Handling with LSD
09-20-2010, 06:12 AM
#1
Track Day
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Handling with LSD
Hi there,
just out of my curiosity – if you add LSD to a C2S, how will the handling change?
I am interested in comparisons which have been experienced by the same driver, even better with the same car and driver.
In theory, a LSD (without other changes) should introduce some off-power understeer and create some on-power oversteer if the car was neutral before.
All this theory goes out of the window if you change springs and/or anti-roll bars.
How does the 997.5 C2S behave with the LSD? It has all the aforementioned items – LSD, different springs, different rear anti-roll bar (still don’t know if it is stiffer or less stiff then the standard one).
Looking forward to hearing your thoughts…
Stefan
just out of my curiosity – if you add LSD to a C2S, how will the handling change?
I am interested in comparisons which have been experienced by the same driver, even better with the same car and driver.
In theory, a LSD (without other changes) should introduce some off-power understeer and create some on-power oversteer if the car was neutral before.
All this theory goes out of the window if you change springs and/or anti-roll bars.
How does the 997.5 C2S behave with the LSD? It has all the aforementioned items – LSD, different springs, different rear anti-roll bar (still don’t know if it is stiffer or less stiff then the standard one).
Looking forward to hearing your thoughts…
Stefan
09-20-2010, 07:43 AM
#2
I have a 997.2 C2S with LSD (but no Sport PASM). I have to confess I didn't realise it has different springs or anti-roll bars. Is that with Sport PASM only or on all cars with LSD?
As for handling, you can get the power on earlier in a corner and it is easier to catch a slide, which is a good or a bad thing depending on your perspective. It is very stable under braking and accelerates faster owing to less wheelspin.
All good in other words, until you have to rebuild the diff when it's worn out. 10,000 miles in and I haven't reached that point yet.
As for handling, you can get the power on earlier in a corner and it is easier to catch a slide, which is a good or a bad thing depending on your perspective. It is very stable under braking and accelerates faster owing to less wheelspin.
All good in other words, until you have to rebuild the diff when it's worn out. 10,000 miles in and I haven't reached that point yet.
09-20-2010, 09:06 AM
#3
Moderator
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
Bah, I've driven thousands of track miles on a 997.1 C2S without LSD, a 997.1 GT3 with, and now a 997.2 C2S with SPASM / LSD and I've never felt that LSD did much if anything. I certainly wouldn't pay to add one and only because it came with SPASM do I have one now. The 997 platform is pretty amazing at putting the power down even in slow speed tight radius turns.
09-20-2010, 10:29 AM
#5
Rennlist Member
I can't speak for the 997 platform. But my guess is that all the other traction and stability aids make LSD less of a need than in the past.
My limited experience has found LSD's very useful on vehicles that don't have any other traction aids available.
My 944's have all benefited from LSD, particularly at autox and track events. Able to get power down much better is some tight turns, where without LSD resulted in inside wheel trying to spin.
An early electronic derivation is present on our 2000 Boxster S. Doesn't have PSM, but does have "Traction Control". Basically, uses the ABS system to try and stop the inside wheel from spinning. And have noticed that it also slows the car if you try to power steer and rotate the car through a corner.
Have also had it on a 1990 Ford Econoline Van and on a 2001 Suburban 2500. Without it, was easy to get stuck in snow because once one rear wheel started spinning, you had nothing to work with. With the LSD, both rears wheels had to spinning before you got stuck.
With modern traction aids, LSD is less of an issue. But older rides with no other stability/traction systems, LSD is a major benefit.
My limited experience has found LSD's very useful on vehicles that don't have any other traction aids available.
My 944's have all benefited from LSD, particularly at autox and track events. Able to get power down much better is some tight turns, where without LSD resulted in inside wheel trying to spin.
An early electronic derivation is present on our 2000 Boxster S. Doesn't have PSM, but does have "Traction Control". Basically, uses the ABS system to try and stop the inside wheel from spinning. And have noticed that it also slows the car if you try to power steer and rotate the car through a corner.
Have also had it on a 1990 Ford Econoline Van and on a 2001 Suburban 2500. Without it, was easy to get stuck in snow because once one rear wheel started spinning, you had nothing to work with. With the LSD, both rears wheels had to spinning before you got stuck.
With modern traction aids, LSD is less of an issue. But older rides with no other stability/traction systems, LSD is a major benefit.
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09-20-2010, 01:10 PM
#8
Bah, I've driven thousands of track miles on a 997.1 C2S without LSD, a 997.1 GT3 with, and now a 997.2 C2S with SPASM / LSD and I've never felt that LSD did much if anything. I certainly wouldn't pay to add one and only because it came with SPASM do I have one now. The 997 platform is pretty amazing at putting the power down even in slow speed tight radius turns.
Benefits most noticeable in tight slow speed turns. And darn useful in snow as well by the way, with winter tyres of course.
09-20-2010, 01:16 PM
#9
Rennlist Member
09-20-2010, 02:48 PM
#11
Nordschleife Master
fulcrum,
There are distinct advantages to having an LSD, especially with a rear engine design. I suggest you read the LSD Buster thread about the 997 GT3 LSDs and their problems. You can see what sort of handling and performance issues owners of those cars experience as well as what kind of gains (2-3 seconds per lap) they get once they've got a working LSD in their vehicles. This way you don't have to take my word for it. You are taking the word of many owners of P-cars.
https://rennlist.com/forums/997-gt2-...sd-buster.html
There are distinct advantages to having an LSD, especially with a rear engine design. I suggest you read the LSD Buster thread about the 997 GT3 LSDs and their problems. You can see what sort of handling and performance issues owners of those cars experience as well as what kind of gains (2-3 seconds per lap) they get once they've got a working LSD in their vehicles. This way you don't have to take my word for it. You are taking the word of many owners of P-cars.
https://rennlist.com/forums/997-gt2-...sd-buster.html
