Cold feet versus due diligence?
08-19-2020, 08:02 AM
#16
Yeah, we tested them out and they fit fine right now. Agree it will be an issue at some point down the road, but we figure we have 5 years until that's an issue. They're both pretty small right now (and neither my wife nor I are very large... Thanks for the heads-up, I'll take a look at the panameras.
08-19-2020, 08:05 AM
#17
I think you will be fine having that shop do the ppi if you can’t find someone else nearby. I don’t know if you’ll get a good borescope though, because everything the experts say here is that you need to look from underneath and not through the sparkplug holes. As a seller, I would never agree to that. For a few hundred bucks, you’ll get mostly what you need and as mkzhang said above, you just have to learn to live with a little risk. I have bought 7 Porsche’s, most without a ppi. Ironically, one of the worst ones I bought I did have a disinterested ppi done. But that was a FL car, enough said
the most important thing you are buying is the seller and the service history, and it sounds like you have both boxes checked. A ppi just validates that.
the most important thing you are buying is the seller and the service history, and it sounds like you have both boxes checked. A ppi just validates that.
Maybe I'm missing an inside joke here, but why did you see problems with the Fla car? Ironically, that's where this car is located...
08-19-2020, 09:30 AM
#18
Instructor
The commonly shared wisdom is that you want to be extra careful with a Florida car—especially a South Florida car—because there's a lot of fraud and shady stuff that happens with 911's (and I'm sure other marques) down there.
08-19-2020, 09:38 AM
#19
Instructor
Also, whatever you do, find a highly regarded indy shop near where the car is and pay for a full PPI, including having them scope the engine to ensure the cylinders don't show signs of bore scoring.
I bought my '08 from 2,500 miles away, and having a reputable 3rd party of my choosing do a thorough inspection made it easy to pull the trigger. It cost $600, and was worth every penny. Also, I asked the selling dealer who he recommends for a PPI, and then found my own shop, as I didn't want his buddies glossing over any flaws with the car.
All of that said, if it seems like a great deal on a South Florida car, I'd proceed with extreme caution before ponying up for a PPI. There will be other cars, never rush into a "great deal" on a 911, because it often ends badly, especially if you don't really wrench.
I bought my '08 from 2,500 miles away, and having a reputable 3rd party of my choosing do a thorough inspection made it easy to pull the trigger. It cost $600, and was worth every penny. Also, I asked the selling dealer who he recommends for a PPI, and then found my own shop, as I didn't want his buddies glossing over any flaws with the car.
All of that said, if it seems like a great deal on a South Florida car, I'd proceed with extreme caution before ponying up for a PPI. There will be other cars, never rush into a "great deal" on a 911, because it often ends badly, especially if you don't really wrench.
08-19-2020, 11:12 AM
#20
Rennlist Member
Yeah, I won't buy a FL car ever again either. Even if there aren't title issues etc, the rubber underneath and in the engine bay, along with wire harnesses etc, is all baked to glass, brittle and crap as a result. Always have extra heavy maintenance with them. I've had 2 from FL.
08-19-2020, 11:37 AM
#21
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
2009 C2S 158K miles
Coupla items:
Florida cars: A local Porsche dealership regularly moves cars between their sister dealership in Florida and their local shop. The cost for them to do so is near nothing and they know the markets so well, they will move it for a small number profit. In other words, being a Florida car does not mean much to me.
I purchased my 2009 when it came off lease from a Volvo dealer in Minnesota (I live in Philly) at the end of January.. the pics had snow piles around it. It had a bad car fax: "hit a wild animal" (I could care less about skin damage). I contacted the local Porsche club, and one of the guys offered to look at and drive the car. He reported back "fabulous" and then recommended a local speed shop for a PPI (I sent him a case of Oranges). Cost me $150. I talked personally to the manager and the tech... they said something like "if this was in an accident we see no evidence of it". No bore scoping. No overrevs. I got a killer deal on the car and paid $53K for a 3-year old 26K mile 2009 C2S. Yes, your read that correctly.
BTW, I finally figured out where that accident (deer I suspect) was... rear driver quarter panel. I only found it a few months ago after 7 years of ownership.... small ripples around the rubber window where it looks like a tools was used.
Oh.... and for transportation, the dealer asked what kind of transport I wanted... I said the cheapest. He found an indy (they are always calling dealerships looking for loads)... super cheap but I don't remember how much... met the driver at a mall parking lot.
Another BTW: Given my whacky value system, I would not buy a car with any mods. Period. That is just the way I am.
Peace
Bruce in Philly
Coupla items:
Florida cars: A local Porsche dealership regularly moves cars between their sister dealership in Florida and their local shop. The cost for them to do so is near nothing and they know the markets so well, they will move it for a small number profit. In other words, being a Florida car does not mean much to me.
