Posted this in the race forum, they told me to post it here instead haha, so here goes:

Looking for:
1) Feedback from experienced drivers
2) Help other noobs who might need reassurance

Context: 997.2 C4S with 70k miles, new ATX pads/rotors/fluid and Michelin Pilot Sport 4S tires. Oil: Liquimoly 5w/40 with MoS2

Just got back from a three day rally in the mountains where I spent 8 hours/day with my engine at 4k+ rpm. Not exaggerating. There were hour long stretches where I was only in 2nd and 3rd gear. So I figure that's a bit like a track weekend experience - which I haven't done yet.

Issues:
1) Temperature: Engine stayed at 225 entire time - don't be scared, that's normal. It was 85° outside, just for context.
2) Brakes: With HEAVY HEAVY braking the engine temperature almost reached 230. Very slight brake fade occurred during this time, only briefly, but never happened again. I was going down the mountain and the cars in front of me were sandbagging, then flooring it, then slamming on brakes. It took me a minute to figure out what they were doing and I overworked my brakes. In general, you can engine brake by going into a lower gear, if your brakes need a little rest, to let them cool down.
3) Rev Limiter: I use my paddles with the PDK in manual mode and hit my rev limiter 4 times over 3 days. I've never hit the rev limiter before. I wanted to cry each time. I was so scared I hurt my engine. One time it went all the way to 8k. Most people say a PDK can't over rev, even in manual mode, this a subject I'm still researching - would love feedback.
4) Ticking Sound: After 8 hours of hard driving and keeping the engine at 225-230° I noticed a faint ticking sound. I almost threw up, I was really scared. But an experienced driver told me all he heard was my DFI injectors ticking. Another guy listened and said he didn't hear anything - but he did say the lifters will often tick on hard track days and stop the next day when the engine cools down. Another guy said "if your lifters start ticking on a 997.2 change your oil when you get home and it will go away." The good news is, after driving 6 hours on the freeway, the sound went away. I did record the sound if anyone wants to hear it. It's barely audible. I'm thinking it was exhaust heat shields. I later learned that lifter tick is a continuous sound that matches the RPM of the engine. I definitely didn't hear anything like that. I'm just sharing this in case other racing noobs hear a ticking sound after their first race experience.
5) Tires: On the freeway drive home the tires almost felt out of balance. I was asking myself "Are the rotors warped from the heat?" So I did a hard brake on the freeway and nope, brakes felt great. Can confirm now that brakes are perfect. No buildup of brake material on the rotors, no plugged rotor holes, no heat warping. So it's gotta be tires, right? Turns out tires often need to be rebalanced after a track day or two. However, in my case, about halfway through the trip home, the tires evened out and the shake went away. Might be helpful for noobs to be aware of this.
5) Throttle: After spending 3 days in Sport and Sport+, driving home on the freeway, the throttle was jerky and aggressive in "stop and go" traffic. Someone suggested coming to a full stop, putting the car in neutral, and revving it to 3k rpm. This actually seemed to work. It was like the computer remapped the throttle and real life traffic felt smooth again. I'm guessing you could also disconnect the battery so the car would forget that it's been on the track.
6) Gas: The rally forced me to get gas at three stations I loathe, including a BP. Emptying the tank and refilling with Shell 93 SEEMED to make a difference. It could be psychological. But Shell 93 really does seem to be the smoothest gas. Until I went to this rally I had never tried any other fuel. Shell forever!
7) Oil: I've always run DT40, but I wanted to change my oil before and after the rally, and I just couldn't get DT40 delivered in time because of Covid. So I put in Liqui Moly Leichtlauf 5w/40 with 1.5 bottles of MoS2. Again this could be psychological, but DT40 really does seem to be a smoother oil and produces a smoother idle. I also wonder if it would've kept my engine temperature a little lower. Liqui Moly is an excellent product, and this could be just a placebo effect, but it seems to me that DT40 is even better. I will have UOA shortly to lend a little data to this subject.

