That's the key; knowing where "overboard" is.

I've operated some very high performance vehicles, and my thoughts on all of them was that "I'd like more"; when I was younger, 900 mph at 100 feet was exciting, but I wanted "more". There comes a time (generally age related) when practically and reality finally rule the day on the "I want more" voice in your head.

Early on in my Turbo owning experience I was very tempted to get into what seems to be the never ending "mod" kick, but in the end decided that I'd pick a fairly reasonable performance point, target that, and be done with it. The practicality and reality of the situation is that there is a limit to what I will do in my car on public roads (I don't track my cars, and I don't street race). What I find entertaining is high longitudinal g, and given that I don't want to go to jail or loose my license, the high longitudinal g I'm after is that produced from 0 (or low speed) to the legal speed limit plus a reasonable and safe additive. I certainly don't care about 90-160 mph acceleration, and I couldn't care less about top speed. My personal target in terms of acceleration is what my '02 Turbo with EVOMS Stage II programing, EP2 Loud exhaust, and LWFW provides; I've been out of the mod game for many years now, and I've been very happy with my Turbo. Higher output numbers (HP/TQ) brings traction issues that defeat the acceleration improvement window I like.

In terms of brakes, the OEM system provides PLENTY of capability for street use.

The OEM U.S. Turbo does IMO need lowering, but in terms of improving handling and steering feel? The car comes form the factory with WAY more ability than public roads can challenge it with (assuming one doesn't want to have too high a risk of going to jail).

 

I am slowly learning that Dock---it's just taken some time for it to sink into my hard head. Kevin at UMW talked some sense into me about going overboard with mods. If one isn't tracking the car then most of it is just plain overkill that compromises the street ability of the car. The hard part is knowing when to back off---mod fever sets in and all reason goes out the window.

 

I am glad I got the car I wanted all ready modified. Everything I would have done is done though I would have went with a lighter exhaust then doing the bypass on the stock exhaust and I am sure that there are other things modified that I don't know about and would not have done.
The only mods I would have done is pss9/10's for looks and for the few DE track days I do, exhaust for noise, ecu tune for performance and a double din nav/bluetooth unit for everyday usefulness. The car I have now is plenty fast and handles great and it can be driven to work or to the track. I would have ended up having to pay an extra 35k if I went for a 997tt and that's one that's probably been abused.

I do think of replacing the rear lid with a carbon GT2 replica and change out the turbo intakes for the ones that look more like the 997 intakes but then I think the car looks good the way it is so why bother.

 

My suggestion is for people to take a hard and realistic look at what a reasonable target is, and then step away once they achieve it, ignoring the "I want more" voice in their head.

On a related note, I think there is quite a bit of "mine is faster than yours" or "my car can run the Ring in XXX..." going on that causes some people to take what I consider to be an unrealistic approach to sports cars, even if they do track their car. And if they do track their car, the chances that they could ever come close to a manufacturer's Ring lap time is laughable.

As I said, I don't track my Turbo, so any discussion about 996 Turbo lap times is meaningless to me. I don't street race either, so when another sports car pulls up next to me at a stop light his car's 0-60 time means nothing to me. I have friends who have modified Mustangs and friends who own Vettes, and some of them like to say "my car will beat your Turbo...". I have two answers for them...1) They can't "beat" me if I don't run them, and 2) If I cared I could certainly afford to either buy and modify a Mustang or buy a Vette if I wanted to, so what's the big deal?

 

I enjoy my car for what it is currently: fast and fun to drive. I do want it to handle better (just got my H&R sways to compliment the PSS9's), shift better (GT3 or Numeric in the running), but what I do dearly love is a nice linear kick in the pants.

The UMW tune I have delivers that, and I havent burned up my clutch (yet). I don't like a loud exhaust, and I don't like flashy visual mods. So, to Dock's point, I think my ending point is in sight with a 2a upgrade. I won't ever race on a track, as I don't have time, and I'm not willing to plow into a guardrail in something I polish with diapers.

