997 Facelift
07-20-2006, 03:02 PM
#19
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by rcg412
I agree with MMD,that the 997 is marketings take on the 996. Technically, there is little improvement over the 996 except making the car more bling. Case in point:
1) return to "traditional porsche" headlamps
2) a "timer" in the middle of the dashboard
3) bliing quad mufflers
4) Pick-your-color brake calipers
5) 19" wheels - there is NO reason to have 19s on a car except to say you have 19s.
6) mediocre navigation (PCM) system
Aside from the 3.8 engine in the S.... the changes are almost all marketing driven. This was also the initial reviewers takes on the car.
1) return to "traditional porsche" headlamps
2) a "timer" in the middle of the dashboard
3) bliing quad mufflers
4) Pick-your-color brake calipers
5) 19" wheels - there is NO reason to have 19s on a car except to say you have 19s.
6) mediocre navigation (PCM) system
Aside from the 3.8 engine in the S.... the changes are almost all marketing driven. This was also the initial reviewers takes on the car.
1) The 996 headlamps (both versions) were controversial (I'm being kind). A return to "traditional" (and attractive) is a bad thing? Funny to hear from a 356 guy.
2) The wart is ugly, no doubt about it. But it's an option, just like hideous colors were in the 1960s...if you don't like it, don't order it.
3) I prefer the standard Carrera's exhaust as well, but the quad exhaust tips are not offensive and very easily changed.
4) Three different brake caliper colors for three different brake set-ups. Why is that so hard to tolerate?
5) Again, 18s are standard...if you don't like 19s, don't buy them. If you get an S, you'd have no problem trading the standard 19s for somebody with 18s and make a few bucks in the process.
6) If you want top-notch navigation, buy a Lexus. Again, funny to hear from a 356 guy.
You failed to mention the engineering improvements on the 997 (being an old time Porsche guy, that's what's important, right?). Aside from improved interior and exterior design (which is entirely subjective, but overwhelmingly positive as shown in reviews and, most telling, sales), in the base car the new steering, transmission, and seats alone offer a much improved driving experience. And the 2005 997 was less expensive than a comparably equipped outgoing 996. The S offers a step between the base Carrera and the GT3 in price and performance...which is primarily a result of marketing, then engineering...and not a bad thing.
07-20-2006, 03:13 PM
#20
Rennlist Member
Oh, and some minor cosmetic tweaks will definitely not make "pre-facelift values plummet". It doesn't work that way.
07-20-2006, 03:22 PM
#21
Nevada 911's do not need front license plates
Thanks to a couple of powerful lobbyists in Nevada...New 911's can go without a front license plates...sometimes lobbyists can do good...maybe...I guess one particular Porsche owner in Nevada spent the money and time to get the law changed...
SB251
Introduced on: Mar 21, 2005
By: (Bolded name indicates primary sponsorship)
Raggio , Townsend , Hardy , Amodei , Beers , Cegavske , Heck , Mathews , McGinness , Rhoads , Tiffany , Titus , Washington , Wiener , Allen
Authorizes operation of certain motor vehicles without front license plate under certain circumstances. (BDR 43-463)
Fiscal Notes
Effect on Local Government: No.
Effect on State: No.
Most Recent History Action:
(See full list below) Approved by the Governor. Chapter 279.
The above is the law in Nevada that makes new 911's look so much better
SB251
Introduced on: Mar 21, 2005
By: (Bolded name indicates primary sponsorship)
Raggio , Townsend , Hardy , Amodei , Beers , Cegavske , Heck , Mathews , McGinness , Rhoads , Tiffany , Titus , Washington , Wiener , Allen
Authorizes operation of certain motor vehicles without front license plate under certain circumstances. (BDR 43-463)
Fiscal Notes
Effect on Local Government: No.
Effect on State: No.
Most Recent History Action:
(See full list below) Approved by the Governor. Chapter 279.
The above is the law in Nevada that makes new 911's look so much better
07-20-2006, 04:02 PM
#22
Rennlist Member
Originally Posted by Alan Smithee
You failed to mention the engineering improvements on the 997 (being an old time Porsche guy, that's what's important, right?). Aside from improved interior and exterior design (which is entirely subjective, but overwhelmingly positive as shown in reviews and, most telling, sales), in the base car the new steering, transmission, and seats alone offer a much improved driving experience. And the 2005 997 was less expensive than a comparably equipped outgoing 996. The S offers a step between the base Carrera and the GT3 in price and performance...which is primarily a result of marketing, then engineering...and not a bad thing.
