Noobie Question: Why the stiff clutch?
#1
Noobie Question: Why the stiff clutch?
Guys,
Searched and can't find an answer.
The clutch pedal in my 2007 GT3 RS is very stiff. When I took it in for maintenance the mechanic praised the clutch saying "that's how a real clutch is supposed to feel".
Can someone please explain what is the reason for this stiff clutch, and why it's praised?
Thank you
Searched and can't find an answer.
The clutch pedal in my 2007 GT3 RS is very stiff. When I took it in for maintenance the mechanic praised the clutch saying "that's how a real clutch is supposed to feel".
Can someone please explain what is the reason for this stiff clutch, and why it's praised?
Thank you
#2
It's not that the GT3 has a stiff clutch, it's just that most all other cars have clutches that are way too soft and have absolutely no feel. Too much hydraulic assist on those cars.
I love the GT3's clutch. Gives me a sense of precision and feels easier to operate when driving spiritedly or at the track. It's by design and part of what makes the GT3 feel very connected to its driver. All other cars I've driven with soft clutches feel like junk, including 997 turbos and even my own VW GTI. I guess they're more suited for crawling through rush hour traffic, but not very good when driving the car hard like it's meant to be driven.
If you don't like it now, give it time. Very likely that you'll grow to love it, then anything softer becomes unnatural.
I love the GT3's clutch. Gives me a sense of precision and feels easier to operate when driving spiritedly or at the track. It's by design and part of what makes the GT3 feel very connected to its driver. All other cars I've driven with soft clutches feel like junk, including 997 turbos and even my own VW GTI. I guess they're more suited for crawling through rush hour traffic, but not very good when driving the car hard like it's meant to be driven.
If you don't like it now, give it time. Very likely that you'll grow to love it, then anything softer becomes unnatural.
#4
You want the easy or the real answer?
Easy answer: you have a man's car. Hence a man's clutch. Case closed
But if that doesn't quite do it for you, here's the long version:
From 993s on (or maybe even earlier) most 911s a few pieces of hydraulics to assist with clutch pressure. Principally, there's (i) an extra reservoir next to the clutch master cylinder (mounted in the front of the firewall next to all the battery & brake gubbins) and (ii) an extra pressure accumulator immediately next to the clutch slave cylinder (mounted on the transmission close to the clutch group).
The reservoir is #8 in the following diagram. Visually, start by looking at #1 which is the master cylinder attached to the clutch pedal. The whole system ends with #21 which is the slave cylinder, attached to clutch release fork in the tranny.
Notice how the whole accumulator & associated attachments are missing from a GT3 (997.1):
Specifically, the reason GT clutches are heavier is because we don't have a pressure accumulator. This thing in real life is a lawnbowl-sized black thingy, the inscription of the side reads 15 BAR which is about 7 times our tire pressure!!
While I haven't opened this thing myself, I speculate the pressure is gaseous not liquid, designed to add clamping force--a very significant one at that--on the clutch beyond what the pressure plate can provide alone.
Whichever version of the answer suits you, this much is clear: you have one of the BEST manual transmission out there. It's heavy but I like it just the way it is. (Glad that doesn't extend to my taste in woman!)
Easy answer: you have a man's car. Hence a man's clutch. Case closed
But if that doesn't quite do it for you, here's the long version:
From 993s on (or maybe even earlier) most 911s a few pieces of hydraulics to assist with clutch pressure. Principally, there's (i) an extra reservoir next to the clutch master cylinder (mounted in the front of the firewall next to all the battery & brake gubbins) and (ii) an extra pressure accumulator immediately next to the clutch slave cylinder (mounted on the transmission close to the clutch group).
The reservoir is #8 in the following diagram. Visually, start by looking at #1 which is the master cylinder attached to the clutch pedal. The whole system ends with #21 which is the slave cylinder, attached to clutch release fork in the tranny.
