread Starter
Rennlist Member
 
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 495
Likes: 19
From: SD, CA
Default

Guys, this is all really great stuff, thank you. To keep things simple, I will make a small sway Bar change for my upcoming track day and play with it throughout the day to see if I like it. The last thing that makes the situation difficult is that I autocross this car as well, and like the car with a bunch of rear grip. Corner exit is not as important at AX since the turns don’t “typically” lead onto long straights, but instead into an immediate turn. When driven aggressively (to get the car to rotate around the cones) my current setup allows the car to stick really well, but pushes at exit.

I may have to run the front bar a little softer at AX for corner exit, and see if that benefits me at the big track as well. I always try to have a single setup that works well everywhere, but I guess that’s a little ambitious.

Some have asked about the LSD…well, the car has 30K on it and the LSD is original. I know it’s toast, but going with a guard diff right now isn't an option so I’m doing what I can with the suspension adjustment.

Thanks again for everyone’s input!
Old 10-01-2014 | 02:44 PM
  #29  
996FLT6's Avatar
996FLT6
Rennlist Member
 
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 14,762
Likes: 262
From: san francisco
Default

If LSD is toast it really sucks on track. Do the non scientific test. Jack up one rear wheel with ebrake off a piece of plywood on front tire so it doesn't roll. Try to spin the jacked up wheel cw or ccw. If no resistance pretty sure it's toast. With my guard lsd could not budge either way. If squirrley braking sounds like its going bad on u. Can't power out of turns or rotate and cannot deep brake if LSD is fully kaput. Mike
Old 10-01-2014 | 03:47 PM
  #30  
Larry Cable's Avatar
Larry Cable
Rennlist Member
 
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 25,836
Likes: 3,643
From: S.F Bay Area
Default

Originally Posted by 996FLT6
If LSD is toast it really sucks on track. Do the non scientific test. Jack up one rear wheel with ebrake off a piece of plywood on front tire so it doesn't roll. Try to spin the jacked up wheel cw or ccw. If no resistance pretty sure it's toast. With my guard lsd could not budge either way. If squirrley braking sounds like its going bad on u. Can't power out of turns or rotate and cannot deep brake if LSD is fully kaput. Mike
I thought that test had been debunked??? - or was that a nightmare I had that did not include a supermodel?


Quick Reply: WOW!! A technical suspension question/discussion



All times are GMT -3. The time now is 11:28 AM.