Brake Rotor and Pad Bed In
02-23-2016, 03:53 PM
#1
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Brake Rotor and Pad Bed In
I just ordered new rotors and will be installing them when they arrive. My current pads are OEM and there is still some meat left, however I will be picking up some Pagid Yellows for track and summer driving.
Should I bed the Pagid's into the new rotors first or bed the used OEM pads into the rotors then bed the Pagids?
Should I bed the Pagid's into the new rotors first or bed the used OEM pads into the rotors then bed the Pagids?
02-23-2016, 04:07 PM
#2
Rennlist Member
I'd wait to install the rotors with the Pagid pads and bed them all at the same time. If you can safely wait to do that, that would be the best option. If you bed your current worn pads, you'll need to bed the new Pagids and that will prematurely wear the rotors (barely, but it could still be avoided). Bedding removes the high points. Think of writing a vinyl record over with a new album, you need to remove those highpoints on the face. So, you'll be bedding with your OEM, removing highpoints, then bedding soon after again removing highpoints.
Plus there's the hassle of taking your wheels and (in some cases) calipers off twice.
Plus there's the hassle of taking your wheels and (in some cases) calipers off twice.
02-23-2016, 05:59 PM
#3
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
I hears ya on that. I see it as getting the pad material up to temp to prevent glazing. Another thought is to get the new pads up to temp with the old rotor, then install the new rotor.
Most likely I'll just install new and new and bed in as much as I can.
Most likely I'll just install new and new and bed in as much as I can.
02-23-2016, 06:19 PM
#4
Be sure you bed Pagids correctly for the track. When you drive on the street, the low temperatures/friction rubs off the transfer layer. Track use (without re-bedding) may significantly reduce stopping power as well as impact pad life. This can include chunking and tapered wear. [Bedding isn't really to wear away high points on the rotors - it's actually to deposit a transfer layer on the rotors for adhesive braking. Pads and rotors need to be at a particular temperature for that.]. You can bed on the old rotors or not. It won't matter for the street. The transfer layer is going to get removed under normal braking.
The biggest reason NOT to bed now (or to reuse old rotors in general) is because your old rotors may have grooves in them. This may imprint a reverse set of grooves into the pads. Then, when you swap to new rotors, you won't have maximum contact between the rotors and pad. It will eventually even out, though.
Also, I'm not sure that simply getting the pads up to temp on the street is enough to get a proper transfer layer on the rotors. You need to follow the mfg bedding procedure - especially for Pagids. They are very temperamental.
Personally, I use PFCs for track use because they don't require a separate bedding process and they are useful right up to the backing plates. [In my experience, Pagids are only good up to about 2/3 of the pad life, then they start pushing heat into the calipers pretty profusely]. Also, I find the torque curve of PFCs is easier to modulate under trail braking. But that could just be wishful thinking...
The long and short of all that is you should put the pads and rotors on at the same time if you can.
-td
The biggest reason NOT to bed now (or to reuse old rotors in general) is because your old rotors may have grooves in them. This may imprint a reverse set of grooves into the pads. Then, when you swap to new rotors, you won't have maximum contact between the rotors and pad. It will eventually even out, though.
Also, I'm not sure that simply getting the pads up to temp on the street is enough to get a proper transfer layer on the rotors. You need to follow the mfg bedding procedure - especially for Pagids. They are very temperamental.
Personally, I use PFCs for track use because they don't require a separate bedding process and they are useful right up to the backing plates. [In my experience, Pagids are only good up to about 2/3 of the pad life, then they start pushing heat into the calipers pretty profusely]. Also, I find the torque curve of PFCs is easier to modulate under trail braking. But that could just be wishful thinking...
The long and short of all that is you should put the pads and rotors on at the same time if you can.
-td
02-23-2016, 06:31 PM
#5
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Be sure you bed Pagids correctly for the track. When you drive on the street, the low temperatures/friction rubs off the transfer layer. Track use (without re-bedding) may significantly reduce stopping power as well as impact pad life. This can include chunking and tapered wear. [Bedding isn't really to wear away high points on the rotors - it's actually to deposit a transfer layer on the rotors for adhesive braking. Pads and rotors need to be at a particular temperature for that.]. You can bed on the old rotors or not. It won't matter for the street. The transfer layer is going to get removed under normal braking.
