r_32

Saw a 997 targa 4s the other day and got to thinking I haven't seen many of those over the years. I liked it though and saw some threads about how people like the hatch for access into the back seat/storage compartment.
Were they relatively rare, or have I just not noticed them through the years?
Anyone know how many were actually made/came stateside?

kthung

no idea on actual numbers but you can do a quick search on Autotrader for 997s and see what percentage are Targa 4S's (5%? I dunno). Not necessarily a good indicator (maybe Targa owners tend to hold onto their cars longer so there's less in the market), but the easiest way to estimate that I can think of.

hjles

I'm currently looking to purchase a Targa 4S, and I'm trying to figure out the supply / demand equation.

Can I get a good price, because demand is low, as evidenced by the limited supply?
Can dealers charge a premium, because supply is low, since there is a large demand?

Not sure which it is.

targaC4S

Do you think you can get a Carrera Gt for a good price because demand and supply are low? Look on Porscheusa.com and see how many Targas you find. Dealers and private sellers will of course charge a premium over a regular Carrera or Cab. Only a certain type of buyer wants them. And yeah you will more than likely pay a premium for it if you want one too.

porsche951

Not sure when it came to 997 Targas but I believe 996 Targas accounted for less than 10% of all 996's produced.

kthung

I've been looking at prices for almost a month now, (not just for a Targa) and it seems that they do command a slight premium over comparable C4/C4S's. You're looking at $50-60k minimum for a Targa 4S though I've seen a few drop into the high 40s.

DasVWBabe

I just purchased a low mileage '07 Targa 4S and I have to say, it was incredibly difficult to find comps to try and negotiate the price, especially a 6MT with the sport chrono, turbo wheels, and interior color I wanted. In your hunt, you will find that a lot of them will actually be Tips, and as one enthusiast told me, mine was "Unicorn Rare because they were typically sold as 'wive's cars'".

The few that I was able to locate that were a couple of thousand $ cheaper were also the ones in a different state that I would have had to fly out to investigate.

In the end, I went with a local car and the pricing, while at a small premium, was not completely out of line with what I expected/wanted to pay. I haven't even hit 20k miles on it yet, but the panoramic roof is a completely different experience than the convertibles I've driven for years. I absolutely love it, and don't regret the decision for a minute.

That being said, the other cars in my garage are an '08 R32 and '06 STI, so it fits in quite well. It's my DD and I have put ~3k miles on it in a hair over 5 months.

If you can put up with the frustration of the hunt, it could pay off big time.

r_32

DasVWBabe - you truly have some good taste in cars!

After seeing the one the other day that prompted me to ask the question of this thread, I went and checked out an '07 Targa4s and ended up buying it yday. Even ended up being the colors we wanted when we started looking and happened to be fairly close which made bringing a friend to check it out easy. Lack of comps made it difficult to discuss price but worked out pretty well, but after checking out this targa it did feel like that was the car I wanted. We won't track it so some of the things you hear about their suspension and weight won't bother us and I can't wait for some decent weather to open that top.

While not as low of miles as the one you found, it was CPO and got it for what seemed like very fair price (after doing a bit of research on the drive to the seller) and is nice to have brand new tires and brakes in addition to latest service. They worked with me quite a bit as I had bought my last car new from them - so even if got screwed a little, it didn't feel quite as bad! Was a manual as well as I wanted my first 911 to be a manual. That's right...just went out and picked up my first 911!!!! Can't be more pumped, because the Cayenne I bought my wife last year was nice, but wasn't really for me.

Oh...and the other car in the garage... '08 r32 as well! My wife wants me to sell the r and "grow up" but that is the DD and is too practical and fun to give up.

Comanche_699

I found a thread with a document from Porsche North America on 6spd that showed sales numbers for USA 2008 and 2009 dated January 6, 2010.

2009 showed a total of 6,839 911's sold, and of those only 189 were Targa 4s.

2008 showed a total of 8,324 911's sold, and of those only 299 were Targa 4s.

The Targa 4 was even more rare - only 74 were sold in 2008, and a scant 60 in 2009.

The document was remarking on how Porsche sales had dipped 24% below the 2008 numbers.

With 2008 being the 'better year' for Porsche, selling a total of 26,035 cars and less than 300 were Targa 4s, you can easily gauge how rare the Targa 4s really is.

But for comparison, the sales figures also show (2008) Porsche USA sold:

1,222 Carrera S
1,211 Carrera S Cabriolet
1,473 Turbo Cabriolet

r_32

While 2007 was probably a better year, I can't imagine it really reversed those types of numbers. Thanks for the sleuthing Comanche.

Now I just can't wait for the car to get finished so I can pick it up and take it out.

DasVWBabe

Nicely done! Congratulations! Color/options?

Also, what #/color is your R32?

r_32

Lapis blue on the targa w sand beige. Light on the option front. Sport chrono, Bose sound, and not much else. On a 7yr car I think of options as something that can break! And I get to pick it up this Saturday and can't wait!

