voda

Hear a lot about heal-toe, rev. matching, double clutching, and combos of the fore mentioned. Thought I'd start this thread to get opinions from the group in regards to our cars and the types of driving we do or don't do, etc.....

alexb76

Just search on google first, then here. Not sure what exactly you're asking here.

The whole point is to apply some gas while braking in downshift, so you rave up the engine to match the revs to the lower gear. It takes a lot of practice to learn and Porsche driving position is one of the best to make this possible. I was almost never able to do this in my Audi, much easier in Porsche!

mdrums

Heel and Toe is not something you can really use on the street because you willnot and should not be braking as hard on the street as you would do in the upper run groups at the track. To really do heel and toe and get the brake and acell pedal lined up you have to be going fast and brake hard.

alexb76

Well, not in all cases, but I actually started practicing it driving on the street to get myself familiar. Best scenario is coming off the highway, I heel-toe slowing down and downshifting, and even sometimes while turning into an open intersection, I heel/toe, I agree, it doesnt work well all the time as I am not braking that hard.

Also, even when not doing heel toe to slow down, I try to rev. match downshifting... all of the above mostly for practice so can perfect it on track, as I've had my car for only 7-8 months.

Edgy01

Rev matching takes some practice with each new car you drive. You have to learn how much to blip the throttle to accommodate the downshift that you are attempting. All of this is for clutch life lengthening. If you don't do this at all you are subjecting your clutch to unnecessary wear. It's really not that hard if you have a good ear and can listen and learn. I've gone well over 100,000 miles on clutches by doing this on all my cars.

number9ine

I've been practicing on the street and while I agree that you can't easily rotate your heel without hard braking, it's very easy to maintain a consistent braking force using the ball of your foot while matching revs with the right side of your foot. At least for me it is, but my feet are wide so YMMV. In another thread they referred to this as "toe and roll" and someone suggested it's hard to maintain control doing it, but I disagree. Heel and toe is for rev matching, but there may be instances on the street where you can match revs without simultaneously braking.

Whatever your technique, if you can a) brake and b) match revs, it's worth the time and effort to do so in my opinion. Don't double-clutch, that's what synchromesh is for.

REBor8

H&T is one of those refined skills that are the essence of driving a sports car. The involvement and coordination of hands and feet that provide smooth transitions minimizing the fore-aft weight transfers that unsettle a car's balance are what it's all about. I'm in total agreement that it is not necessary for street driving but, it's rewarding to perform consistently well, especially when not braking hard. I'm definitely old-school, my first P-car being a 356 SC, where smooth was rewarded by not swapping ends abruptly. It's becoming a lost art with the advent of twin-clutch transmissions and paddle-shifters not unlike the demise of the straight razor. But, similarly, if you truely want a clean, close shave, there's nothing quite like it.

sharmat

As far as double clutching is concerned...as far as i know its an antiquated maneuver that is not needed in modern manual transmissions. I think truckers still do it (maybe) as their gears don't have synchros.

dtm407

huh?

double clutching saves your transmission (the synchros) in addition to the clutch.

rev matching while downshifting should be practiced at all time whether on the street or at the track. dumping the clutch after downshifting unsettles the car's balance and can be dangerous.

double clutching keeps transmission temps down and extends their lifespan. modern racers don't double clutch because they are driving sequential boxes. when they drive in endurance events with non-sequential boxes, they all double clutch

doug

Wills

I'm trying to teach myself this as it really smoothes your driving esp under braking for a corner when selecting a lower gear, I find that heel and roll is managable but not heel and toe as you aren't standing on the brakes even during fast road driving (I'm talking about making progress on quiet country roads not drag racing on city streets)

When dropping a geat to over take I also try and rev match thats easier as you don't have to do three things at once!

sandersd

Pleeeeze... "heal-toe"

dtm407

here is an easy lesson for learning how to rev match/double clutch:

first train your left foot.

start by going down the road at a set speed-the speed limit for example on the interstate- lets say 55 mph.

downshift from 6 all the way to 3rd without changing the speed and matching the revs so the car doesn't jerk. you begin to realize that 6th to 5th requires to little rev. 5th to 4th requires more etc..

(i double clutch because it is just as easy to learn as heel toe when first starting out)

BTW double clutching is: push clutch in, put in neutral, and rev engine while simultaneously moving into gear while pushing the clutch in and releasing.

what you are trying to accomplish during this exercise is develop muscle memory so you can do it without thinking about it. if you have to think about it, it will distract you from driving. do this exercise for about 2-3 weeks until you can do it flawlessly.

next train your right foot

add braking while rev matching-and shazam, now you are heel toeing.

during this period you will train your right foot on how to feel the brake pedal and roll over and feel the throttle. i learned to brake with the side of the ball of my foot making it easier to "roll" my foot back to its neutral position to rev the throttle. i learned on a VW golf on the street and if you can rev match/double clutch that car, you rev match/double clutch any car!

in addition, everyone is different: my son double clutches by using his heel to rev the throttle

BTW, you will need serious driving shoes in order to feel the pedals-no running shoes. the thinner the sole the better.

hope this helps

doug

Spiffyjiff

how many of you "roll your foot/toe" as opposed to actually "heel-toe"?

Nugget

My feet aren't wide enough to roll that way. For me it's toe on brake pedal then pivot foot until my heel catches the bottom of the accelerator pedal. It's an awkward and unnatural motion on the street, but on track when I'm really putting the hurt to the brakes it works perfectly -- especially with the bottom-hinge accelerator pedal. It's almost like Porsche knew what they were doing when they built the car!

RonCT

We just had this same thread about 2 weeks ago. Look back and you'll find it and the dozens of opinions / techniques offered. I H/T on the track only, never bother to do it or rev match on the street (no purpose to).