Its just funny how when the PCCB were released on the GT2 Porsche claimed they were as good on the track as the street, leading people to think, WOW these are the "Real Deal" as far as brakes would go for track people, and then the big let downs began, people shouldnt have to fight and argue to have these replaced, Porsche should be making good some way, some how.

 

Dear Justin,
In a perfect world I would agree but the PCCBs were optional and this gives Porsche some let us say legal wiggle room. Also the customer base that has been let down is fairly small and even less actually track them. No excuses just an explanation of how these things tend to work. If and when PCCB become standard then it is a different ball game.
PCCB only ever offered longer life (failed miserably) and improved fading properties. The tests from Porsche as far back as 1999 (yes they did write them up) showed that the steel brakes were just as good in the stopping department from cold as the PCCBs. Even when super hot there was only a metre or so difference.
I also know that a couple of Rennlisters at the time tried to tell Porsche and one even went to great expense to show them that the PCCB concept as it stands was not very efficient but they did not listen. Cooling issues were pointed out as were brake pad material problems.
However if you have ever dealt with any manufacturer of anything you will know that if you find fault with their product they are not very receptive. Even if you are there at their request to find such problems. Been there done that bought that t-shirt.
Ciao,
Adrian
964C4
GT-2

 

Adrian,

How can you say they were an 'option'.
On my 03 GT2 they were standard.
Like many others , I was misleaded by PCNA/PAG
regarding the PCCB's extreme braking characteristics.

Well, we all know what happened there.
I for one am waiting for a cost effective replacement.
If PAG has actually 'solved' these premature wear issues, maybe they should 'stand behind ' their
products and replace their first generation of PCCB
FREE of charge to all those that currenlty have them.

Come to think of it, they are only after $$$ these days,
so the above suggestion is not a viable option.

Just my .02 cents

 

We carefully compared a 2004 GT3 Cup car rotor to a 2004 GT3 street car rotor while at the track a couple of weeks ago. They are quite similar but not exactly the same, which, I suppose, is why they carry different part numbers. The Cup car rotor has slightly larger cast cooling holes and the 5 holes in the hub are also larger to fit over the dogs on the center lock hubs. The street car rotors won't fit over these dogs and therefore can't be used on the Cup car without drilling. However, the Cup car rotor, which as you said is significantly cheaper, will fit on the street car and the larger holes should aid in brake cooling, so i don't see a downside to using the Motorsport rotors on a street car, just don't try to do the opposite.

Karl

 

Thanks Karl, that is great to know. If there isn't an all round floating system that works better, at least I have a cheap solution when my current OEM ones are toasted.

 

Dear 0396,
Firstly I am not defending Porsche. I was aware of problems with PCCB before they ever came out but bad luck nobody who mattered was listening.
PCCB have always been options on the GT-2 and GT-3. Even if every GT-2 delivered to the USA is fitted with them they are still an option not standard. Standard is the base model engineering drawings. When the PCCBs are listed in these drawings they then become standard.
Legal stuff but this is what it is all about.
What you receive in the USA are known as "Dealer configured cars". This is where the dealers select their own base model but they use the options list to do it. This is where the dealer network decide what they think is the right set of bits and pieces to maximum the interest of the American buyer or in the UK the UK buyer etc. Whether you choose or somebody else chooses on your behalf PCCB are still an option at the factory.
I had to write quite a lengthy piece in my first Porsche book to explain this.
I agree entirely that Porsche should meet their obligations and provide the system that you paid for.
I disagree that you were deliberately misled. Porsche genuinely believed these things would work perfectly. They didn't and now it has to be fixed. However it is just one of these things that happen. Some companies do not respond well to such issues, PAG among them but your first port of call is the PCNA. They are legally responsible in the USA for all these issues.
Ciao,
Adrian
964C4
GT-2

 

Karl and Andrew,

A large number of the GT3 fraternity use the Motorsport disks due to their lower cost, they are a direct bolt on as you stated.

Only wish I had gone with the Steel option, in the immortal words of the Great Homer J... DOH!

 

Karl,

Excuse me in advance if this is a stupid question. I am ordering an 05 GT3 with the steel brakes. I do plan on tracking it some, but not a ton. Should I opt for the motorsport disks from the beginning (if it's even possible)? Or are they only for the PCCB's?

Thanks,

chris

 

Chris: The motorsports disks can't be ordered on the car but they're what you'd use for replacements for the standard iron rotors. They can be used to replace the PCCB discs but one would have to change the rear caliper as it's different between the PCCB and iron brake setup.

 

Thanks Steve.

 

I wonder if they'll disclose their findings as to exactly what Porsche (or the manufacture of the rotors) think is happening.

I posted my hypotheses here and here.

I'd be curious to see what Porsche offers up as rationale.

 

It seems that most of the problems are occuring with the front PCCB's so why not just replace the fronts with steel and leave the rears alone??

 

Brake bias would be one reason off the top of my head; I'm sure there's a significant difference in the co of friction at different temps between steel and PCCB.

Another reason, IIRC, is Bob R. reporting toasted rear rotors as well.

 

Have to agree, my rears don't look a lot beter than the fronts...

I do know of one car that is running steel front and PCCB rear without any problems, don't know if I fancy it though.

P.

 

If you ordered an option from a car company known for making race cars (on a car that is damn near a race car) that cost as much as a Ford Focus new, then when it wears out after a few hundred miles of track time you should get them replace no questions asked, a few steak dinners, and a few other services that can't be typed on this forum.

Shame on PCNA for responding this way. I wonder what they would do if you said your cupholder in your Cayenne couldn't handle a Super-Big Gulp.