daberlin

Porsche has offically come out with a new term for what we have been referring to as 'Daytime Running Lights'. The GT3 product manager in New York last week called them 'Position Lights'. Thus, let it be known group wide that no, we don't have front fog lights, no, we don't have DRLs, but we DO have front POSITION lights. And so it shall be written. Peace out.

KeninBlaine

I agree. I'm convinced that many people, like those Audi drivers you mentioned, are unaware of what happens when they pull out the switch. I think they assume it is front fogs and don't realize it is a single rear fog light. Or they know it is a single rear light and want to look cool by using it, even when it isn't appropriate.

Edgy01

During the days of the 911 (pre-1989) the fog lights (if you had the option) only would come on with the headlights--and then only with the low beams. This kept them from being used as a substitute to the headlights. I recall one evening long ago in Oklahoma when I was pulled over by one of the state's finest OHP cruisers and received a warning ticket for "illegal use of fowl weather lights." (That gave me a laugh for many years. When I researched the Oklahoma statutes (which virtually mirror the other 49 states) it simply stated that you could not use them alone unless it was truly inclement weather. Since they could not be turned on separately by the way they were wired the officer was completely in error (not to mention the chicken reference). In later years Porsche adopted the inclusion of Driving Lights which is what you find on the 997.1 cars. They will come on without the headlights and provide a modest amount of lighting at dusk--but by no means are a suitable substitute for headlights.

rockrich

Here in San Francisco we have plenty of fog (esp in the summer months) I use the fog lights on my 997.1 many days, and find them quite useful. There are two detents on the light switch. The first turns on the front fog lamps, the second brings on the single rear lamp (which I use rarely). I really like the option of selecting my light, and I am able to reduce use of the bi xenons to nightime only.

Mike in CA

I wonder if the nomenclature or design has actually changed or the product guy got his terms mixed up. The technical introduction for the 997 stated the following:

The LED daytime driving lights and position light integrated in the front light module are a brand new technical and stylistic feature of the new 911 models. The LED daytime driving lights are designed as 6 LEDs and replace the previous fog lights. The position light has 1 LED with a light guide.

On the 997, when the main headlights are off the DRL's are active. When the headlights are on the DRL's go out and the position light is active. I'd be surprised if there is not still something on the 991 or new GT3 still called a Daytime Running Light. Maybe a 991 owner can confirm.....

MJBird993

+1 and amen brother. I used to see an A4 on my daily commute that would always have his or her rear fogs on. I'd flash my brights but she/he was oblivious.

PCC

Edgy01 - During the days of the 911 (pre-1989) the fog lights (if you had the option) only would come on with the headlights--and then only with the low beams

Not so sure about that ... I owned a 1986 944 Turbo (purchased new). In that car, you could run the fogs independently of the headlights - just needed the parking lights switched on. I find it hard to believe this feature was available on a 951 but not a 911.

By the way, the 951 was a hell of a car for that era. Better handling than the 911 and almost as fast. Great gas mileage and more room. Loved that car

svb

I thought "position lights" were when you switch the car off and leave the indicator stalk in the up or down position which illuminates the left or right city (or parking) light. I see it being used all the time in Europe when a car is parked (usually illegally) on a narrow street and one parking light (usually the side toward the road center) is on to alert people and drivers that a car is parked there. I don't think I've ever see it used in the US.

Mike in CA

Not to get caught up in names, but as you probably know that feature has been in Porsches forever, much longer than what they are now calling position lights. In my manual Porsche actually calls the feature you describe left or right "parking lights". Probably some have called them position lights....

Parking light
The parking light can only be switched on when
the ignition is switched off.
Move the lever up or down to switch on the
right or left parking light.

Minok

Daytime Running Lights are and have always been a separate item from Driving Lights which are separate and different from Fog Lights. Each of the 3 have a different use and a different light pattern, and each is designed to be turned on and off in different combinations with other lights.

That said, the light switch enforcing a certain usage combination doesn't mean that if the switches don't enforce the usage combination that such a combination is the correct way to use the lights.

DRLs are for making YOU visible to others coming the other way if you are in shade compared to them. They have never been intended to provide illumination for the driver of the car they are affixed to. They would typically be on all the time when the car is moving, but could turn off when the driver turns on the headlights (which effectively do the same thing).

Driving Lights are designed to provide supplemental illumination out in front of the car, either near field or broad near field. They illuminate more of the road immediately in front of you, and should thus be used in combination with headlights but again, don't substitute for headlights. If used for far field illumination, such as on ralley cars, then are blinding and should then only be used, like high beams, when no oncoming traffic is present.

Front Fog Lights are designed to cut under fog and prevent the blinding effect of high beams reflecting back at the driver when trying to see far. The beam pattern is wide and designed to reach out farther. As they are aimed up higher, they should only be used in foggy, smokey or similar inclement weather as they are blinding to oncoming traffic if the air is clear of particulates. Rear Fog Lights are to be used only in extremely low visibility to alert traffic coming up behind. You would never use front fogs with highbeams - fogs are there because you cannot effectively use the high beams. You would typically use front fogs with the low beams. I'm not sure if using front fogs alone is every a proper use of fog lights in any jurisdiction... maybe it was.

Iceter

Just last night while fiddling around with the PCM on my 997.2, I found the menu for lights and realized that you can turn off the DRLs--or at least you can with Sport Chrono Plus.

Mike in CA

Yes....I've done that....DRL's look silly when you're autoxing....

PCC

I frequently turn off the DRLs when drving on the highway. The radar gun LOVES DRLs.

Minok

The theory being with them off its harder for the police to aim the LIDAR at your lights? (RADAR will work just fine regardless as it isn't necessary to aim it precisely)

Edgy01

It's very possible that they wired the 951 or 944 Turbo differently than the 911 line because of the pop-up headlights. In the 944 Turbo, the running lights seemed more driving lights,--very similar to the way they handled them on the 928.

For clarification, here's how rear fogs look in inclement weather. Shot in the UK (England) outside of London with a 993 Carrera. Notice that they run twin rear fogs in the UK--single on the driver's side on the continent.