#3612 on the r32 and tornado red!

What about yourself?

Vape NYC

Comanche, did you see any figures for 2010? I would love to know how many Targa 4 and 4s were sold in the US. I did see figures for 2010 but it was all 911's, not broken down by sub model. I can't remember exactly but I seem to recall that 2010 numbers were less than 2009. Amazing that Only 60 of the 4 was sold in 2009. Even though it did take me about 6 months to find the Targa I wanted, ( nationwide extensive search requiring over an hour a day) it seems like after every car I was interested in sold, (or I decided I wasn't interested) another appropriate candidate came on the market within 2 weeks. And I was being pretty specific wanting PDK, SC and ventilated seats. I did end up compromising in a big way on color, (not a fan of black but it has grown on me) but found a super low mileage 2010 for only about $5k more than I wanted to spend.

I did end up passing on a local '09 Targa 4 with 20k miles for $59k and I was kicking myself for well over a month when I couldn't find anywhere near that good a deal. A dealer from Miami ended up buying the car and jacking it up 10k, at least initially. I just couldn't warm up to the powder blue carpeting.

My point being is that as long as you are looking country wide, another targa will pop up. if you're confined to looking locally that is a whole different ball game. BTW I would try to do an 09 if possible. I recently read a post here saying he felt his 997.1 S was underpowered compared to other cars on the road. But with my 997.2 I could not imagine having more power.

Comanche_699

Vape NYC- sorry, I didn't find any numbers other than 2008 - 2009, I only found the one jpeg of a document linked in a thread. I was surprised it took so long to come up with even that.

I can't believe how hard it is to find the production numbers publicly. When I was into BMWs it seemed like I could find production numbers for every year, down to the specific options on the specific makes in about 10 minutes.

I agree with you about searching for Targas, reasonable candidates do seem to appear when you open the search to the "North America" - my search had been nationally as well, and interestingly enough I was looking for only for black on black (6spd MT) at the time, which was difficult to find for some reason. There were silver and gray and red ones coming in the windows, but as more time has gone by, I've become more relaxed about my search.

I'm actually quite happy with my C2S Cab, and love flying along the coast with the top down late at night or very early in the morning before the tourists & prius drivers get out there.

I've decided to narrow my search even further - I love the gold of Volnomad's car, Black ones of course, and now some Silvers are all acceptable now too. I still want black interior, but now I'm looking for power adaptive sport seats, full leather, and hopefully the X51 package, MT, turbo wheels, and though I've never seen this on a T4S, I would LOVE for it to have a rear wiper. Excellent service history, and anywhere between 30 and 60k miles. Ideally 1 previous enthusiast owner.

I call this car The Übercorn. That's even more rare than the fairly obscure Black Unicorn.

If a car clicking all of those boxes on the list presented itself, I'd have to swap out the cab.

It's really unfortunate that the black one I'd originally fallen for 2 years ago, is still sitting in the window at the dealership 5 minutes from my house RIGHT NOW! When I sit in it, it feels like it's MY car, but the folks at the dealership have managed to bum me out so much with their sleazy and predictable salesman schtick that I don't feel comfortable about doing business with them.

Their inability to deal or at least sound convincingly like honest people, only makes my cab more attractive to me. lol

I will continue searching for the production numbers on the 911's mostly because it's interesting to me, but also because I find the relative obscurity of 997 Targas to be quite fascinating in general. It seems to me that people that own them, love them, and don't want to sell them, and that the ones that are out there for sale are lease returns that have changed hands at least twice since new.

R_32 - you've gotta figure out how to post some pix of the new one, and DasVW- you should post a few pix of yours in here too, just to add some color to the thread.

Vape NYC

Comanche, I will agree with your search for a black interior. Mine is Black on black. I really love the full leather interior, and at used prices the upgrade isn't that much. I feel like a car of the cost should have an interior that is as sexy as the exterior. All the beige interiors I saw, even in low mileage cars were chipped up to some degree. Same with a brown interior I saw. And I happen to like the black carpeting only. If I were ordering a car it would be black carpet even if I got a contrasting color.

actually cocoa is my favorite interior. I did see a gray over cocoa 6 speed Targa 4S that I would have loved but having driven a 6 speed RX8 for almost 10 years in NYC I decided to try the PDK and now absolutely love it as traffic has gotten worse with all the bus and bike lanes our former mayor installed to gratify his own ego.

In my searching ( at one point I knew every single Targa for sale in the US) I didn't see most of the features on your wish list. Even a rear wiper seemed rare. It seems to me that there is kind of a mindset that people fall into and order many of the same "packages" of items. It was rare to even see The adaptive sport seats.

My main reason for black exterior being down on the list was showing of dust and dirt. And I really don't care to take my car into car washes with brushes, and brushless washes are few and far between here unfortunately. My plan is to wrap the entire car in 3M material so I can take it to the regular old car wash around the corner from me (one of the few in Manhattan) on a regular basis so the car will look clean.