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weird misfire issues after paint work

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Old 03-15-2012, 10:01 PM
  #16  
MICHAELWWW
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Ok so went and bought a scanner these are the codes:
P2A01
P2196
P0421
All look pretty consistent with O2 precat sensor issues. I already read your posts With johnamg for the first 2 codes from last year. Any more info to add with the third code? This is the 2nd time the CEL has come on. Looks like I am consuming oil to the tune of .5 quarts of oil to 1 quart for 3000 miles. Car runs great but I am not a big fan of not knowing. Very curious by nature. Dealer told me not to worry because The car is still under warranty but I dont want to make him prove it. Read some posts that were concerned that this could be a problem further upstream. Thoughts very welcome 1st Porsche .
Old 03-15-2012, 11:02 PM
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Macster
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Originally Posted by MICHAELWWW
Ok so went and bought a scanner these are the codes:
P2A01
P2196
P0421
All look pretty consistent with O2 precat sensor issues. I already read your posts With johnamg for the first 2 codes from last year. Any more info to add with the third code? This is the 2nd time the CEL has come on. Looks like I am consuming oil to the tune of .5 quarts of oil to 1 quart for 3000 miles. Car runs great but I am not a big fan of not knowing. Very curious by nature. Dealer told me not to worry because The car is still under warranty but I dont want to make him prove it. Read some posts that were concerned that this could be a problem further upstream. Thoughts very welcome 1st Porsche .
Let me address things a bit out of order.

The level of oil consumption is not scary. 0.5 to 1.0 quart in 3K miles is not that much oil.

My advice would be to revisit the dealer and tell the dealer that tellling you not to worry is not sufficient.

You have a very nice and expensive car. It is signaling something is wrong by a well documented and government mandated mechanism.

Because this warning light comes on you are worried and even having to run to the dealer just to be told not to worry is not your idea of the kind of service you expected to receive when you bought the car.

Tell the dealer that because of this warning light and this dealer's inability to do anything of substance about this problem you have lost all enjoyment of the use of the vehicle.

Remind the dealer one of the reasons you bought the car was because of the very skilled/trained and professional service department that you were told would be available to you should any problems arise.

Well, a problem has arisen and it should be professionally addressed.

Also, always whenever you take a car in be sure to get an official copy of a work order, something that shows the car's make/mode/VIN, other details, your name, mileage, date and so on. Also, it should include -- even if you have to write it in in pen yourself -- a reason why the car is in. Even if you accept the car back be sure you get a copy and save a copy for your records.

You want a paper trail that you were bringing this car in for this problem in case -- though you shouldn't let it go this long -- in case the car is out of warranty and this problem returns. Only this time the dealer says there is a problem and it will cost you to get it fixed.

Anyhow, the error codes:

P0421 - Warm up catalyst efficiency below threshold, bank 1.

P2196 - O2 sensor signal biased/stuck rich, bank 1, sensor 1.

P2A01 - O2 sensor circuit range/performance, bank 1, sensor 2.

I do not have any diagnostic steps to post for someone trying to trouble shoot the above. The dealer though should have oodles of info on what is necessary to get at the root cause.

Off the of my head, the bank 1 sensor 1 is questionable. If this is not working the DME has no control over fueling. That is it relies upon the signal from both #1 sensors to know that when it varies the amount of fuel it injects goes up or down (and the DME varies the amount of fuel it injects from stoichiometric every second or so and sometime in less than one second and on purpose) that the O2 level in the exhaust changes and this change reflects whether the DME was adding or subtracting fuel.

Right there then this is serious. Not engine blows sky high serious but serious.

For one thing -- if you want some ammo to prod the dealer into acting upon this -- the DME could be adding too much fuel which could wash away some oil from the cylinder walls and lead to premature engine wear. Another concern is this increases the amount of fuel contamination in the oil which lowers its viscosity and could result in accelerated engine wear.

More ammo? Likely the car is not emission compliant either and if emissions checks/compliance is required in your area mention to the dealer -- if the next time you visit the dealer you get the brush off -- that you are thinking about having the car checked to see if it passes emissions. The car's emissions systems (the big money items at least) are warrantied for years and miles beyond the new car warranty.

Also, mention in an offhand way, that a frustrated customer -- you -- because you are unable to get a dealer to take proper action on this problem might be inclined to call the state's emissions agency and ask what recourse you have if your car doesn't pass emissions and the dealer appears to be unwilling to do anything about this.

Anyhow, because the #1 sensor does not appear to be working properly and the fueling is not as accurate as it should be -- the fueling wants to be very close to the ideal or stoichiometric ratio (approx. 14.72:1) for it is when the engine is fed this ratio of air and fuel the exhaust gases are most efficiently processed -- this stoichiometric ratio is very narrow with just a fraction too much or too little air to gas and the converter's efficiency drops like a rock in water...

Uh, where was I? Oh yeah, because the #1 sensor appears to *not* be working properly the other errors likely spring from that.

But I'm not qualified to diagnosis this. You need to visit the dealer and insist this be taken care of, looked at and diagnosed and corrected by a professional Porsche tech.

As I touched upon above, ask that you are given the level service that you were led to believe you'd receive should something go amiss.

If the dealer can't or won't give this to you suggest -- in the proper manner which I'm sure you know -- that had you known the dealer would not be able to properly service a car it is supposed to be able to service, that you would have bought another brand of car. Thus it seems in order to sell you a Porsche you were possibly misled regarding the level of service that could be supplied -- though of course say this with disbelief in your voice -- that you were a victim of consumer fraud.

Also, in some way -- if you want -- wonder out loud what PCNA customer service would have to say about a dealer that when you bring in a car with a check engine light on and error codes logged but sends you packing with a don't worry be happy send off.

Don't lather the above on too heavy. Easy does it, but have something with which to come back with if the dealer once again tries to well blow you off.

And it might.

It might because this technique has worked with you (and countless others) in the past.

So now you have to overcome a learned behavior on the dealer's part.

In short, take a bigger stick with you next time you visit the dealer. Use it only if you have to, but know how to use it and be prepared to use it.

Bottom line is you want your car fixed so you can resume enjoying the car.

Sincerely,

Macster.
Old 03-16-2012, 09:38 AM
  #18  
MICHAELWWW
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Thanks Macster! I was all too willing on my part to accept a mystery CEL that I hoped would not return. I don't foresee a big showdown with the dealer. They said if the light came back on they wanted me to come back and they would dig into it deeper. I will let you know the outcome. Thanks again!



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