"Unboxing" My New Farnbacher Loles 997.1S X51!! (with pics and video)
05-03-2016, 08:43 PM
#16
Rennlist Member
Nice one, congrats.
So, just so I understand, this is a 2005 car, that it's engine with old IMS was replaced with an X51 engine BEFORE you bought it, right? If so, you're super lucky! Best 997.1 engine, best 997 engine and exhaust sound (997.2 engine/exhaust is terribly quiet), and no IMS issues!
So, just so I understand, this is a 2005 car, that it's engine with old IMS was replaced with an X51 engine BEFORE you bought it, right? If so, you're super lucky! Best 997.1 engine, best 997 engine and exhaust sound (997.2 engine/exhaust is terribly quiet), and no IMS issues!
05-03-2016, 10:06 PM
#17
Nice car! I actually went to Mckenna's to view a car. I was completely ignored at the dealership.
My wife and I left without even seeing the car, bought one elsewhere, Glad it worked out for you.
My wife and I left without even seeing the car, bought one elsewhere, Glad it worked out for you.
05-03-2016, 11:10 PM
#18
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
So, just so I understand, this is a 2005 car, that it's engine with old IMS was replaced with an X51 engine BEFORE you bought it, right? If so, you're super lucky! Best 997.1 engine, best 997 engine and exhaust sound (997.2 engine/exhaust is terribly quiet), and no IMS issues!
05-04-2016, 12:39 AM
#19
Yes Rhonda at FVD. So far so good.... No issues and easy DIY
Yes, it does have a similar vibe. How do you like the Depos/Dectanes and where did you get them? Some dudes have issues with them and Frank at Orange Tuning has mixed reviews. It seems like the two least expensive vendors these days are some dude called "fishcake" who is selling a US version on ebay and FVD Brombacher is selling the euro version. Both around $600ish. FVD has a presence on the forums and therefore may have better customer service so I'm leaning toward them, although I'd ideally prefer the US version if possible as I suspect they may have fewer issues so I shouldn't need their customer service.
That's right. It's crazy. Someone bought the car in 2005 and then had FL install an X51 factory crate engine in 10/2007 along with the Damptronics, etc. The 2nd owner bought it on ebay in 2/2008 (about 4 months after all that work was done!!) and had it for the last 8 years and seems to have really babied it. I'm the 3rd owner...and still pinching myself and half-way expecting this to be some sort of cruel dream/joke. I'll be able to breathe a big sigh of relief once my shop inspects it on Thursday, and I find out more definitely about the IMS in the new engine (which is presumably from 2007 so has upgraded IMS), exact list/status of current mods, etc.
That's right. It's crazy. Someone bought the car in 2005 and then had FL install an X51 factory crate engine in 10/2007 along with the Damptronics, etc. The 2nd owner bought it on ebay in 2/2008 (about 4 months after all that work was done!!) and had it for the last 8 years and seems to have really babied it. I'm the 3rd owner...and still pinching myself and half-way expecting this to be some sort of cruel dream/joke. I'll be able to breathe a big sigh of relief once my shop inspects it on Thursday, and I find out more definitely about the IMS in the new engine (which is presumably from 2007 so has upgraded IMS), exact list/status of current mods, etc.
05-04-2016, 08:31 AM
#20
Rennlist Member
I've purchased the Depo taillights from both - FVD for 996 and Fishcake/eBay for 997. No problems at all with either and prices are comparable - the ones on my 997 TT were on for 3+ years - no issues. I chose FVD for the last purchase for customer service and warranty. AFAIK there is no difference between US version and Euro. I'd stay away from Orange Tuning - always more difficult to work with an our-of-country vendor if there are problems and their customer service has been spotty in the past.
05-04-2016, 09:11 PM
#21
Thanks. That's top of my list for www.goldcrestmotorsports.com to look at on Thursday. I would've taken it sooner, but they just got back from Laguna Seca with some race cars. They're top notch and I have full confidence they'll find anything and everything I need to know.