I purchased my 2009 when it came off lease from a Volvo dealer in Minnesota (I live in Philly) at the end of January.. the pics had snow piles around it. It had a bad car fax: "hit a wild animal" (I could care less about skin damage). I contacted the local Porsche club, and one of the guys offered to look at and drive the car. He reported back "fabulous" and then recommended a local speed shop for a PPI (I sent him a case of Oranges). Cost me $150. I talked personally to the manager and the tech... they said something like "if this was in an accident we see no evidence of it". No bore scoping. No overrevs. I got a killer deal on the car and paid $53K for a 3-year old 26K mile 2009 C2S. Yes, your read that correctly.
BTW, I finally figured out where that accident (deer I suspect) was... rear driver quarter panel. I only found it a few months ago after 7 years of ownership.... small ripples around the rubber window where it looks like a tools was used.
Oh.... and for transportation, the dealer asked what kind of transport I wanted... I said the cheapest. He found an indy (they are always calling dealerships looking for loads)... super cheap but I don't remember how much... met the driver at a mall parking lot.
Another BTW: Given my whacky value system, I would not buy a car with any mods. Period. That is just the way I am.
Peace
Bruce in Philly
Last edited by Bruce In Philly; 08-19-2020 at 11:41 AM.
08-19-2020, 12:14 PM
#22
Instructor
Naill...if you don't mind sharing, in what city is the vehicle? I'm in Tampa, I believe Sandwedge is in Orlando and MiamiRice is...well, you get the picture. I would venture a guess that any of us would be willing to check it out or at the least, provide you with the name of a good Indy for the PPI. Not for nuthin'...
08-19-2020, 12:15 PM
#23
Burning Brakes
Yeah, I won't buy a FL car ever again either. Even if there aren't title issues etc, the rubber underneath and in the engine bay, along with wire harnesses etc, is all baked to glass, brittle and crap as a result. Always have extra heavy maintenance with them. I've had 2 from FL.
08-19-2020, 12:23 PM
#24
Naill...if you don't mind sharing, in what city is the vehicle? I'm in Tampa, I believe Sandwedge is in Orlando and MiamiRice is...well, you get the picture. I would venture a guess that any of us would be willing to check it out or at the least, provide you with the name of a good Indy for the PPI. Not for nuthin'...
Tom
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Scalp_em (08-20-2020)
08-19-2020, 12:41 PM
#25
Rennlist Member
Hey all, i've been reading this forum quite a bit over the last month or so as I started our search for a 911. The advice and general discourse has been awesome to read and super helpful, so thanks in advance!
I started off looking for an older 911 that would be a fun weekend/summer car. I recently sold my Miata because it was only a 2-seater, and the growing family demands that we have a 4-seater so that everyone can go on weekend trips and be together when possible. My requirements are that the car be fun to drive, manual transmission, and be a bit of a driver's car. (I know not everyone is a fan of Miatas, but driving that car always made me smile
. I started with 996s due to the pricepoint - drove a few, almost bought one, etc, Standard story, right? But after a broader search (and input from the wife), decided to focus on an early 997 Cab.
'
I started off looking for an older 911 that would be a fun weekend/summer car. I recently sold my Miata because it was only a 2-seater, and the growing family demands that we have a 4-seater so that everyone can go on weekend trips and be together when possible. My requirements are that the car be fun to drive, manual transmission, and be a bit of a driver's car. (I know not everyone is a fan of Miatas, but driving that car always made me smile
. I started with 996s due to the pricepoint - drove a few, almost bought one, etc, Standard story, right? But after a broader search (and input from the wife), decided to focus on an early 997 Cab.'
Yeah, we tested them out and they fit fine right now. Agree it will be an issue at some point down the road, but we figure we have 5 years until that's an issue. They're both pretty small right now (and neither my wife nor I are very large... Thanks for the heads-up, I'll take a look at the panameras.
I would imagine going from a Miata to a Panamera would be quite a transition. I would be very surprised if the Panamera could be a solution for him...
08-19-2020, 12:42 PM
#26
Naill...if you don't mind sharing, in what city is the vehicle? I'm in Tampa, I believe Sandwedge is in Orlando and MiamiRice is...well, you get the picture. I would venture a guess that any of us would be willing to check it out or at the least, provide you with the name of a good Indy for the PPI. Not for nuthin'...
, but we can work out something else if you that's not your thing.
08-19-2020, 12:45 PM
#27
2009 C2S 158K miles
Coupla items:
Florida cars: A local Porsche dealership regularly moves cars between their sister dealership in Florida and their local shop. The cost for them to do so is near nothing and they know the markets so well, they will move it for a small number profit. In other words, being a Florida car does not mean much to me.
