FFaust

Hey, we're all at work. And yeah, your friend needs/deserves help. Once he gets it sorted, the fun quotient will go way up, not to mention the safety of it.

utkinpol

best way to 'help' with such stuff is to get to a nearest reputable shop to sort out entire suspension setup so he would get to some sort of a 'baseline' point.

if he does not even know what camber is on the car it is pointless to continue with a guess game. if car was never aligned for a track it may have whatever.

dnitake

Apologize for an onion story. Just trying to keep it short. He's setup w/ Sharkwerks here in N. CA. Very reputable. He has all the data, and told me camber settings and it sounded fine. A neighbor friend told him to change bar settings. Don't know who his neighbor is.
Important to me is the notion the car will be well mannered for an amateur driver if setup right.
We'll see next time. Thx again.

997gt3north

Since it is sharkwerks - i.e. cali - i.e. the bars are probably GMG.

Basically 95% of it would be
- bars
- old tires
- tire pressures

NJGT in a very old thread had some setup info on those bars and the rear bar on mid and firm create a rotating car for autocross. Again, new tires, front bar mid, rear bar soft, hot psi (32-33f, 35-36r) - car will be fine.

I had a car as you described like that 1/2 a day on the track when my r888s heat cycled out. Farz (fc-racer) here on rennlist was actually in the car that day at a small track outside of toronto - pro David Empringham also drove the car that day and described it as crazy loose. The car was actually a lot of fun in the slow corners as the act of just turning in the car for a 2nd gear corner would start the back end coming around - it was a little less fun, but we didn't hit anything, when it just full on snapped in a fast 3rd gear corner.

911gt3s and heat cycled out tires are IMPOSSIBLE, i repeat IMPOSSIBLE to diagnose from a setup perspective. When I replaced the tires I mentioned above with fresh rubber the car returned exactly to it's original neutral setup.

50 heat cycled rear tires almost with near certainty have less grip (possibly materially) than 50 heat cycled front tires (off a gt3) - and thus you had a car with likely materially different grip levels at either ends of the car - ranging from low-mid at the front to very low-low at the rear and it also likely changed again as they got heat in the them to mid at the front to near zero in the rear (as the rear was sliding around. You combine mid grip front tires and zero grip rear tires and an after market GMG rear sway bar significantly firmer than stock and you have exactly the car you described.

Mvez

+1 above. With the GMG bars, you'll want to run mid to soft rear setting. Depending on the track, you might adjust, for example, this past weekend at Mid-O, I could've used the middle rear setting to get the car to rotate better in the slower tight stuff, but was lazy and just used tire pressures instead, but at my home track, soft rear setting seems to work best with all the off-camber.

As a reference, the GMG rear bar at full soft is as stiff as the GT2 bar at the middle setting.

Plus, the stiffer the rear bar, the more you really lean on your LSD. The goal is to have just enough bar, and no more than needed.

dnitake

I forwarded this thread to my friend. It is great to get affirmations and gain confidence about the handling observations here, and the upside. I had originally thought 50 HC's on streets wouldn't be as dramatic as 30 HC's on DOT's. But per his calcs, the tires have more like 78 HC's, great for shrimp on the barbie. Not that this thread needs to reflect reality anymore, but the car has stock bars soft/mid, 235/305's. I think he knows where to go from here for next time.