997, esq

I can't give legal advice to you, of course, and I am not a consumer rights lawyer. There are a number of issues that you may want to discuss with a lawyer. In the immediate term, you may want to tackle this directly with PCNA and the dealer and see what you can get out of them, before using counsel. One of the things a lawyer could help you determine is whether you have a warranty claim or another type of claim against PCNA and/or the dealer.

Hypothetically, let's say a mechanic works on an old Ferrari that is well past the end of its warranty. And let's say that the mechanic fails to do something properly and a catastrophic failure occurs as a result. Say, the mechanic didn't tighten a drain plug sufficiently during an oil change and all the oil drained from the engine. The mechanic would be liable, not because of warranty, but because of negligent work. In CA the implied warranty lasts no longer than an express warranty, iirc. So, even if the problems was the result of a design flaw (a faulty drain plug) and not the mechanic, I would generally expect the Ferrari owner might be better off focussing on the work performed by the mechanic. All of this is just a hypothetical illustration of some of the issues you may want to discuss with a lawyer and not legal advice upon which you should rely in any manner, of course. There may be a variety of other issues present in your case that a lawyer expert in the area could unearth. As Mr. Raby said on the other thread, you need to understand fully how this happened and currently that isn't totally clear...

useridchallenged

My call to PCNA this morning was met with the words, "good will is not likely" based on high mileage and being 3.5 months ex-warranty. They did assign me a PCNA case number, and said that they'll contact me in 3 days after they do their research.

mjsporsche

Oh yeah.....I am just running to my Porsche dealer to buy a new 997.2 C2S so that maybe I too will also get the incredible support of PCNA. Is it me or every time I read a post about something that seem obviously abnormal, that PCNA appears to not take the high road.

I would love to hear about some positive stories. I think the OP's situation would clearly require that PCNA step in and make the situation right. Do whatever is necessary to help support both the customer and the dealership. Not shy away. What is the dealership current position??

RED HORSE

I was several months and several thousand miles out of warranty with my Boxster with a plastic rear window when the window cracked. Took it to the local deal in Salt Lake and they replaced it under good will. It was worth their effort as I bought two 911s from them over the next couple of years.

useridchallenged

Dealer/PCNA might absorb a plastic rear window, but an entire engine... in this economy... is a whole other story apparently.

Dealer/PCNA position is "out-of-warranty, out-of-luck". We'll see where the quotes come in tomorrow. I'm not holding my breath. Dealer said they would make a best effort, but that translates as "we won't overcharge you."

RED HORSE

Replaced the whole top, but agree that is less than engine. However, it sure wasn't a $300 job.

fuenfer

+1 - the DME print-out is critical. I'd make sure to get a copy of that as soon as possible.

useridchallenged

I looked at the ECU log - no mechanical over-revs. Only your typical type1 and type2. The dealer said they would be worried if they didn't see lots of type 1 and type 2 over-revs. At least they have a sense of humor. Wish I did right now.

There's a parallel thread with all the technical details called "Oil scavenging pump failure".

Right now, the Porsche consensus is that the failure is a manufacturing defect, probably in the outer ring of the oil scavenging pump (stress/fatigue fracture?). No signs of wear. No signs of foreign object debris (FOD). Again, you can read more on the parallel thread.

jury_ca

Manufacturing defects don't show up 4yrs and 70K miles later. It's a premature failure. Unfortunate, but it happens.

aron in toronto

There was another motor failure of a 04 Boxster S detailed over on PPBB.com that had some interesting similarities. In that particular case the car was 13,000 mi and 5 months out of warrantee. I believe PCNA’s offer was that they would cover parts and the owner paid for labor. PCNA directed the dealer to tear down the motor to determine the extent of damage caused by a failed IMS. Obviously it would be a much better deal for the owner if the damaged motor was found to be too costly to repair, as He would only end up paying for the R&R plus the cost of the tear down & diagnoses. In this case the IMS is a known problem and the typical amount of damage requiring a reman motor is also known. It seemed PCNA was adding insult to injury by requiring the owner to pay a substantial labor cost to diagnose a known problem before they would authorize a replacement motor. Ultimately a remanufactured motor was deemed the less costly solution, but by them the owner’s confidence in the brand was also beyond repair.

Side note: IIRC, This was the owners third Boxster all purchased new. The first one had a catastrophic “slipped sleeve” motor failure, replaced under warrantee. The second Boxster was totaled by a dealer tech during a test drive. The third and final was the one above and chronicled in the following thread.

http://www.ppbb.com/boards/ppbbphp/s...=&fpart=1&vc=1

After many years of Porsche ownership he has decided to leave the fold and now drives a 350Z.

triode

I am very sorry for the OP's situation...but this illustrates exactly why I will never have a daily driver Porsche which is out of warranty. Parts are just so damn expensive, and let's face it the engines are no longer bombproof as they were back in the day.

Oh yeah, I would definitely sue the dealer if PCNA/dealer do not step up - if it happened while they were driving it, methinks a jury of the OP's peers would find in his favor.

Holli82

I agree with you completely.

Is it safe to assume that your 2004 still is under warranty?

rome

When you leave your vehicle with the dealer it typically creates a bailment, which means that the party to whom the property is entrusted has a certain duty of care while the car is in their possession. Of course, it would have to be shown that the duty was breached, which is a factual issue. State law will dictate who bears the budern of proof (i.e. whether the burden is on you to show that it was or on the dealer to show that the damage was not their fault). Once you make the prima facie claim the car was damaged while in their possession, the burden will shift to the dealer to prove that they were not at fault.

Tough case factually, but the fact that they have a duty to you based on a bailment should be helpful to settle the matter. Talk to a local lawyer....

Likemystoppie?

Keep in mind that the %'s of engines that are doing fine, well.........let's put it this way; you don't read all sorts of threads stating "Wow my engine runs great and gives me ZERO problems. --that is all! "


But this story does stink. I gotta tell ya, in my experience the dealer COULD do more in pursuing this w/ PCNA. More often then not- the dealer makes a choice aka service department; to NOT work for the clients benefit.


But, at the end of the day, it's Porsche's name on the car and engine. They should step in, up or something somewhere. EVen just to say "Boo!".

triode

Yep, CPO'd through this year.