I've read that even the revised IMS is still failure prone, albeit less-so. Plus it's more difficult/expensive to replace. So you think the IMS v2.0 is safe enough to not worry about? I'd HATE to blow an X51 engine!
I've read that even the revised IMS is still failure prone, albeit less-so. Plus it's more difficult/expensive to replace. So you think the IMS v2.0 is safe enough to not worry about? I'd HATE to blow an X51 engine!
05-04-2016, 11:46 PM
#22
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Nice thing about the single row bearing is you can upgrade it. This isn't an option with the larger bearing. Failure rates seem so incredibly low on the double row bearing I'm not even concerned.
On the other hand I am concerned about bore scoring from the heads swelling in the cylinders. Causes seem to be poor cooling and drivers romping on cars before warmed up. Fair warning this is my extreme simplification of a complicated issue since oil and a ton of other factors seem to be play a role as well. I've seen varying estimates up to 10% but who knows. I say be smart and keep your risk low.
On the other hand I am concerned about bore scoring from the heads swelling in the cylinders. Causes seem to be poor cooling and drivers romping on cars before warmed up. Fair warning this is my extreme simplification of a complicated issue since oil and a ton of other factors seem to be play a role as well. I've seen varying estimates up to 10% but who knows. I say be smart and keep your risk low.
05-05-2016, 12:24 AM
#23
Rennlist Member
That's right. It's crazy. Someone bought the car in 2005 and then had FL install an X51 factory crate engine in 10/2007 along with the Damptronics, etc. The 2nd owner bought it on ebay in 2/2008 (about 4 months after all that work was done!!) and had it for the last 8 years and seems to have really babied it. I'm the 3rd owner...and still pinching myself and half-way expecting this to be some sort of cruel dream/joke. I'll be able to breathe a big sigh of relief once my shop inspects it on Thursday, and I find out more definitely about the IMS in the new engine (which is presumably from 2007 so has upgraded IMS), exact list/status of current mods, etc.
05-05-2016, 09:49 AM
#24
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NON serviceable IMS
Backstory (abbreviated):
Daily-drove and lightly-tracked 996TT -> wife got pregnant (by me) -> got rid of 996TT and bought E46 ///M3 b/c bigger backseat for bulky rear-facing infant car seat yet also track-capable -> baby recently turned 2 years old and can now face forward therefore no longer need big backseat -> shopped for months for the perfect 997S both locally and online -> found it on Autotrader at McKenna Porsche in LA on 4/17-> wired the cash, sight-unseen, after reasonable over-rev report on 4/22 -> delivered 4/30!!!!
The New (to me) Car:
2005 911S Coupe, Black/Black, 6MT, pretty much loaded with all the good stuff (minus PSE) along with Farnbacher Loles kit including entire X51 upgrade, Bilstein Damptronics, etc
Factory Options:
Full leather
Adaptive Sport Seats
19" Sport Design Wheels
PCCB
Sport Chrono Plus
Navigation
Bose
Sport Shifter
Farnbacher Loles Upgrades (installed 10/2007):
-New 3.8L X51 factory crate engine (including OEM CF airbox, TB, plenum, headers, etc...so it truly is a complete X51)
-Farnbacher Loles ECU flash
-Fabspeed Exhaust (although I think this has since been removed)
-B&M Short Shifter
-Bilstein Damptronics
-Powder coat OEM wheels
-SpeedArt Indy rear wing
-SpeedArt Indy front splitter
-Custom steering wheel (also may have been removed b/c it looks fairly OEM)
-Custom shifter boot
Impressions:
It's clean as hell. Looks amazing and aggressive, all blacked-out and lowered. Paint/body is 9.9/10. Interior/leather is 9.9/10 (aside from a few sticky buttons). Not much can compare to the torque of my old 996TT, but it pulls hard throughout the rev range, noticeably stronger than non-X51 997.1S...doesn't seem to flatten out at 5k, nor does it taper off near redline like non-X51 997.1S. Sounds great - mild growl at idle and howls with WOT. Handles super flat and tight and sport mode is even tighter yet not teeth-rattling. Brakes seem good although I didn't really get to push them to their full potential. The overall condition is fantastic, and it'll certainly serve me perfectly as a DD/track car.