Edit: To my fellow middle class noobs: Make sure you have a good savings in place before you start dabbling with high performance driving ESPECIALLY if your car is high mileage like mine. First, pushing your car could result in damage - maybe something mild like a heater hose, or maybe something crazy like a missed shift damaging your engine. Remember, we're not rich guys, our cars are old and potentially have high miles. Second, be prepared for wear, potentially expensive wear. You can really wear out your tires and brakes quickly - neither are cheap to replace, even if you DIY. You can also push a tired suspension or engine mount to the brink, and boom, now they need to be replaced. The point is, some components on your 8 year old car are pretty tired, and if you go crazy on a track, your tired engine components are now in failure range. All of this is no problem if you have a little savings in the bank just for your Porsche. Just something to think about!!

Thanks for listening, as I'm a noob, scolding, preaching, and all feedback welcome!!

 

Ha, driving as God and he Good Dr intended. No way you hurt that car with spirited driving in the mountains. I drive mine like that every day if I can. Really, they are designed for it. The real sweet spot is 4500 to 5500 rpm's. Stay there for a bit and have even more fun! I drive like that at every opportunity, plus I do DE quite a bit. I have not worried about hurting the car. Hard braking doesn't hurt either. For as hard as you drove it on the roads, you were nowhere near the limits of that car, or you, as you'll find if you do take advantage of a good DE session or two (or 3 or 4 or …. you get the picture).

 

I only have a couple of comments - 1- Seems like a great time - This sounds like it was the Tail of the Dragon drive.

"3) Rev Limiter: I use my paddles with the PDK in manual mode and hit my rev limiter 4 times over 3 days. I've never hit the rev limiter before. I wanted to cry each time. I was so scared I hurt my engine. One time it went all the way to 8k. Most people say a PDK can't over rev, even in manual mode, this a subject I'm still researching - would love feedback."
I have hit the rev limiter in my 09 PDK 2 times, both by accident because I forgot I was in manual mode. 1st time was on an interstate entrance ramp going downhill and I hit the rev limiter almost exactly the same time I had to let off the throttle. Momentum carried me into range one over rev for 516 ignitions or 1.37 sec. The second time again I forgot I was in manual went to pass hit the rev limit let off the gas, again going down hill, and changed gears. I checked the over revs with duremetrics and added another 378 to range 1. So you can over rev but I can't see how you could get out of range 1. Maybe some else could chime in.

You mentioned that you are using DT40. I thought for the DFI cars (I think I remember seeing it's a 997.2 with PDK so it must be a DFI engine - correct?) LN recommends using DI40.
That might be part of your "ticking". Even if it is not the DI40 is supposed to be better for the DFI engines.

All in all still a fantastic weekend.

 

Sounds like your car got to go on a healthy drive! Hitting the rev limiter a few times when your engine is operating at optimal temperature will not hurt it. You got nothing to worry about except maybe tires depending on the mileage you've put on.

 

DT40 is for .1 cars that don't have PDK as an option. I assume you mean DI40.

Secondly, have you never driven a car before in a spirited manner? Is the 911 your first sports car? I don't mean to be a turd, I just find it fascinating what people experience for the "first time" when they buy their "dream car".

At whatever novice experience level you are, I would bet money you you didn't hurt your car in the least. One session out on a track will work your car more than that weekend. Oil temps, trans temps, tire temps, and in particular, brake temps, will be substantially higher.

Get on track. Get an instructor, and learn what really driving the car is all about. It has sooooo much to offer is stock form. That no street drive can reproduce.

Cw.

 

Cw - What is it specifically about DT40 that makes it a wrong choice for a .2 car with a PDK? And what does the transmission type have to do with it?

 

(I was also at the rally this weekend) I run motul oil, and during some of those hard runs it would get to 225 oil, and always stays at 175 water temps. With the constant 4-6k for a LONG time, the oil will stay steady and never went over 225. Once we got out of the hard stuff, and were cruising, oil dropped back to 200 in about 10-15 min

 

What the designers of the oil say. Transmission type has nothing to do with it, it's the M97 vs the DI engine. Just pointing out that it's impossible to have a M97 with a PDK in the stock car I know the OP has.