Notice how the whole accumulator & associated attachments are missing from a GT3 (997.1):
Specifically, the reason GT clutches are heavier is because we don't have a pressure accumulator. This thing in real life is a lawnbowl-sized black thingy, the inscription of the side reads 15 BAR which is about 7 times our tire pressure!!
While I haven't opened this thing myself, I speculate the pressure is gaseous not liquid, designed to add clamping force--a very significant one at that--on the clutch beyond what the pressure plate can provide alone.
Whichever version of the answer suits you, this much is clear: you have one of the BEST manual transmission out there. It's heavy but I like it just the way it is. (Glad that doesn't extend to my taste in woman!)
Last edited by CRex; 08-05-2011 at 09:49 PM. Reason: Typo
The following 2 users liked this post by CRex:
KingSize.Hamster (08-13-2024),
MGT3 (05-07-2022)
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#8
Notice how the whole reservoir & associated attachments are missing from a GT3 (997.1):
Specifically, the reason GT clutches are heavier is because we don't have a pressure accumulator. This thing in real life is a lawnbowl-sized black thingy, the inscription of the side reads 15 BAR which is about 7 times our tire pressure!!
While I haven't opened this thing myself, I speculate the pressure is gaseous not liquid, designed to add clamping force--a very significant one at that--on the clutch beyond what the pressure plate can provide alone.
Specifically, the reason GT clutches are heavier is because we don't have a pressure accumulator. This thing in real life is a lawnbowl-sized black thingy, the inscription of the side reads 15 BAR which is about 7 times our tire pressure!!
While I haven't opened this thing myself, I speculate the pressure is gaseous not liquid, designed to add clamping force--a very significant one at that--on the clutch beyond what the pressure plate can provide alone.
-Of course there is a reservoir for the clutch hydraulic lines. It can not be a closed circuit, or else it would be of insufficient travel the second the clutch starts to wear. The reservoir is just not on this diagram, but you can see the feed line.
-The pressure accumulator is NOT to increase clamping force. The clutch spring does that.... It is to assist (braking and) clutch actuation. You manage to contradict yourself in 2 contiguous paragraphs.
#9
2 Remarks:
-Of course there is a reservoir for the clutch hydraulic lines. It can not be a closed circuit, or else it would be of insufficient travel the second the clutch starts to wear. The reservoir is just not on this diagram, but you can see the feed line.
-The pressure accumulator is NOT to increase clamping force. The clutch spring does that.... It is to assist (braking and) clutch actuation. You manage to contradict yourself in 2 contiguous paragraphs.
-Of course there is a reservoir for the clutch hydraulic lines. It can not be a closed circuit, or else it would be of insufficient travel the second the clutch starts to wear. The reservoir is just not on this diagram, but you can see the feed line.
-The pressure accumulator is NOT to increase clamping force. The clutch spring does that.... It is to assist (braking and) clutch actuation. You manage to contradict yourself in 2 contiguous paragraphs.
Another data point for you: the removal of this accumulator in a TT does make the clutch considerably heavier. What gives? Thanks in advance
#10
The accumulator usually contains Nitrogen and stores pressure to assist the brakes, and/or the clutch. That is why its failure makes the clutch heavier in the TT, as it does no longer assist the clutch actuation (not clamping).
#12
This is one of the many reasons the GT3 makes for a horrible daily driver. I got stuck in traffic on the interstate waiting to get by a wreck for 45 mins. I was feeling "the burn" about 5 minutes into it
#14
You think a race car should have a stiff clutch, therefore Porsche gives you one in a GT3.
I've driven a 650+ hp nationwide stock car with a softer clutch pedal than my gen1 gt3rs had. I've driven a lot of a race cars (admittedly mostly lower hp open wheelers), none had a clutch as stiff as a that gt3rs.
I've driven a 650+ hp nationwide stock car with a softer clutch pedal than my gen1 gt3rs had. I've driven a lot of a race cars (admittedly mostly lower hp open wheelers), none had a clutch as stiff as a that gt3rs.