Potential/Future Mod list (in more-or-less order):
Have IMS and other mechanicals checked out by my local P-car shop
LED tail lights (leaning toward Depo/Dectane)
Studs and spacers
Consider removing ceramics and replace with 2-piece rotors (Girodisk vs PFC?)
Stainless brake lines, PFC 08's, Castrol SRF
Consider Gundo Hack (+/- 200 cell cats)
Headunit (Apple CarPlay?) with backup camera/Bluetooth/etc
GT3 grille/smile/moustache
TPC DSC plus 3rd axis accelerometer
Clear bra
Harness bar
So that's it. Pretty dope, huh? I'm so excited I'm about to crawl out of my skin.
So...thoughts/comments? Anything I'm missing? Anything to worry about? Anything you'd add or subtract from mod list? Unfortunately FBL is out of business so the only info I can get about their kits is from old forum posts which are few and far between. What do you guys think about the FBL ECU flash? Should I assume it's optimal or possibly consider changing to Softronic, etc? That's pretty much the only unknown/untested variable at this point so I don't know how it'll do with future upgrades (i.e., is it smart enough to remap with cats/exhaust/etc).
Unloading from the truck...the first time I actually laid eyes on it:
997.1S X51 "unboxing" - YouTube
Sitting in it for the first time (this one is fairly cheesy but accurately captures how I've felt since the day I got rid of my 996TT):
997.1S X51 "unboxing", Part 2 - YouTube
Btw, Adrian at McKenna Porsche is/was absolutely fantastic. Their customer service is top notch. He was very easy to deal with throughout this process and made everything run smooth as silk.
Daily-drove and lightly-tracked 996TT -> wife got pregnant (by me) -> got rid of 996TT and bought E46 ///M3 b/c bigger backseat for bulky rear-facing infant car seat yet also track-capable -> baby recently turned 2 years old and can now face forward therefore no longer need big backseat -> shopped for months for the perfect 997S both locally and online -> found it on Autotrader at McKenna Porsche in LA on 4/17-> wired the cash, sight-unseen, after reasonable over-rev report on 4/22 -> delivered 4/30!!!!
The New (to me) Car:
2005 911S Coupe, Black/Black, 6MT, pretty much loaded with all the good stuff (minus PSE) along with Farnbacher Loles kit including entire X51 upgrade, Bilstein Damptronics, etc
Factory Options:
Full leather
Adaptive Sport Seats
19" Sport Design Wheels
PCCB
Sport Chrono Plus
Navigation
Bose
Sport Shifter
Farnbacher Loles Upgrades (installed 10/2007):
-New 3.8L X51 factory crate engine (including OEM CF airbox, TB, plenum, headers, etc...so it truly is a complete X51)
-Farnbacher Loles ECU flash
-Fabspeed Exhaust (although I think this has since been removed)
-B&M Short Shifter
-Bilstein Damptronics
-Powder coat OEM wheels
-SpeedArt Indy rear wing
-SpeedArt Indy front splitter
-Custom steering wheel (also may have been removed b/c it looks fairly OEM)
-Custom shifter boot
Impressions:
It's clean as hell. Looks amazing and aggressive, all blacked-out and lowered. Paint/body is 9.9/10. Interior/leather is 9.9/10 (aside from a few sticky buttons). Not much can compare to the torque of my old 996TT, but it pulls hard throughout the rev range, noticeably stronger than non-X51 997.1S...doesn't seem to flatten out at 5k, nor does it taper off near redline like non-X51 997.1S. Sounds great - mild growl at idle and howls with WOT. Handles super flat and tight and sport mode is even tighter yet not teeth-rattling. Brakes seem good although I didn't really get to push them to their full potential. The overall condition is fantastic, and it'll certainly serve me perfectly as a DD/track car.