I purchased my 2009 when it came off lease from a Volvo dealer in Minnesota (I live in Philly) at the end of January.. the pics had snow piles around it. It had a bad car fax: "hit a wild animal" (I could care less about skin damage). I contacted the local Porsche club, and one of the guys offered to look at and drive the car. He reported back "fabulous" and then recommended a local speed shop for a PPI (I sent him a case of Oranges). Cost me $150. I talked personally to the manager and the tech... they said something like "if this was in an accident we see no evidence of it". No bore scoping. No overrevs. I got a killer deal on the car and paid $53K for a 3-year old 26K mile 2009 C2S. Yes, your read that correctly.
BTW, I finally figured out where that accident (deer I suspect) was... rear driver quarter panel. I only found it a few months ago after 7 years of ownership.... small ripples around the rubber window where it looks like a tools was used.
Oh.... and for transportation, the dealer asked what kind of transport I wanted... I said the cheapest. He found an indy (they are always calling dealerships looking for loads)... super cheap but I don't remember how much... met the driver at a mall parking lot.
Another BTW: Given my whacky value system, I would not buy a car with any mods. Period. That is just the way I am.
Peace
Bruce in Philly
Coupla items:
Florida cars: A local Porsche dealership regularly moves cars between their sister dealership in Florida and their local shop. The cost for them to do so is near nothing and they know the markets so well, they will move it for a small number profit. In other words, being a Florida car does not mean much to me.
I purchased my 2009 when it came off lease from a Volvo dealer in Minnesota (I live in Philly) at the end of January.. the pics had snow piles around it. It had a bad car fax: "hit a wild animal" (I could care less about skin damage). I contacted the local Porsche club, and one of the guys offered to look at and drive the car. He reported back "fabulous" and then recommended a local speed shop for a PPI (I sent him a case of Oranges). Cost me $150. I talked personally to the manager and the tech... they said something like "if this was in an accident we see no evidence of it". No bore scoping. No overrevs. I got a killer deal on the car and paid $53K for a 3-year old 26K mile 2009 C2S. Yes, your read that correctly.
BTW, I finally figured out where that accident (deer I suspect) was... rear driver quarter panel. I only found it a few months ago after 7 years of ownership.... small ripples around the rubber window where it looks like a tools was used.
Oh.... and for transportation, the dealer asked what kind of transport I wanted... I said the cheapest. He found an indy (they are always calling dealerships looking for loads)... super cheap but I don't remember how much... met the driver at a mall parking lot.
Another BTW: Given my whacky value system, I would not buy a car with any mods. Period. That is just the way I am.
Peace
Bruce in Philly
08-19-2020, 12:48 PM
#28
Yeah, I took a look at them, but it's not really what I'm looking for. Appreciate the thoughts regarding family size, but honestly we all took a 20-25 minute test drive a few weeks ago and everyone fit fine. Maybe the people in my family are just used to being packed tight
08-19-2020, 12:48 PM
#29
Rennlist Member
I will play devil's advocate here. When I had a young family, I bought an M3. It was new, and I never had anything break, but within a year my kids, sitting in the back, could kick my elbow, within 6 months of that they could kick the shifter. Getting them into the car seat in the back was like gymnastics. For me, this is the denial phase of fatherhood that came to a crashing end when I traded the M3 for a MB 550.
If I only had 2 cars for me and the wife, and I had economic stress of a 10 year-old expensive-to-fix sports car, on top of the impracticality of such a small car -- it's not the time to buy one. Wait a few years.
If you have 2 other good cars, that's different.
If I only had 2 cars for me and the wife, and I had economic stress of a 10 year-old expensive-to-fix sports car, on top of the impracticality of such a small car -- it's not the time to buy one. Wait a few years.
If you have 2 other good cars, that's different.
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naill (08-19-2020)
08-19-2020, 12:52 PM
#30
I will play devil's advocate here. When I had a young family, I bought an M3. It was new, and I never had anything break, but within a year my kids, sitting in the back, could kick my elbow, within 6 months of that they could kick the shifter. Getting them into the car seat in the back was like gymnastics. For me, this is the denial phase of fatherhood that came to a crashing end when I traded the M3 for a MB 550.
If I only had 2 cars for me and the wife, and I had economic stress of a 10 year-old expensive-to-fix sports car, on top of the impracticality of such a small car -- it's not the time to buy one. Wait a few years.
If you have 2 other good cars, that's different.
If I only had 2 cars for me and the wife, and I had economic stress of a 10 year-old expensive-to-fix sports car, on top of the impracticality of such a small car -- it's not the time to buy one. Wait a few years.
If you have 2 other good cars, that's different.