996 GT3 or 997 C2S -- Same performance ?
06-01-2008, 03:28 PM
#1
Burning Brakes
Thread Starter
996 GT3 or 997 C2S -- Same performance ?
Title says it all
Feeling should be better in the GT3, more driver connection...
C2S should be more modern, maybe too civilized...
But using the same driver, the same conditions, etc., etc., which car should be faster ?
Or are they almost equal ?
Feeling should be better in the GT3, more driver connection...
C2S should be more modern, maybe too civilized...
But using the same driver, the same conditions, etc., etc., which car should be faster ?
Or are they almost equal ?
Last edited by 964C4; 06-01-2008 at 03:52 PM.
06-01-2008, 04:21 PM
#2
Pro
I have had both and driven both on the track. However, West Coast tracks on R comps for the GT3 vs SE tracks and street tires on the 997S. First, it is important to note that my 997S is a 2006 not '05. '05s were known for a rear bushing problem that caused a very annoying and disconcerting rear sway when cornering.
My general opinion, becuase I don't have track times from similar tracks, is the 996GT3 will probably be a bit faster all things being equal (tires etc.). However, I can't say I enjoyed one more at the track than the other. The 997S in sports mode is brilliant. Comparing my times in my stock 997S to other 996GT3s on R comps at Barber for instance, I am about 3-4 seconds slower in my stock 997S. Given a short track like Barber with lots of turns my guess is that if I put "R"s on I would run pretty close.
For reference, I have run over 50 track days on West Coast and SE tracks and I am usually running in the fastest group. My best Barber time in my 997S was 1:46.4. My best time at Thunderhill in my GT3 was typically in the 2:05s.
BTW - As a daily driver and looks wise the 997S is miles ahead IMHO.
My general opinion, becuase I don't have track times from similar tracks, is the 996GT3 will probably be a bit faster all things being equal (tires etc.). However, I can't say I enjoyed one more at the track than the other. The 997S in sports mode is brilliant. Comparing my times in my stock 997S to other 996GT3s on R comps at Barber for instance, I am about 3-4 seconds slower in my stock 997S. Given a short track like Barber with lots of turns my guess is that if I put "R"s on I would run pretty close.
For reference, I have run over 50 track days on West Coast and SE tracks and I am usually running in the fastest group. My best Barber time in my 997S was 1:46.4. My best time at Thunderhill in my GT3 was typically in the 2:05s.
BTW - As a daily driver and looks wise the 997S is miles ahead IMHO.
06-01-2008, 04:23 PM
#3
Rennlist Member
IMO the GT3 will always be faster under your conditions.
post this on the 996 GT3 board for some commentary.
no 997 C2 sounds like a 996 GT3 when first started from cold.
but
the 997 looks better both inside and out.
cheers
Craig
06-01-2008, 04:52 PM
#4
Nordschleife Master
1: better motor 8,200 redline 192 top speed
2: bigger brakes six piston
3: less weight
4: monoball front
5: gearing is different 2nd top speed 84MPH
6: 45/60 LSD
an advanced driver will be much faster in the GT3 than the 997. A novice or intermediate the difference will be less do to technique challenges the GT3 presents.
There is always someone lapping faster in a slower car.
2: bigger brakes six piston
3: less weight
4: monoball front
5: gearing is different 2nd top speed 84MPH
6: 45/60 LSD
an advanced driver will be much faster in the GT3 than the 997. A novice or intermediate the difference will be less do to technique challenges the GT3 presents.
There is always someone lapping faster in a slower car.
06-01-2008, 06:43 PM
#5
Rennlist Member
1: better motor 8,200 redline 192 top speed
2: bigger brakes six piston
3: less weight
4: monoball front
5: gearing is different 2nd top speed 84MPH
6: 45/60 LSD
an advanced driver will be much faster in the GT3 than the 997. A novice or intermediate the difference will be less do to technique challenges the GT3 presents.
There is always someone lapping faster in a slower car.
2: bigger brakes six piston
3: less weight
4: monoball front
5: gearing is different 2nd top speed 84MPH
6: 45/60 LSD
an advanced driver will be much faster in the GT3 than the 997. A novice or intermediate the difference will be less do to technique challenges the GT3 presents.
There is always someone lapping faster in a slower car.
06-01-2008, 07:08 PM
#7
Nordschleife Master
I agree with you completely. If I were chosing one for the primary purpose of track duty, I would take the 6GT3. For a daily driver though, I woud much prefer the comfort and style of the 7C2S...plus, its no slouch on the track either, just not quite a 6GT3. I seriously debated between these two cars and the 6TT prior to purchasing my C2S. I haven't regretted my choice for a second.
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06-01-2008, 07:13 PM
#8
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Sorry to change the topic, but I have never heard this before. Would you mind providing more detail? If this is a widespread problem, which you seemed to suggest, you would think Porsche might have followed up with a TSB or workshop campaign of some sort. What gives?
06-01-2008, 09:21 PM
#10
Pro
+1 on the bushings being reversed. Excellence talked about this quite a bit and I also felt it when I drove an '05 with its editor. Excellence also said it had been taken care of in the later cars but in a non-official way. You will notice it if around corners the back seems to bob a bit. On my '06 that is gone.
06-01-2008, 11:47 PM
#12
Rennlist Member
Yes...I know, I read his question just like you did. I answered his question by agreeing with the specifics of your post and then chose to add an additional opinion that some might find valuable. I'm not really a "speak only when spoken to" kinda guy. But hey, thanks for the comment.
06-02-2008, 02:33 AM
#13
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Hi,
I have pssed a few GT-3's on the track but I always felt I knew
the car and the track better. I would pick a GT-3 over a 997 S but
either car can be a gas on the track.
Have fun and any Porsche is worth the purchase.
Paul
I have pssed a few GT-3's on the track but I always felt I knew
the car and the track better. I would pick a GT-3 over a 997 S but
either car can be a gas on the track.
Have fun and any Porsche is worth the purchase.
Paul
06-02-2008, 02:35 AM
#14
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+1 on the bushings being reversed. Excellence talked about this quite a bit and I also felt it when I drove an '05 with its editor. Excellence also said it had been taken care of in the later cars but in a non-official way. You will notice it if around corners the back seems to bob a bit. On my '06 that is gone.
06-02-2008, 12:38 PM
#15
Moderator
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I'll say that the 997S is pretty much on par with the 996 GT3 and that's not just because I pass so many on the track 
When you look at all of the factors, including the historic lap times on the Ring, you'll see the two cars are extremely close. I think the tally is 7:59 for the 997S and 7:54 for the 996 GT3 - so that's 5 seconds on a very long and tricky track. I will guess that the 997S is "easier" to drive at or near its limit than the 996 GT3 is due to the updated chassis and systems, which is why I'll suggest they are pretty much interchangeable. Professional race car driver in the seat, surely the GT3 should be marginally quicker.
When you look at all of the factors, including the historic lap times on the Ring, you'll see the two cars are extremely close. I think the tally is 7:59 for the 997S and 7:54 for the 996 GT3 - so that's 5 seconds on a very long and tricky track. I will guess that the 997S is "easier" to drive at or near its limit than the 996 GT3 is due to the updated chassis and systems, which is why I'll suggest they are pretty much interchangeable. Professional race car driver in the seat, surely the GT3 should be marginally quicker.