Potential/Future Mod list (in more-or-less order):
Have IMS and other mechanicals checked out by my local P-car shop
LED tail lights (leaning toward Depo/Dectane)
Studs and spacers
Consider removing ceramics and replace with 2-piece rotors (Girodisk vs PFC?)
Stainless brake lines, PFC 08's, Castrol SRF
Consider Gundo Hack (+/- 200 cell cats)
Headunit (Apple CarPlay?) with backup camera/Bluetooth/etc
GT3 grille/smile/moustache
TPC DSC plus 3rd axis accelerometer
Clear bra
Harness bar
So that's it. Pretty dope, huh? I'm so excited I'm about to crawl out of my skin.
So...thoughts/comments? Anything I'm missing? Anything to worry about? Anything you'd add or subtract from mod list? Unfortunately FBL is out of business so the only info I can get about their kits is from old forum posts which are few and far between. What do you guys think about the FBL ECU flash? Should I assume it's optimal or possibly consider changing to Softronic, etc? That's pretty much the only unknown/untested variable at this point so I don't know how it'll do with future upgrades (i.e., is it smart enough to remap with cats/exhaust/etc).
Unloading from the truck...the first time I actually laid eyes on it:
997.1S X51 "unboxing" - YouTube
Sitting in it for the first time (this one is fairly cheesy but accurately captures how I've felt since the day I got rid of my 996TT):
997.1S X51 "unboxing", Part 2 - YouTube
Btw, Adrian at McKenna Porsche is/was absolutely fantastic. Their customer service is top notch. He was very easy to deal with throughout this process and made everything run smooth as silk.
Mid 2005 the M97 engine had a non externally serviceable IMS. The serial # is published for the cross over.
The X51's were all crate motors from PCNA. Loles bought about 20 of them.
Any questions or concerns about the programming or work please contact me at the shop
Spencer ***
Speed Sport Tuning
05-05-2016, 11:10 PM
#25
Rennlist Member
Thread Starter
Mid 2005 the M97 engine had a non externally serviceable IMS. The serial # is published for the cross over.
The X51's were all crate motors from PCNA. Loles bought about 20 of them.
Any questions or concerns about the programming or work please contact me at the shop
Spencer ***
Speed Sport Tuning
The X51's were all crate motors from PCNA. Loles bought about 20 of them.
Any questions or concerns about the programming or work please contact me at the shop
Spencer ***
Speed Sport Tuning
THE CAR HAS A CLEAN BILL OF HEALTH!!!
Mechanical (Goldcrest Motorsports)
-Overall: the car is super solid, and all aftermarket mods were done well/appropriately. Conclusion: BIG SIGH OF RELIEF!!!!
-FBL/ECU: One of the owners of Goldcrest, Steve Cosgrove, used to work in FBL's race shop. He confirmed that all the work done by FBL was legit including factory crate X51 motor, likely with upgraded IMS (since it was a 2007), and the ECU is likely optimized for the car. Conclusion: no point in switching to Softronic or worrying about IMS/RMS issues
-Brakes: 380mm PCCB. Conclusion: as soon as PFC comes out with with their next gen rotors (later this summer), they'll be a direct bolt-on along with PFC 08's, Goodridge lines, and SRF (at which point the OEM ceramics will be for sale!)
-Exhaust: X51 Headers, OEM cats, Fabspeed cans, OEM tips. And my wife has officially forbidden me from making it any louder therefore 200 cell cats are out of the question so all engine mods are effectively done. Conclusion: consider an ECU re-flash (unlikely)...so now time for dyno?!
-Suspension: Damptronics, otherwise stock. They didn't know much about the TPC DSC, although I didn't speak to Steve about this specifically. It's still very high on my mod list thanks to Petza and other forum reviews
-3rd Radiator: Absent. Conclusion: will watch temps at the track and add this later if needed
-Harness System: Brey Krauss bar and Schroth harness are an excellent combo for DD/track car...but, according to Schroth, all harnesses require race seat (with harness pass-throughs) to be optimally functional. I love the Adaptive Sport Seats so doubt I'll end up going this way, although it is in the back of my mind if it begins to migrate away from the DD end of the spectrum. I could theoretically use the (4-point) Profi ASM with the OEM seat and BK bar, and if I combined it with their new SHR "Hans-esque" device with winglets, that'd keep the straps from migrating off my shoulders...but again, this is suboptimal and not officially recommended.
