...alright, who is it?
11-02-2010, 06:26 PM
#16
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
maybe it is an east coast west coast thing :-)
In all seriousness I was not thinking of it being and ethical violation more of a privacy issue... surely any future buyer would do a ppi and any ethical seller would offer full disclosure etc... and of course the ecu dump in a ppi would indicate an over rev at 12K rpms...
If I were one of the owners that you "outed" I would be having a chat with my dealer about papparazi posting pics of my car on line while it was in their care without my permission as well as sharing my service info with a guy waltzing through their shop taking pictures...
and yes I would buy a gt3 or RS with a new motor and service records that was priced appropriately.
None of these cars are collectors and numbers matching is a fools game with any driven/tracked 3/RS IMHO...
all in all not that big of a deal, I just do not like people publicizing my business and since this is not my car I have no dog in this fight. Post away... see any in there with an RMS or FMS issue?
In all seriousness I was not thinking of it being and ethical violation more of a privacy issue... surely any future buyer would do a ppi and any ethical seller would offer full disclosure etc... and of course the ecu dump in a ppi would indicate an over rev at 12K rpms...
If I were one of the owners that you "outed" I would be having a chat with my dealer about papparazi posting pics of my car on line while it was in their care without my permission as well as sharing my service info with a guy waltzing through their shop taking pictures...
and yes I would buy a gt3 or RS with a new motor and service records that was priced appropriately.
None of these cars are collectors and numbers matching is a fools game with any driven/tracked 3/RS IMHO...
all in all not that big of a deal, I just do not like people publicizing my business and since this is not my car I have no dog in this fight. Post away... see any in there with an RMS or FMS issue?
price appropriately (depreciation)
if they want to bitch at dealer, its BERT SMITH.I have no affiliation with the dealer but really dislike most of their practices... so no skin of my back if someone complains... please feel free to complain... i didnt pry for the info, simply thought it was amusing A: how many GT3's were there and B: that two people broke their new GT3RS's at the same time by driver error.
11-02-2010, 06:30 PM
#17
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
What are you talking about? "Help owners shield this info"?
Not only you posted private information of other people’s troubles, for which you shouldn’t have had access to from the dealer to begin with, but you take it one step further and call the owners liars..
How do you assume that they will not disclose the repair work in a future sale?
It's one thing to post a car photo here for discussion, good or bad, and another to post one without permission and try to play Sherlock, especially when there is no mystery to solve.
Take their permission next time. And delete this post.
PS. About the repairs affecting resale, even if engine is changed under warranty by Porsche dealer I am sure that they can update the factory files with new engine numbers so all future collectors documents and records would match.
Not only you posted private information of other people’s troubles, for which you shouldn’t have had access to from the dealer to begin with, but you take it one step further and call the owners liars..
How do you assume that they will not disclose the repair work in a future sale?
It's one thing to post a car photo here for discussion, good or bad, and another to post one without permission and try to play Sherlock, especially when there is no mystery to solve.
Take their permission next time. And delete this post.
PS. About the repairs affecting resale, even if engine is changed under warranty by Porsche dealer I am sure that they can update the factory files with new engine numbers so all future collectors documents and records would match.
the people on HERE are saying that it shouldn't be posted, they are the ones with an ethical dilemma saying these facts should be hidden. if they are going to be ethical and disclose this information THEN this post is nothing wrong, IF they wish for this info to be hushed, THEN they do plan to not disclose this information.
Private information? i did not post vin's or plates... simple pictures of cars and what their ailments were...
if i post vin's and plates i would ask for permission... since i did not then this is a non issue.. simply people trying to hide repairs.
11-02-2010, 06:50 PM
#18
Rennlist Member
simple "agree to disagree" situation then... for me it is a privacy issue only.
It only becomes unethical, IMHO, at the point of sale when the service history is not disclosed.
In any event, there is nothing unethical about these two cars because you have handled the disclosure of thier maladies with class and dignity. See if Bert Smith can get you VIN numbers and maybe you can update the GT3RS registry with your findings.
For the record, my RMS was replaced by Barrier Porsche under warranty earlier this year... just so this is all out in the open prior to me selling the car... I would not want to appear unethical in any way.
It only becomes unethical, IMHO, at the point of sale when the service history is not disclosed.
In any event, there is nothing unethical about these two cars because you have handled the disclosure of thier maladies with class and dignity. See if Bert Smith can get you VIN numbers and maybe you can update the GT3RS registry with your findings.
For the record, my RMS was replaced by Barrier Porsche under warranty earlier this year... just so this is all out in the open prior to me selling the car... I would not want to appear unethical in any way.