The question I started asking myself at the beginning of all of this, is if a 2a car is monumentally different than a stock 997.1TT. I think the answer to that is, yes, a 2a car is quicker, more linear, and more ferocious than a stock 997.1...BUT, it doesn't change the fact that I still like the 997's and will get one most likely some day.

I don't expect an answer to this, but I do enjoy reading others' opinions

 

Dock...I agree. Sorry to go off-topic there Scott. I apologize. We went away from what Scott was asking and into philosophy. Sorry.

I have spent 26 years on motorcycles and did a fair share of track days and racing. People would always get hung-up on what bike was faster on paper and stats than improving their riding skills. It would show immediately when some guy/girl would show up with a 1098 or an R1 and they would be slamming on the brakes in the corners terrified to go into a turn. They could never grasp downshifting/braking BEFORE the turn and would as such either crash or go around the turn while hanging on for dear-life. My advice was to always spend the cash on riding schools than chromed-out mods and race dampers, exhausts, pegs, etc.

I need to step back and take my own advice. Again--sorry Scott. I went off-topic.

 

Pretty cool C2...got to love Rennlist...

 

I'm in the same mindset as Dock. I will probably get a new exhaust at some point in the future, but I'm pretty much done with the performance mods. UMW tune, X73, 997 GT3 shifter. Way more capability than I can use on the street, and loads of fun on the Hill Country twisties.

As for a 997 or 991. I am regularly asked if my 996 is new.

 

Especially if you've seen his car...I love it!

 

None needed, these threads are never meant to cover only one topic or line of discussion!

 

I think the journey is part of the fun. I came from the 993tt world, believing it was the [only] Porsche to own. With the 993, I got caught up in the "every mile I drive it is decreasing value" trap. So, I decided to go 996, could have gone 997, but thought, why not take advantage of the depreciation curve, buy a very nice 996, mod it to the level I want, drive it, enjoy it and don't think about resale. This is what I am doing. Great car and bang for the buck! Did the UMW tune, and then a few thousand miles later added the stage 2 turbos. LOVE IT. My only semi-regret is not going for a gt2, which is what I think my next Porsche will be. In the mean time, loving the 996.

 

I have a 996TT with 1 bar tune and 100 cell cat aftermarket exhaust. To expand on the 996TT X50 post above, another local came by and we drove each other's cars. The other was a 996TT cab with X50. The consensus was my was way quicker to 100mph then the X50. Spool up was faster and seat of pants acceleration was significantly harder. Can't say what above 100 mph was like, as the off ramp had ended and the freeway traffic was not cooperating with my entry speed. The X50 had a much more linear and locomotive like pull, and I bet it was stronger in the upper range of RPM. My car supposedly dynoed at 485 crank and 500ft/lb. Without having driven a 997TT, I would guess it is close.

 

I said this before; setting the looks preference aside - between well sorted 996tt (tune, exhaust, pss10's) and well sorted 997tt (same upgrades) there is sod all in it in the real world. I couldn't care less if 997tt pulls 10 car lengths on me from 0 all the way to top speed. As far as proper driving on twisty roads is concerned, it all comes down to the pilot! And in this real world, on a tight twisty road, Walter Röhrl would out drive most of us driving 997 GT2 RS in the 964.

 

I agree 100%. I ran against an ex-MotoGP racer once out in the twisties---my 190 hp Ducati versus his little 80 hp enduro. After several turns he basically left me for dead. Skill>power.

 

I think it's even more basic than that. Few drivers are willing to drive their sports cars at the 10/10's performance level in the curves, because there is rarely room for recovering from mistakes when operating at that performance level. So my experience has been that the driver with the bigger ***** (smaller brain maybe?) ends up for example operating at 9/10's while the other driver decides that a more appropriate performance level is 7/10's.