Originally Posted by Oak

sharky, that sounds like one fast caddy! It's great to go out and purchase what you think is a great vehicle but to actually build a vehicle to fill virtually all your perfomance dreams in all types of forums is a difficult task. I think you just may have achieved it. One caddy for daddy, please!

Originally Posted by Woodster

Sharkey, after reading all you have had to say, and reading
the twin turbo shootout about 100 times, I must say your car is
amazing!!! (Craig's must be as well).
When is the next shootout?
(I hope we didnt "drive" Craig back to 6-speed forever!!)
Marty

Originally Posted by Jean

The HP is just an estimate as Craig stated, not based on acceleration numbers, nor a dyno run.

My understanding is that Stephen (who ran against Craig) had stage 2ZC turbos on stock intercoolers and only the ECU from Protomotive at 1.2 bar, you certainly cannot expect to compare your car running 2 Bar and large turbos to his !?

Since 6speed was quoted before, I think I am not breaking any rules, here is an extract from 6speed of Craig's estimate:

"My best GUESSTIMATE is that I’m making somewhere north of 950 hp at the crank. Here is how I arrived at that guesstimate:

Mana’s GT800 made 730 hp at the wheels.*** Using a 15% drive train loss, that equates to 860 hp at the crank (860 x .85 = 730). I am using the same turbos, fuel system and GT800 components as Mana, but I have the following additional modifications which increase my hp beyond the 860 mark:

1. Mana’s car was running approximately 1.5-1.6 bar when he made 860 hp. I am running 2.0 bar. I have heard varying estimates of how much hp is generated for each additional .1 bar of boost – most of the people I have spoken estimate that each .1 bar adds about 20-25 hp. Using a conservative 16 hp per .1 bar conversion, my additional boost should increase my hp by at least 65 hp (probably more).

860 hp + 65 hp = 925 hp

2. Mana’s car was using a chamber muffler exhaust, with cats, when he made 860 hp. I do not have cats, nor a restrictive chamber muffler, and I am using larger piping than Mana’s exhaust (I am using 76 mm piping). Again, I have heard varying estimates of how much power is gained by removing the cats -- probably something in the area of 15-20 hp. My use of straight through racing mufflers, rather than restrictive chamber mufflers, also adds at least 10 hp (probably more). Its difficult to say how much power I gain with the larger piping (perhaps 5-10 hp). Therefore, on the conservative side, my exhaust is giving me an additional 30 hp.

925 hp + 30 hp = 955 hp

3. I am using Innovative Pro Design’s (“IPD”) intake plenum, which they claim makes an additional 30 hp on a mildly modified 996TT. IPD believes their intake plenum is making more than 30 hp on my car given the additional air velocity and volume generated by my larger turbos. A Corvette guy posted on Rennlist yesterday that a similar product made for NA Corvettes makes 10-15 hp. Remaining conservative, Ill go with the 15 hp figure, even though I strongly believe the number is higher.

955 hp + 15 hp = 970 hp

4. I am using IPD’s modified intercooler end tanks and y-pipe. In a separate thread, I explained these products in detail. There is no doubt that the OEM intercooler end tanks restrict air flow, particularly on higher hp cars. EVO MS recently told a 6speed member that they are designing a similar product which they will be incorporated into their packages. Speed Gallery estimates that these superior end tanks, and the larger y-pipe, generate around 15-20 hp. Remaining conservative, Ill go with 10 hp.

970 hp + 10 hp = 980 hp

5. Lastly, I am using an Aquamist methanol/water injection system (direct spray into the intake). I am also using separate Aquamist methanol/water intercooler sprays. This mod is less about gaining power, and more about retaining power when temperatures rise. Remaining conservative, I will not add anything for this mod, even though it probably gives me some additional hp.

980 hp. Based on the foregoing, I think I am safe in estimating something north of 950 hp (which is 30 hp less than my conservative computation).

Craig"

Running against Alex D. will certainly be interesting.

Originally Posted by Jean

Sharky
Can you share what sort of "extras" do you mean when you talk about Alex's car? Most of us know CJV's, but Alex has a rather conventional engine. I also know he does not use NOS, nor does he use any sort of water/methanol injection in his intake (which BTW I am convinced it does not bring anything at all to the table on a properly mapped engine, namely AFRs) so I am curious to find out, as I read it in one of Craig's posts and now here.
We also have not seen any follow-up on the video or pictures from Alex D's that were supposed to be posted after Willow S.
We have diverted so much from the original post, but it seems that Craig might have left the thread, so I hope it is ok..

Originally Posted by Jean

Sharky, thanks, this is what I meant by conventional... good head work, internals, properly sized turbos, good breathing intake and exhaust system etc.. Alex D's engine is about 15% more efficient than what Todd built for me 323HP/Absolute bar vs. 370HP/Absolute bar, and this is about exactly how much the watercooled engine is more efficient than air cooled engine.

What I mean to say is Todd has not used any tricks, he has just reached the same efficiency levels, through his experience, as the other air cooled engines that he has been building for years, with the added benefit of a better platform. Any 996TT engine can be built by Todd to reach these numbers going forward, and get at 1.3 Bars the performance others might be getting at 1.8-2.0 Bars. It is all about efficiency

It would be great to hear from Alex here, especially if he would be willing to share some numbers I know Todd told me that he ran in the 5's 60-130mph when he was testing it!!

Originally Posted by Jean

Sharky,

What CJV is doing is admirable, only maybe a bit too much IMO and therefore the chances of something going wrong are quite high (I certainly hope I am wrong). I guess if one can afford it and has the time and patience, why not? In my case I need to be driving, and bench racing

.