11-02-2010, 09:57 PM
#21
GT3 player par excellence
Lifetime Rennlist
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Lifetime Rennlist
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I know of several 2010 and 2011 RS blown trannies and dead engines, NOT due to owner failure.
the subject white car at 12k rpm with blow engine is not an issue. once blown, you get new engine, so it's new.
some ppl are too worried about this and that. these are GT3's. they are tools and some ppl like it some do not. i bought quite a few GT3's. i talk to the owner and gauge the person NOT the car. if the owner sounds legit, i dont do ppi or anything else, i just cut the ck. then there are ppl looking for chips here and there. then they are not gt3 drivers by nature. some even expect new tires ()#&%)#%), i think all GT3 should have corded thrashed tires.
collector is another story. they buy new. makes no sense collecting non virgins.
i would not post these info.
when a buyer engage a seller, these info goes b/n them. if they decided to be unethical and not disclose it, that's their problem. unless you are the buyer or the seller, it really isn't your business.
but, hey, that's just me.
the subject white car at 12k rpm with blow engine is not an issue. once blown, you get new engine, so it's new.
some ppl are too worried about this and that. these are GT3's. they are tools and some ppl like it some do not. i bought quite a few GT3's. i talk to the owner and gauge the person NOT the car. if the owner sounds legit, i dont do ppi or anything else, i just cut the ck. then there are ppl looking for chips here and there. then they are not gt3 drivers by nature. some even expect new tires ()#&%)#%), i think all GT3 should have corded thrashed tires.
collector is another story. they buy new. makes no sense collecting non virgins.
i would not post these info.
when a buyer engage a seller, these info goes b/n them. if they decided to be unethical and not disclose it, that's their problem. unless you are the buyer or the seller, it really isn't your business.
but, hey, that's just me.
11-03-2010, 02:49 AM
#22
Race Director
Why do you not like Bert Smith? My wife and I have always been treated well by this dealer...especially by Mike O'Donnell. I thought you and a friend were treated well during a BMW purchase or something like that at Bert Smith?
11-03-2010, 03:04 AM
#23
Nordschleife Master
Thread Starter
A: service department does/says anything for a dollar.
B: sales department is always 8k over the market on selling and 8k under the market on trades.
C: customer service is poor besides mike o'donnell.
my friends sister bought the 328i from them, the deal was agreed and then went up a few grand at the last second... it wasn't my pocket so i didn't complain but i didn't think it was right..
i will forever take my porsche business to Cincinnati, Ohio.. I have never been treated better by a dealer, like actually being treated as a valued customer versus being nice up front and then slowly sticking the knife in and turning it.. it might not be a Bert Smith thing, but more of a Florida thing (I am just local to Bert Smith, so i use them as an example i know)
every florida dealer i have ever bought from has tried to bait and switch and scam the customer..
Great Example...
I did not go to Bert Smith for an oil change on my 997.2 (wanted 480$), I DID however get the oil changed and have a receipt from the shop showing the date/miles/so forth.. the shop even went in the PWIS and reset the service indicator/etc.. Bert Smith did a PPI on my car for an interested buyer and eventho i gave them the paperwork of service they made a GIANT note to the interested buyer that "NO SERVICE HAS BEEN DONE TO THIS VEHICLE AND ITS 2 YEARS OVERDUE AND NEEDS THE FOLLOWING SERVICES ASAP DONE AT BERT SMITH"... the bill not only including 2 year service BUT also many other extra things that are far from unnecessary.
A: making the buyer weary.
B: trying to get money from my buyer.
the car has had all the required service, and even services not even required yet because i am very proactive.. they totally ignored all paperwork given and basically said since the service wasn't done by them its not valid whatsoever. (which is illegal to now allow a customer to service elsewhere)
sorry for my vent, really dislike florida dealers... i should just buy a third house in Cincinnati and travel there to buy cars. It literally took 8 minutes to negotiate and lock down a deal on the new cayenne i wanted.
11-03-2010, 05:10 AM
#24
Three Wheelin'
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Sarasota, FL. Home of Florida Man.
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mike is a great guy, the dealership on the other hand is not.
A: service department does/says anything for a dollar.
B: sales department is always 8k over the market on selling and 8k under the market on trades.
C: customer service is poor besides mike o'donnell.
my friends sister bought the 328i from them, the deal was agreed and then went up a few grand at the last second... it wasn't my pocket so i didn't complain but i didn't think it was right..
i will forever take my porsche business to Cincinnati, Ohio.. I have never been treated better by a dealer, like actually being treated as a valued customer versus being nice up front and then slowly sticking the knife in and turning it.. it might not be a Bert Smith thing, but more of a Florida thing (I am just local to Bert Smith, so i use them as an example i know)
every florida dealer i have ever bought from has tried to bait and switch and scam the customer..