Where as there were huge engineering changes between 993/996, and 964/993!! And dont get me wrong, i think the 997 is a great car and an improvement over the 996.... but i dont view it as that big of an evolutionary step.
I was being facetious about the values plummeting...
07-20-2006, 04:22 PM
#23
Rennlist Member
Base cars are admittedly similar from an engineering standpoint, and clearly evolutionary. But as I mentioned, the steering, transmission, and seats...all of the contact points for a driver...are all big improvements in the 997, and in a better looking and higher quality car with a lower price. The 997 is also more aerodynamic (even with more frontal area coming from the wider body and wheels/tires), which led to slightly better fuel economy along with slightly more horsepower.
A better drivers' car for less money and yielding more profit for Porsche...that's progress...doesn't matter if the apparently evil marketing department was involved. Keep in mind that the original Speedster was a result of marketing.
PASM, PCCB, and the 100 horsepower-per-liter X51 are all bigger engineering improvements over the 996, but of course at at price.
A better drivers' car for less money and yielding more profit for Porsche...that's progress...doesn't matter if the apparently evil marketing department was involved. Keep in mind that the original Speedster was a result of marketing.
PASM, PCCB, and the 100 horsepower-per-liter X51 are all bigger engineering improvements over the 996, but of course at at price.
07-20-2006, 10:27 PM
#24
Three Wheelin'
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Received autospies update this evening. They speculate that the 2007 model year will be "short";and will replaced by an early introduction of the updated 2008 model .
Did anyone else receive this notification?
Jack
Did anyone else receive this notification?
Jack
07-21-2006, 12:41 AM
#26
Drifting
light cosmetics and radios aside - where is the DSG? Porsche is way behind on a transmission of this type.
07-21-2006, 12:46 AM
#27
Three Wheelin'
Originally Posted by rcg412
I agree with MMD,that the 997 is marketings take on the 996. Technically, there is little improvement over the 996 except making the car more bling.
bling?
Case in point:
1) return to "traditional porsche" headlamps
how are going back to the old headlights bling?
a lot of people complained about the previous look.
supposedly this made self-proclaimed purist happy.
2) a "timer" in the middle of the dashboard
my car doesnt have a timer!
wasnt it optional?
3) bliing quad mufflers
O M G!
4) Pick-your-color brake calipers
huh? is pick you color ext. paint bling as well?
doesnt add weight! did you prefer them unpainted?
5) 19" wheels - there is NO reason to have 19s on a car except to say you have 19s.
i like mine
it's also one of the mods a lot of people make
6) mediocre navigation (PCM) system
huh? i thought you didnt want bling?
but you want nav/pcm?
just a better nav/pcm?
Aside from the 3.8 engine in the S
yeah! bigger engine is pretty small potatoes!?
.... the changes are almost all marketing driven. This was also the initial reviewers takes on the car.
bling?
Case in point:
1) return to "traditional porsche" headlamps
how are going back to the old headlights bling?
a lot of people complained about the previous look.
supposedly this made self-proclaimed purist happy.
2) a "timer" in the middle of the dashboard
my car doesnt have a timer!
wasnt it optional?
3) bliing quad mufflers
O M G!
4) Pick-your-color brake calipers
huh? is pick you color ext. paint bling as well?
doesnt add weight! did you prefer them unpainted?
5) 19" wheels - there is NO reason to have 19s on a car except to say you have 19s.
i like mine
it's also one of the mods a lot of people make
6) mediocre navigation (PCM) system
huh? i thought you didnt want bling?
but you want nav/pcm?
just a better nav/pcm?
Aside from the 3.8 engine in the S
yeah! bigger engine is pretty small potatoes!?
.... the changes are almost all marketing driven. This was also the initial reviewers takes on the car.
i have read several good reviews!
seen several people comment on what a great improvement the 997 is over the 996!
i like mine much better than the 996 i had.
course i'm sure there are some reviews i haven't read but at the same
time i'm sure taken together they are overwhelmingly positive!
noticed from your bio you own a 996
jeff
07-21-2006, 02:19 AM
#29
Three Wheelin'
Originally Posted by ojpimpson
I like the 2008 911 cab over the 2006 maybe more h.p.too ? plus more inprovements.The porsche way. Get over it. The 06s are played out.
long time no see!
where ya been buddy?
jeff
07-21-2006, 02:19 AM
#30
4th Gear
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A slight change of topic, but I think what you mistake for a satillite antenna is actually just a rear windows washer made possible by the rear wiper. Unless I am stating the obvious..and there is a satillite antenna...