-Rear Wiper Delete: No advice except replace rear window ($$$), live with it, or come up with some other creative solution
-Track alignment/studs/spacers: Not enough to time to address this today. Will do it next time along with brake work
Paint (Bavarian Body Works)
-Paint is in great shape. Front bumper and hood has been repainted at some point which is fine by me. Plan to DA the whole car and add Rennline GT3 Smile Vent Kit in preparation for...
Clear Bra (Atlanta Protective Films)
-Plan to apply Xpel Ultimate on the front bumper, headlights, hood, front fenders, mirrors, A-pillars, and both doors. This should be solid protection against funk on the track and toddler mishaps in the garage.
So, all-in-all, it was a VERY productive day, and I feel much better about the whole project. I can now begin to appreciate the car for the amazing piece of precision German engineering that it is. BTW, the steering feel/feedback on this car is unlike anything I've ever driven. Amazing...
And thanks to all you guys for your feedback and insight. My overarching goal with this car was to do it right from the beginning, and I finally feel like I'm on the appropriate trajectory. Cheers!
Last edited by Feelgood MD; 05-14-2016 at 07:43 AM.
05-05-2016, 11:27 PM
#26
Rennlist Member
Nice! Glad it's in good shape.
Regarding the 3rd radiator, Suncoast has a sale right now on them, less than $200.. you might want to pick it up now in case you need it in the future.. you could even resell it for probably what you pay for it if you don't end up needing it..
http://www.suncoastparts.com/product/SKU9971TRK.html
Regarding the 3rd radiator, Suncoast has a sale right now on them, less than $200.. you might want to pick it up now in case you need it in the future.. you could even resell it for probably what you pay for it if you don't end up needing it..
http://www.suncoastparts.com/product/SKU9971TRK.html
03-11-2017, 01:56 PM
#27
Feelgood MD,
I don't know how I missed this thread for so long but I am the owner who traded this car into McKenna last year. Glad to see it ended up with a fellow enthusiast. It is a fantastic car - well sorted out - and I really hated to trade it in. To answer few of your questions:
1. The re-spray of the hood and front bumper was to fix some deep scratches caused by an elderly lady who backed up into the car and hit it with bike rack.
2. I did not change out the "custom" steering wheel listed on the FB paperwork. I suspect it may refer to the OEM wheel with the radio and nav controls.
3. I spoke with the original owner - he was an Audi guy and a regular customer of FB. He purchased the 997 when it first came out and decided to have them to their "GTR" package that they were known for with Caymans. In fact the car has a GTR emblem in the back when I traded it in - they apparently took it off.
4. Car was definitely babied by me - rarely driven on weekday and always covered in garage and when I parked it somewhere for more than a few min.
Love to see current pictures of the car if you have done any mods.
I don't know how I missed this thread for so long but I am the owner who traded this car into McKenna last year. Glad to see it ended up with a fellow enthusiast. It is a fantastic car - well sorted out - and I really hated to trade it in. To answer few of your questions:
1. The re-spray of the hood and front bumper was to fix some deep scratches caused by an elderly lady who backed up into the car and hit it with bike rack.
2. I did not change out the "custom" steering wheel listed on the FB paperwork. I suspect it may refer to the OEM wheel with the radio and nav controls.
3. I spoke with the original owner - he was an Audi guy and a regular customer of FB. He purchased the 997 when it first came out and decided to have them to their "GTR" package that they were known for with Caymans. In fact the car has a GTR emblem in the back when I traded it in - they apparently took it off.
4. Car was definitely babied by me - rarely driven on weekday and always covered in garage and when I parked it somewhere for more than a few min.
Love to see current pictures of the car if you have done any mods.