Great Example...
I did not go to Bert Smith for an oil change on my 997.2 (wanted 480$), I DID however get the oil changed and have a receipt from the shop showing the date/miles/so forth.. the shop even went in the PWIS and reset the service indicator/etc.. Bert Smith did a PPI on my car for an interested buyer and eventho i gave them the paperwork of service they made a GIANT note to the interested buyer that "NO SERVICE HAS BEEN DONE TO THIS VEHICLE AND ITS 2 YEARS OVERDUE AND NEEDS THE FOLLOWING SERVICES ASAP DONE AT BERT SMITH"... the bill not only including 2 year service BUT also many other extra things that are far from unnecessary.
A: making the buyer weary.
B: trying to get money from my buyer.
the car has had all the required service, and even services not even required yet because i am very proactive.. they totally ignored all paperwork given and basically said since the service wasn't done by them its not valid whatsoever. (which is illegal to now allow a customer to service elsewhere)
sorry for my vent, really dislike florida dealers... i should just buy a third house in Cincinnati and travel there to buy cars. It literally took 8 minutes to negotiate and lock down a deal on the new cayenne i wanted.
A: service department does/says anything for a dollar.
B: sales department is always 8k over the market on selling and 8k under the market on trades.
C: customer service is poor besides mike o'donnell.
my friends sister bought the 328i from them, the deal was agreed and then went up a few grand at the last second... it wasn't my pocket so i didn't complain but i didn't think it was right..
i will forever take my porsche business to Cincinnati, Ohio.. I have never been treated better by a dealer, like actually being treated as a valued customer versus being nice up front and then slowly sticking the knife in and turning it.. it might not be a Bert Smith thing, but more of a Florida thing (I am just local to Bert Smith, so i use them as an example i know)
every florida dealer i have ever bought from has tried to bait and switch and scam the customer..
Great Example...
I did not go to Bert Smith for an oil change on my 997.2 (wanted 480$), I DID however get the oil changed and have a receipt from the shop showing the date/miles/so forth.. the shop even went in the PWIS and reset the service indicator/etc.. Bert Smith did a PPI on my car for an interested buyer and eventho i gave them the paperwork of service they made a GIANT note to the interested buyer that "NO SERVICE HAS BEEN DONE TO THIS VEHICLE AND ITS 2 YEARS OVERDUE AND NEEDS THE FOLLOWING SERVICES ASAP DONE AT BERT SMITH"... the bill not only including 2 year service BUT also many other extra things that are far from unnecessary.
A: making the buyer weary.
B: trying to get money from my buyer.
the car has had all the required service, and even services not even required yet because i am very proactive.. they totally ignored all paperwork given and basically said since the service wasn't done by them its not valid whatsoever. (which is illegal to now allow a customer to service elsewhere)
sorry for my vent, really dislike florida dealers... i should just buy a third house in Cincinnati and travel there to buy cars. It literally took 8 minutes to negotiate and lock down a deal on the new cayenne i wanted.
you have no ethical or moral duty to post this information. what are you, some journalist? is this wikileaks? and then to accuse the owners of being unethical?
you took personal information and posted. it's absolutely none of your business. you should delete this post.
and slamming bert smith after walking thru their service department and taking pics and posting them is not very classy.
11-03-2010, 11:39 AM
#26
Rennlist Member
IF I lived in Florida, don't think I would be visiting Bert!
11-03-2010, 12:17 PM
#27
Rennlist Member
11-03-2010, 12:35 PM
#28
Anybody that wants to take pictures of any of my cars at the dealer, have at it, I could care less. One of them is there on most any given week 
Want to know every gory detail of my mods, service history and warranty work? Happy to share! Hope you have some free time and are buying the coffee 
Oh, and I don't remove my license plate when tracking either.
Seems a lot of people (think they) have something to hide? I sleep just fine.
A lot of Sturm und Drang in this thread for no good reason. There is no privacy in our modern world. Embrace this and relax. Cars get driven, worked on, broken, wrecked, repaired, etc. Big whoop...
Want to know every gory detail of my mods, service history and warranty work? Happy to share! Hope you have some free time and are buying the coffee Oh, and I don't remove my license plate when tracking either.
Seems a lot of people (think they) have something to hide? I sleep just fine.
A lot of Sturm und Drang in this thread for no good reason. There is no privacy in our modern world. Embrace this and relax. Cars get driven, worked on, broken, wrecked, repaired, etc. Big whoop...
11-03-2010, 02:17 PM
#29
GT3 player par excellence
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
Lifetime Rennlist
Member
11-03-2010, 02:20 PM
#30