Driven's DI Synthetic Engine Oil is designed specifically for Direct Fuel Injection Engines. The DI oil delivers cutting-edge lubricant technology specifically developed for direct injection engines. The DI oil utilizes an advanced additive package designed to reduce abnormal combustion, such as low speed pre-ignition issues, and protects against soot related wear. A lower volatility base oil also reduces crankcase vapors and carbon buildup on intake valves. All in a formula that will not harm your catalytic converter or gasoline particulate filters.**

DT: Developed in and for the M96/M97 engine for Porsche Boxster, Cayman, and 911 models as a collaboration between Joe Gibbs Racing Driven Oils, Flat 6 Innovations, and LN Engineering.

Learn more about Driven Racing Oil's Porsche Boxster rolling test bed for oil development over on PCA.org.


FORMULATED SPECIFICALLY FOR MODERN SPORTS CAR ENGINES

DT40 utilizes advanced synthetic base oils to provide high temperature and high shear protection for high output performance and turbocharged engines, as well as European sports car engines with and without variable valve timing. DT40 reduces oil consumption by limiting oil vaporization and foaming. Ideal for modern German, Italian and British sports car engines, and is compatible with E85 and water/methanol injection. Viscosity typical of 5W-40. An excellent upgrade over any factory Porsche approved A40 oil.

 

Thanks. I get it now. DT40 is not a wrong choice. DI 40 is the better choice. To paraphrase in summary, the DI 40 formulation can address the soot issues associated with the DFI .2 engine.

Looking at the Driven product literature, it appears that DI 40 is available as a 0W40 rather than a 5W40.

 

Ben, next time you come up, give me a heads up and I will take you for a ride through these mountains. I beat the **** out of this poor car and have put 17k miles in the past year alone, driving the Tail of the Dragon and Smoky Mountain roads on a weekly basis. These cars are built for the abuse, maintain it well and drive it like you stole it!

 

Thanks man! I could use a few lessons and pointers. I really need to do an HPDE

 

Just wanted to reply to everyone who mentioned DI40. Prior to my purchase, I spoke to Mr. Navarro himself, from @lnengineering and he told me to go with DT40. I trust him over you guys, lol, or over anyone frankly. Just sent him my used oil. Great guy and amazing company to work with.

 

I remember Jake Raby saying something like "engine oil impacts engine temperature more than anything else." It's possible there's something about my car that's prohibiting the oil from cooling down, but if not, then obviously Motul is more effective than Liqui Moly in this respect. I'll run the next rally with DT40. Excited to see if I get different results

 

Sounds like an amazing time. 3 days ripping through the mountains in a Porsche 911 are what a lot of people can only dream about. We are a very fortunate and blessed bunch to have such amazing machines to get our adrenaline pumping.

Remember the roots and heritage of our cars. They were developed with hours and hours of race car drivers flogging them lap after lap on the Nurburgring. Porsches reputation is built on countless races and championships won against the very best. Endurance races are all part of the equation too. I am sure that was a big part of your desire to own a Porsche, so don't hold back now!

In my history of pushing my cars to the limits in the canyons and racing at the track I became more and more confident with Porsches ability to take a licking and keep on kicking. Although you claim to be a "noob" it is good to see that you care very much about your cars maintenance. Oil is the life blood and keeping that fresh and in good shape has it's reward. Don't forget the high temp brake fluid as well. You pay to play and I go through tires and brakes about every 18 months or about every 10,000 miles. Stay on top of your maintenance and these cars will take very good care of you.

Don't sweat hitting the redline or hitting the rev limiter. It's bound to happen in these rev happy engines that love to zing to redline. I hit redline at least once a day just pulling out of my driveway! I do bat out of hell canyon runs a few times a month, and I keep a bag of diapers in the frunk just for passengers because I have a hard time saying no to redline. I have personally put over 80,000 miles on my C4S pushing it to the limits every time I drive it. I also have driven over 300,000 combined miles driving Porsches like a madman and not a single failure or hint of failure. Compared to the cars I owned before taking the Porsche red pill... these cars are amazing and continue to amaze me.

Although I exaggerate a bit... sort of.... I am just trying to say that our cars love to be pushed. It's not often we get to push our cars to the limits in the city, so when out in the mountains or good B roads... let it stretch it's legs and show you what it can really do!

 

Great story! Welcome to the slippery slope..

So, which corner of the dark web do I need to frequent to hear about these "rallying events"???