The biggest reason NOT to bed now (or to reuse old rotors in general) is because your old rotors may have grooves in them. This may imprint a reverse set of grooves into the pads. Then, when you swap to new rotors, you won't have maximum contact between the rotors and pad. It will eventually even out, though.
Also, I'm not sure that simply getting the pads up to temp on the street is enough to get a proper transfer layer on the rotors. You need to follow the mfg bedding procedure - especially for Pagids. They are very temperamental.
Personally, I use PFCs for track use because they don't require a separate bedding process and they are useful right up to the backing plates. [In my experience, Pagids are only good up to about 2/3 of the pad life, then they start pushing heat into the calipers pretty profusely]. Also, I find the torque curve of PFCs is easier to modulate under trail braking. But that could just be wishful thinking...
The long and short of all that is you should put the pads and rotors on at the same time if you can.
-td
The biggest reason NOT to bed now (or to reuse old rotors in general) is because your old rotors may have grooves in them. This may imprint a reverse set of grooves into the pads. Then, when you swap to new rotors, you won't have maximum contact between the rotors and pad. It will eventually even out, though.
Also, I'm not sure that simply getting the pads up to temp on the street is enough to get a proper transfer layer on the rotors. You need to follow the mfg bedding procedure - especially for Pagids. They are very temperamental.
Personally, I use PFCs for track use because they don't require a separate bedding process and they are useful right up to the backing plates. [In my experience, Pagids are only good up to about 2/3 of the pad life, then they start pushing heat into the calipers pretty profusely]. Also, I find the torque curve of PFCs is easier to modulate under trail braking. But that could just be wishful thinking...
The long and short of all that is you should put the pads and rotors on at the same time if you can.
-td
I agree. I did a half a** search for PFC pads for a 997.2 but couldn't find a vendor. The no bed-in was a nice feature. Pagid suggests doing multiple stops from 110mph, that's tough to find an open stretch to do that. I'd have to travel 1.5 hours out to the middle of no where to attempt this. However several local PCA guys at my DE events run Pagids. Probably because the Chief Instructor is a dealer....
02-23-2016, 06:56 PM
#6
Rennlist Member
...[Bedding isn't really to wear away high points on the rotors - it's actually to deposit a transfer layer on the rotors for adhesive braking. Pads and rotors need to be at a particular temperature for that.]. You can bed on the old rotors or not. It won't matter for the street. The transfer layer is going to get removed under normal braking.
The biggest reason NOT to bed now (or to reuse old rotors in general) is because your old rotors may have grooves in them. This may imprint a reverse set of grooves into the pads. Then, when you swap to new rotors, you won't have maximum contact between the rotors and pad. It will eventually even out, though.
The biggest reason NOT to bed now (or to reuse old rotors in general) is because your old rotors may have grooves in them. This may imprint a reverse set of grooves into the pads. Then, when you swap to new rotors, you won't have maximum contact between the rotors and pad. It will eventually even out, though.
He didn't ask 'why should I bed'. He asked about the recommended process for bedding.
OP, 'himself' has a good point also about why and how bedding works with transferring pad material to the rotor. To reinforce what he said about street vs track bedding, if you track you will need to rebed for best performance on track. If you run Pagid all the time (street and track) the process will be quicker and with better results. if you switch between Pagid for track with a different compound for street, you'll want to really ensure proper bedding procedure of the Pagids before you hit the track. The difference will not be as drastic if you used say a Cobalt pad but your stopping power will not be as good and, at risk of sounding incredulous, borderline dangerous if you skipped bedding for example.
Cheers.
02-24-2016, 11:51 AM
#7
Three Wheelin'
Thread Starter
Guys, thanks for the feedback. I'm going to look into the PFC 08's. I run track days from May to Sept/Oct and leave the track pads in the caliper. The car is rarely used during the week.
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02-24-2016, 05:21 PM
#8
Rennlist Member
I swap in Pagid pads for track days and then back to OE for regular driving because the Pagids screech too bad. It is a pain to bed each set of pads everytime I swap but it's the best livable solution for now. I'm not worried about the slight life expectancy drop with the pads and rotors.
I will tell you that if you fail to bed in the Pagids properly for the track, your braking will suffer. If done right, they are awesome. If you follow the Pagid directions you will most likely go to jail but find and open section of back road and do your best.
I will tell you that if you fail to bed in the Pagids properly for the track, your braking will suffer. If done right, they are awesome. If you follow the Pagid directions you will most likely go to jail but find and open section of back road and do your best.