Mspeedster

I agree with what you're saying about size and was going to post the same thing. The stated Porsche factory dimensions just give length, width, height etc. measured at the longest points, but that doesn't tell the whole story.

The perception (and hence reality) of size goes beyond that. For example, the design of the front end is wider and more wedge like, compared to the 997 which has a more narrow and rounded front end. That adds size in terms of both actual overall volume measurements (which doesn't show up if you look just at length or width) as well as the perception of size.

However, I don't agree that Porsche had to do this as a necessity. They chose to do it. I like the 991, but would have been more happy if they found a way to downsize and still keep performance moving forward.

Mike in CA

In the post that started this thread you wrote:

"I was struck by the size of the car in person. It's dwarfs the 997. It is WIDE. It is LONG. Stretched in comparison. Everything seems bigger even the wheels. The 997 appeared almost diminutive next to it."

Reading that you can hopefully understand why some folks took issue with your description, or at least why I did. It sounded an awful lot like you were describing a car that was actually physically much bigger. Now I understand that you merely perceive it as being much bigger. Fair enough.

Perception is reality may work in discussions about conceptual topics like politics, religion, relationships, etc. but not in the world of engineering or math. Your eye may be fooled into seeing something, but a physical object has measureable parameters and your perception doesn't change them. (I don't think we want to get into a discussion of metaphysics here )

I agree to this; there are minor differences in shape and design elements between the 997 and 991 that may seem to make a big difference in size, but that difference is actually objectively and measureably small. Opinions and perception are fine, as long we don't lose track of actual reality. Sorry, too many years as an engineer, I guess.

allegretto

Keep reading about how "wrong" everyone is for not loving the 991

How "wrong" everyone is for feeling that, proportionally, the 991 is less attractive

How "wrong" everyone is since the Porsche ringers got better 'Ring times with the 991

Personally am choosing between 993TT and 965 3.6 so I'm wronger than wrong for some. I think the 991 rivals the 996 for the whole being less than the sum of the parts.

But I'm -----....

Mspeedster

You are missing my point. What I'm saying is if you actually do the math and compute the complete volume of the 991 based on every inch and angle of the car, I'll bet the size difference is quite a bit more than what the length & width measurements would indicate.

The 991 carries its size in places that don't come from the simple data points of length, width or wheel base. It's those elements of true added size, be it the wheels, fenders, C pillar-A pillar, front bumper or whatever, that lends to the overall perception of it being bigger than just an inch here or there.

Now I'm not on the other side either saying the 991 is huge or dwarfs the 997. I do agree that overall the actual size difference is less than the perception some seem to have. OTOH, at the end of the day, perception is what matters most. Engineers can design a great product on paper, but public perception will decide success or failure in the market place.

SteveFromMN

When I went from a Corvette in 1999 to a 996 one of the big reasons was turning radius.
The Corvette was 40ft ! The 996 was under 35 as I recall. This meant if I was charging down a country road I could make a u turn in the middle of the road and not end up in the ditch on the other side. Nimble !
My new 997 is a foot larger turning radius. Some roads are now tricky.

The 991 is a half a foot longerstill. On my test drive of the 991 I found it to be a great car but not light years away from my 997. In fact I hardly noticed any great difference. But I didn't do the ditch test.
The salesman was with me.

rodsky

You're not-----------------

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Personally I think Jennifer Aniston is hotter than Angelina Jolie. I dont have to justify why to you or anyone else. When people try too hard to justify their choice/preferences one way or the other, it makes you wonder. We get it, some people love the 991, others dont. Either side that tries to over denigrate the other side, looks a little lame IMHO.

Examples, its not a 911 anymore. Its huge etc. The 997 is an end of an era. Its now a GT car - whereas the 997 was raw and rough (really! - hows your full leather with deviated stitching in the 997). C'mon. Thats just trying too hard to justify your dislike. Its the same width and 1 or 2 inches longer. Its lighter too.

Or the other side, the 997 looks dated, ancient etc. I puked when I saw the rear end of the 997.2. Some lay people cant visually tell the difference between the two.

Mike in CA

With all due respect, I understand your point completely, I just disagree with it. I don't think that if you "did the math" that the volume of the new car would be meaningfully greater than the old car. There'd have to be an awful lot of very significant differences in shape to make up for the fact that length, width, and height dimensions are so close, and IMO there aren't. I can't prove my position with absolute certainty and neither can you, I suspect, unless you have full dimensional data for both cars to calculate or a 997 and 991 available to do a displacement test in a swimming pool. Absent that, we'll just have to disagree.

I do find it interesting that this discussion began with claims about the huge physical size differences between the cars, and now we're talking about subtlties in shape and perception. If we had started out here, I don't think there would have been much disagreement in the first place.

peterm

I ve been harassed as a early adaptor having a 996 when they first came out - then a 996 4s when they first came out - again with 997.1 and then 997.2. Next month the 991 will replace the 997.2 and I have yet to see a 991 live- i'm trying to wait for delivery of my car so I can be surprsied. I find the best thing about Rennlist is they form a new forum for each iteration and leave the naysayers behind

rodsky

Agreed.. I dont see huge differences. Subtle differences. Looks a tad lower and a tad longer. I prefer some things (looks wise) on the 991 (front lights) and other things on the 991 (sleeker). But they arent that different.

allegretto

Perhaps

Then again, perhaps it's the other way around...

Seriously, enjoy your car...

KBS911

I think it's the 4" longer wheel base and 20's that contribute to the "BIG" look and feel. Hell even mountain bikes come in 29"'s now. The 991 has certainly retained the 911 silhouette but regardless, it is a bigger car. If I'm not mistaken the Corvette Z06 is a shorter car overall than the 997/991, but anyone that has driven one knows it feels, drives and looks like a bigger car.

boolala

The absurdity of this comparison is highlighed by looking at the dimentions of, say, an F430 (which I am in the market for). The F car is an inch longer and fully 4 inches wider than the 991. It does sit about 2 inches lower and, if anything, I think that makes the car look even wider in comparison the Porsche.

rodsky

OMG - it must be HUGE. JK GLWS

Aerokitted

Waxer,

You are already sounding like a very broken record.

You really, really like your GTS.

You think it's going to be a classic if not already.

You think the 991 looks big and bloated next to our 997s.

You could easily buy a 991, but you choose to tell the world, again and again, that you're exceedingly happy with your soon-to-be-classic GTS.

Though I disagree on every point you've made against the 991 and for the 997 GTS, the best way to support your case is to post up more pics of your GTS.

Because one thing you and I can agree on is that you have one FINE example of what a 997 GTS should look like.

Toodles.

boolala

LOL! I'm keeping the 911 as well.