Dock

More "low end grunt" in terms of wheel torque?

Dock

For me, the art form of smoothly and accurately coordinating both of my feet and my right arm/hand to achieve the desired dynamic results while driving a 996 Turbo with a manual transmission is a large "driving experience" additive. So for me, driving a Tip 996 Turbo would detract from the driving experience.

Obviously, opinions vary.

Carlo_Carrera

TT models vs NA. NA models pre-2002, and some post 2002, use a completely different transmission.

Turbos, X50 and Turbo S all use the same Mercedes 722.6 transmission.

Carlo_Carrera

Yes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Torque...multiplication

Dock

Considering just 1st and 2nd gear ("low end grunt" gears IMO), the Tip without its torque multiplying stator is at an acceleration disadvantage versus the manual transmission because of the Tip's overall gear ratios in both of those gears. The manual transmission has a wheel torque advantage over the Tip (without the Tip's torque multiplying stator in the calculation) of ~27% in 1st gear, and 11% in 2nd gear. Are you saying that the Tip's torque multiplying stator more than makes up for those disadvantages?

Carlo_Carrera

Yes, but it is not just me saying it, did your read the link?

Big Swole

Torque converters still leave a car / truck in "fluid drive" unless or until the TC goes into "Lock Up" (Not sure if a Tip has a lock up TC or not).
Then and only then is it considered a 1 to 1 drive like a MT car / truck would be.

Anytime you can get to 1-to-1 drive, you are better off for acceleration / pulling. (At least in the diesel world. I manually locked my TC as soon as my truck hit 2nd gear! Let'r Eat!!!).

Carlo_Carrera

Turbo Tip has a locking torque converter.

Dock

So as compared to the manual, how much more wheel torque (in Nm) does the Tip have at peak engine torque in 1st and 2nd gears?

Road King

Welcome aboard!

I'm also an ex-Mustang guy (and ex Viper & Subie STi) and I daily drove a 440whp Vortech'd 'Notch back in the 90s. Was fast, but the 911 Turbo platform is of course so much more sophisticated and really puts the power down!

I'm 4+ years into ownership and love my Turbo! Light mods will make a huge difference, tune, exhaust, shifter (for manual cars), steering wheel and it's quite transformed.

2fcknfst

*Gets Popcorn*

Oh, and welcome!

Carlo_Carrera

It isn't the peak torque that is increased. It is the torque curve that is enhanced. Clearly you did not read the material I linked.

2fcknfst

*Wonders what an 'enhanced' torque curve looks like*

*munch, munch...*

Dock

Given stock engines the Tip and the manual will generally produce the same engine torque at each point along the RPM range. The difference then between the two cars in terms of wheel torque (which is the torque we're talking about here) is a function of the different gear sets, final drive ratios, and the addition of the torque multiplying stator in the Tip. I know from calculations what the wheel torque is for the Tip without the torque multiplying stator, and it's ~ 27% less than the manual transmission in 1st gear and ~11% less in 2nd gear, and this applies across the RPM range. You stated that the Tip has more "low end grunt" than the manual, so certainly you have numbers that show the torque multiplying stator more than making up for those disadvantages. So post up the numbers.

2fcknfst

Point to Dock...

*munch, munch, munch...*