E15 is coming...
Thread Starter
Nordschleife Master
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 8,392
Likes: 449
From: Southwest
Pro
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 568
Likes: 1
Exactly. We are a fuel and lubricants wholesaler with limited retail access. One of our biggest sellers now is 93 octane non-ethanol fuel. Muscle cars, motorcycles, sports cars and especially boats can't get enough of it. If i had a nickle for every customer horror story/major engine repair on boats using the 10% eth fuel I'd retire. It has been great for out marine repair customers, though. They have never been so busy. I run the 93 octane in my GT3. It's not a daily driver so I just fill up a couple of 5 gallon race jugs and bring it home in my truck for weekends or top offs. Just yesterday I had a customer in a late model Z06 tell me that he is getting 3-4 mpg more with the non-eth. Not scientific of course but ethanol blended fuels make less energy so there should be a cause and effect.
Rennlist Member
Joined: Jul 2009
Posts: 5,970
Likes: 114
From: Vancouver, BC
If they keep it separate, it'd be ok
IF this is true
Then we should be ok. I hope EVERYONE would ignore the E15 pump to drive out the farm lobby, and for the market to get rid of E15 altogether! I actually don't even do E10, as Chevrons in Canada offers Ethanol-free 94 Octane gas.
I am loving it that in Canada, we're getting more options than our southern neighbours!
and we're called Socialists... since we like to ensure everyone who gets sick, can see a doctor! 
This means that E15 won’t completely replace E10, giving motorists the opportunity to vote with their pocketbooks to reject the 15 percent blend.
I am loving it that in Canada, we're getting more options than our southern neighbours!
and we're called Socialists... since we like to ensure everyone who gets sick, can see a doctor!
Drifting
Joined: Nov 2003
Posts: 2,981
Likes: 2
From: Virginia
On the plus side, Cash for Clunkers took a LOT of the older cars off the road. There is nothing (other than your ability to vote NO) to prevent Government to simply make all "old" cars illegal. Nothing to say there couldn't be another "cash for clunkers" in another 5-10 years to effectively remove all Year 2000 and older cars from use.
My recollection is the biggest issues to E-blended fuels is the increased speed in which Fuel lines, tanks etc can become ruined. I've not heard folks complain of small E-blend fuel ratios completely destroying motors. Also, with GM and Ford offering so many "flex fuel" cars, clearly cars can be built to run on various blends of Ethanol and Gasonline
Fuel near me has been E10 for a number of years. It seems to me Ethanal became THE oxyginator after MTBE was found to be a bit toxic. Then there is the Politcal BS of Lobbies and "good for america".. "reduce dependence on foreign oil" etc.. sure.. just follow the money trail
My recollection is the biggest issues to E-blended fuels is the increased speed in which Fuel lines, tanks etc can become ruined. I've not heard folks complain of small E-blend fuel ratios completely destroying motors. Also, with GM and Ford offering so many "flex fuel" cars, clearly cars can be built to run on various blends of Ethanol and Gasonline
Fuel near me has been E10 for a number of years. It seems to me Ethanal became THE oxyginator after MTBE was found to be a bit toxic. Then there is the Politcal BS of Lobbies and "good for america".. "reduce dependence on foreign oil" etc.. sure.. just follow the money trail
Pro
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 568
Likes: 1
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Thread Starter
Nordschleife Master
Joined: Mar 2004
Posts: 8,392
Likes: 449
From: Southwest
It was well publicized that valuable/historic cars were smashed.
It would had been far better to have sold the classic to a car fan instead of destroying it. Do not crash them, restore them!
Instructor
Joined: Aug 2009
Posts: 102
Likes: 1
From: Elverson, PA
Barged NY Harbor Ethanol trades at $2.55 per gallon as of yesterday. Conventional RBOB fuel (83.7 octane) on the NYMEX traded at $2.13 per gallon.
Blenders receive a $.45 per gallon tax credit from Uncle Sam (which is due for renewal by Congress). So, on E90, the reality is:
$2.55 - .45 = $2.10 per gallon ethaonol at 10% = $0.21
$2.13 for conventional at 90% = $1.92
Total cost = $2.13
This is NOT street prices, but cost.
Do the math - E85 won't save much more....
Blenders receive a $.45 per gallon tax credit from Uncle Sam (which is due for renewal by Congress). So, on E90, the reality is:
$2.55 - .45 = $2.10 per gallon ethaonol at 10% = $0.21
$2.13 for conventional at 90% = $1.92
Total cost = $2.13
This is NOT street prices, but cost.
Do the math - E85 won't save much more....
Rennlist Member
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 6,570
Likes: 89
From: Austin
Barged NY Harbor Ethanol trades at $2.55 per gallon as of yesterday. Conventional RBOB fuel (83.7 octane) on the NYMEX traded at $2.13 per gallon.
Blenders receive a $.45 per gallon tax credit from Uncle Sam (which is due for renewal by Congress). So, on E90, the reality is:
$2.55 - .45 = $2.10 per gallon ethaonol at 10% = $0.21
$2.13 for conventional at 90% = $1.92
Total cost = $2.13
This is NOT street prices, but cost.
Do the math - E85 won't save much more....
Blenders receive a $.45 per gallon tax credit from Uncle Sam (which is due for renewal by Congress). So, on E90, the reality is:
$2.55 - .45 = $2.10 per gallon ethaonol at 10% = $0.21
$2.13 for conventional at 90% = $1.92
Total cost = $2.13
This is NOT street prices, but cost.
Do the math - E85 won't save much more....
Drifting
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,017
Likes: 12
From: Oregon
Hi Tony, I don't think it's quite that bad.
Remember that Sunoco race fuel that came up in a previous thread? We talked about it being available at local stations. Here's a link to a fuel chart on Sunoco's site;
http://www.sunocoinc.com/NR/rdonlyre.../undleaded.jpg
The race fuel at the local station is the 260 Gold. It's oxygen weight is listed as 1.5%. Glance down the chart and find the 260 GT Plus. It's OW is listed at 4.8%. This is the fuel we use in our race cars. I knew there was a lot of ethanol in it, however, since that last thread I've learned that the 260 GT Plus in the race cars is something like an E85 fuel.
The Gold, (avail @ the station, and yes, I've been putting in my car) has approximately 1/3 the OW %. I'm thinking that the Gold fuel is apprx E30. I've been mixing it 50% with super E10 pump gas. WAG - I'm burning a fuel = to apprx E20.
Car runs great, showing no signs of distress. However my fuel mileage has shown signs of distress. From 19.5 avg. to 15.5 avg., approx 20% drop in fuel milage.
If the E20 has made the mpg 20% worse than E10, how much worse has E10 made it from non-oxygenated?
Hmm, maybe it IS 15% !
Bottom line, I'm going back to running on the basic 91 oct E10 at the pump! Let's hope that the E15 can be stopped!
Phil
