pcar964

You see, I have a problem with you saying that - I don't see how you can blindly support Porsche just because of their name, when in reality GM is starting to make great sportscars that are faster in almost every respect than the much more expensive 997s. That blink support is EXACTLY WHY Porsche is able to rest on its laurels, people keep buying them for the name!

Like I've said before, I respect the abilities of the 997, but the build quality and robustness of design is akin to a Honda, and not even close to that of the 993 or older models. I think its time we all started realizing that Porsche is cashing in on blind customer loyalty, and eventually that loyalty will dissappear.

Greg

Tbred911

true... lets see if they can generate a good "feel" when driving the car... if it can convery information to the driver like a 911 can then we have a serious contender... throwing it into the corners without confidence and hoping it will take the turn ain't good enough for me... you have to feel it taking the corner... that's why vettes end up in so many accidents... difficult application of power to a lighter back end and lack of feedback...

Tbred911

Robert, that's good news... I don't know if it times it for you (i.e. starts the clock through a programmed interval) the way I do it is hit the stopwatch when the pedal hits the floor and hit it again at 100 mph... in 3rd gear... this eliminates any measurement error.

cheers
Pete

Tbred911

David, definitely want to hear your opinion... you seem as if you'll really be paying attention (having owned all 3 variants ) and to detail come across with an unbiased opinion... I think many people are interested cause the big improvements so far have been:

1. Shifter (somebody said the short shift kit for 996 bridges the gap... is this true I don't know)
2. Suspension (PSS9 should make the 996 handle just as good? so they say)
3. Seats - 997 gets the gold...
4. sound - depends on your exhaust and catalytic options...

but I'm sure the essense of the 997 is more than the sum of the above 4 points... in the end it's a question of " is the 997 really THAT much better than the 996, to the degree that the 996 was better than the 993?

regards,
Pete

pcar964

Better than the 993? Well, that might be a bit of a stretch - never heard of a 993 being towed off the track due to oil starvation and seized engine like I saw last year at Sebring with the "better" 996. Guess it depends on what you value in your sportscars - for comfort, yeah you got the 993 beat, but if you're buying a Porsche for comfort, I think you might want to look into a Mercedes, much more comfortable.

Gary R.

I guess that's "your" problem then, isn't it. As I said, that's just my opinion, and as I have owned corvettes in the past and have an 04 nearby to sit my 997S next to I stick to it. Go buy a corvette and we will compare cars in 3 years, that will tell the story better than I can. I may not make the meeting due to my car being in the shop with an RMS failure though...

David_A

The build quality is akin to Honda and that's a good thing. I did not "blindly" buy my 997 but used my 6 years with my 996 and the improvements as a guage. I looked at the Corvette and it's a great car and you should buy one if you prefer it. This is a free country. I won't argue over weather the new cars are as good as the old ones. That is a personal choice. I've been driving for 42 years and I make my choices based on fact. If the 993 is a better car, why can't they compete with the 996 in competion? There are still plenty of nice used 993's out there for those who want them. I really tried to like the Corvette more and save $25k but it just didn't feel good to me. Great car, just not for me.
Cheers,
David

gpk

Have to disagree with the blind customer loyalty comment. I just came from an '02 M3 and have never owned a Porsche. Also, have you examined the interior of the new 'Vettes? Performance - yes; overall quality - not there yet.

alin2

Actually, one could argue that Porsche has not yet reached the build quality of a Honda or Toyota let alone Acura or Lexus. In fact, although all my German cars thus far have been much funner to drive, my Acuras and Lexuses (sp?) have been bulletproof compared to my BMW and Porsches. The Germans could use a little Japanese influence on the build quality side of things. Also, I wish they would just chuck the nav and put in the Acura or Lexus one. Then again that's a small point...

DD694

I had two 2003 M-B E500s before my present 2004 Lexus LS430. Unlike the E500, everything on the Lexus works and works easily. Nav system is very easy to read and use. Still, I love my 997S.

pcar964

well guys, I can see we'll have to agree to disagree here.

By the way, I'm not some 80 year old guy reminiscing about the "good old days" - I'm 24, and apparenty one of the only ones who actually cares about the history of these machines.

and by the way, the 993 never competed against the 996 - the 996 was never suitable for serious track use, it was the GT3 that is faster than the 993. The GT3 I like by the way, but besides its looks, it has almost NOTHING in common with a 996 - totally different cars.

tgcrun

Wow, I guess that guy just doesn't like the 997. His problem. I loooovvvvvve mine! Just for the record, my sports/sporty car history includes a Karmann Ghia, Fiat 128 with minilite wheels and a Stebro exhaust, Pinto wagon with 4speed stick, fat tires and "mag" wheels, Fiat X 1/9 (3 of them, yikes, what was I thinking), Alfa spider, Alfa GTV6, 944 (my first P car), '87 911 targa, '86 911 cab, Mustang GT conv, '90 C4 cab, '01 BMW 330ci conv.

pcar964

Know what it would take to make me like the 997? Here's a list:

Drop in a slightly detuned GT3 engine with more street-able torque curve and drivability (although the GT3 I have had the privelege to drive seems more than streetable to me), give it a gearbox that doesn't belong in toys-r-us and is actually built to last, ditch the ridiculous overcomplicated PASM in favor of a real sport suspension (you know, with stiffer mechanical SPRINGS), make the PSM on-off button able to actually turn the damn thing OFF! and take that variable steering and shove it up.... well, I think you get the point.

The quality of the interior of the 986/996 cars was abismal, I know because I've owned a Boxster S and couldn't believe how quickly it wore (and I take good care of my cars, but also track them heavily) - so I'm happy with the steps Porsche has taken to improve the interior dramatically in the 997s. A little too much comfort stuff, but I guess they have to appeal to a broad market, so fine.

You see, Porsche DOES have the ability to produce what we really want... they would just rather have a 50% profit margin than 40% (still highest in the industry) and build cars that aren't trackworthy.

If anyone wants to argue with that logic, then you're only fooling yourself. And yes, before anyone asks, I have the same complaints with Porsche on their 944 turbos, which had an oiling problem on the track (#2 rod bearing due to oil starvation), so it HAS happened before, and it almost RUINED my experience with what was otherwise an incredible track car, my 951S.

And "who owns these cars for more than 6-10 years"??? Uh, count ME in that category. It cost me every nickel and dime I had (and worked hard for) to afford each of my pcars through the years, since I was 17 years old - and why was I able to pursue my PASSION for Porsche even at such a young age? Because Porsche built those cars to LAST. And that's what makes them so special. Not all of us are 40 years old with money to spend on $85k cars every couple years,

MoneyBiz

Do you like the Lexus better than the E500? I drove the e500 and it was really nice but got a M3 instead.

Gary R.

Sheesh kid, your 24 years old and already you have owned Porsches "through the years".. get off the soapbox, your getting boring.