I work from home 😂

 

Read this thread. It’s totally normal to drive over 10 minutes before the gauge moves: https://rennlist.com/forums/997-foru...p-heat-up.html

 

These are Porsche 911s. If any of this was necessary or in anyway prudent, I would not drive a 911. I would go exclusively Ferrari, Aston Martin or something I could put gas in and drive without worry.

I am on at least number 35 and have generally put 10,000 to 15,000 miles a year on a 911 since I began daily driving them in the late 1980s. These things are very reliable and durable. I cannot tell you how many times I go from cold engine in pit lane to race track and full on throttle and don't drive them much differently in morning commutes and never had the need for any of this. Granted I do shy away from certain models, but have zero concerns about any of these with the couple of NA 997.2s I have had.

 

Interesting thread. I didn't think it was controversial to use an engine block heater, as pretty much everyone in Finland/Nordics who can will use one - and many office car parks also offer the sockets. They're made by DEFA which is a Norwegain outfit. We seem to think that it uses less fuel to start up, and the engine warms up quicker, when the block (oil and coolant) is preheated. Many people also have the interior heater, which is nice. And mine has an integrated battery conditioner. All from one little plug.

That being said, if I have to leave the car at the airport - where there are no sockets - or simply just park somewhere outside in the winter, the car will still start up after a few days at -20c (I don't know the equivalent in Fahrenheit but that's colder than your freezer) and I tend not to panic that I broke the engine. It just takes longer to warm up...

 

Think about how much electrical energy you're using up with these heaters running 24/7. Currently, there are over 6.6 million cars registered in Finland with over 5 million in daily traffic. Do the math. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand this is a waste for such little return. Finland need to get their heads out of their asses.

https://www.stat.fi/til/mkan/index_en.html

 

Lol, Finland. OP is from Memphis, Tennessee. Big difference . . . In more ways than just climate.

 

First, they are not operated 24/7. At most they'll run over night. Often, since those of us that use block heaters are also the ones footing the electric bill, we run them on timers so they only run a few hours before we leave for work.

Secondly, it is hypocritical for most people (especially Americans in warm climates that run their AC 24/7) to comment on the energy usage of Northerners. Yes, we heat our homes in winter. Don't you cool yours in summer?

Not that a Porsche forum is the place to preach wastefulness

 

Who said I was an American and lived in a warm climate? Look, it doesn't take an electrical engineer to explain that a electrical coil that is used to create heat consumes more energy than compressed gas does to create cool air. There was a time when so called "northerners" thought it was wise to warm fuel during the winter months. You see where that got them. This ranks up there with the advice to cover your snorkel while washing the car or don't park a Porsche on uneven payment.

 

... Except it takes more energy to compress the gas in the first place And who uses electric heating? Highly inefficient. Granted, forced air is inefficient. We use natural gas furnaces and forced air. Natural gas = much better than electric. Forced air = not so good ha. See forced air AC lol.

And, depending on where you live, yes, you will need to heat some fuels in the winter months. We have fuel additives to keep fuel (especially diesel) from gelling. There's also the issue of when you have temperature swings and start introducing condensation into fuel tanks. In winter, half is the new empty. Run your tank low on a warm day and don't fill up before a really cold day, and you'll be sucking water into the engine. No bueno. Intricacies to life wherever one lives.

 

Compared to what? Show me the data.

How many times have you recharged your AC in your car? your refrigerator? HVAC?

Last time I checked it was a very efficient way to cool environments. Or do you still prefer blocks of ice in front of oscillating fans?


You think electric heaters are stone age now, huh? So tell me. How do these fancy engine heaters generate heat? nuclear, natural gas, heating oil, coal?

How much energy does it consume?

Do you really think someone that lives in a hot/humid climate like Memphis, Tenn really needs such a device? It may only hit freezing two months out of the year in the southeastern part of the US.

Waste of time, money, and energy! You still think he does, then I have several boxes of shake weights to sell you for your 2020 exercise program.

 

You're confusing "recharging" with "compressing." Recharging is filling the system with refrigerant. Compressing is a continuous part of the process which is done by (surprise surprise) a compressor. Operating the compressor is the greatest energy load in a chiller unit (AC, fridge, freezer, etc.). It's efficient only in the sense that it is designed around an efficient refrigerant-to-air heat exchanger. Using air as a medium is highly inefficient, whether you are heating or cooling. Liquid-to-liquid exchangers are much more efficient, but humans happen to life in air, and not small puddles of water, so we need to warm / cool air.

Energy usage is typically stamped on the cord / package / unit itself. So, depends on the size. Many block heaters are around 200W. As far as heat transfer, it's relatively efficient as a block heater is embedded in the block itself (hence the name) and pad heaters are affixed directly to the pan. They have more losses as there is heat escaping through the side of the pad which is not in contact with the engine. Obviously, the engine loses heat in both scenarios.

If you refer to my previous posts, I mentioned several times that the OP needn't bother with any of this. I was merely pointing out that several other posters were suggesting that heating up the engine (whether you do it with an electric heater, two sticks, hamsters) would NOT have an impact in reducing the amount of time required for the engine to reach the desired operating temperature. It may not be a significantly relevant reduction in time, but heating something does, indeed, heat it. Where I'm from, this is something we're raised with. It's cold; you plug in; engine warms faster.

I'm not really sure what else there is to say, now that this thread seems sufficiently derailed.

To the OP:
It's an idea based in sound logic, absolutely, but as others have said, it's likely unnecessary in your climate.

 

[QUOTE=NuttyProfessor;16189354]Think about how much electrical energy you're using up with these heaters running 24/7. Currently, there are over 6.6 million cars registered in Finland with over 5 million in daily traffic. Do the math. Doesn't take a rocket scientist to understand this is a waste for such little return. Finland need to get their heads out of their asses.

/QUOTE]

Our heaters run for maybe an hour, and once the block is warmed, they turn themselves off. A warm block is easier to start. It really isn't anything to get worked up about.

 

In a perfect world I think the block and oil would be at 100 plus degrees before Starting all the time. As such the question is more ....why would you not heat it ??.?.?.? The consensus is these engines like to be warm before you get on it so the quicker and less temp change the better.......the more often you can prevent a drastic cold start the better.....

 

Yeah exactly. Using pure logic, heating the engine is a win. As far as energy use, I don’t think you’d need to heat it all night. I imagined myself plugging it in after I woke up and unplugging it an hour later when I left the house.

But I couldn’t find anything that could safely and legitimately heat the oil. I found a bunch of aircraft products designed to heat aircraft components. So I got excited for a sec. But unfortunately there just aren’t any heaters small enough to fit under the car.

I’ve given up and I plan to simply change my oil more frequently due to frequent short trips.

 

I wouldn't normally fuss about it, but this thread bugs me.

It has suddenly been pretty cold here in Denver. A couple days ago our low was -3F. So I thought I'd revisit this question of how long does it take to warm up the engine. I haven't started the 997.2 in 5 or more days.

Engine oil started at 48F ambient inside my garage. Outside temp measured 36F. Easy driving, keeping the revs around 3K. Oil temp lifted from the minimum after 7 minutes. Hit 175F at 8 minutes.

Water temp was already showing 175F at 4 minutes.