brh986

I don't like it. I would never spend $200k on a sports car without a manual transmission. Maybe it shifts faster and matches revs better than any human but where's the fun in it?

Has anyone driven a car with a ferrari F1 system? What do you think? I do admit I haven't driven a Ferrari with an F1 system but I drove an SMG M3, it got old quick.


While on the topic why does porsche's tip suck so much? I can't believe they haven't developed something comparable to Ferrari's system or even the BMW system. Does anyone know if one is in the works? What's taking them so long? The porsche tiptronic is a joke!

Steve in FL

brh986: You need to get a better source for rumors. Porsche is reportedly going to offer a double clutch system along the lines of the Audi DSG in the 997. As for the tip sucking, it's sad to say but a true automatic system is probably a better choice than a manumatic for a large percentage of today's Porsche buyers.

brh986

That's why I was asking

Quote:

Porsche is
reportedly going to offer a double clutch system along the lines of the Audi DSG in the 997. As for the tip sucking, it's sad to say but a true automatic system is probably a better choice than a manumatic for a large percentage of today's Porsche buyers.

Now that you mention it I think I remember hearing that. I have a vague understanding of how that works and know that it greatly increases acceleration over a regular automatic but is this better than a ferrari like system? Is it better in terms of real sport driving or just better in terms of absolute acceleration performance?

Why does Porsche attract so many people that want an automatic transmission?

After attending a couple of ferrari track events I would have to say of the entire Ferrari ownership pool I think there is a larger percentage of posers there than in the Porsche ranks. While driving a Boxster S at one event and a 350 Z (not even the track model) another I continually lapped most of the guys out there. Got it on video too

Steve in FL

brh986: Google is your friend. Go to http://www.google.com and search on "Audi DSG".

As for why Porsche attracts so many people that want automatic transmissions you're asking in the wrong forum. This is the GT2 & GT3 forum which is Tiptronic free.

brh986

Thank god

wch

"While driving a Boxster S at one event and a 350 Z (not even the track model) another I continually lapped most of the guys out there. Got it on video too "

You're driving with the wrong Ferrari guys! I just sold my 360 Challenge, but I have a Stradale and I'd be glad to run with you at the next FCA or PCA event I can get to - you can pick the track - perhaps a friendly wager would be in order .... ;-)

To be fair, I've found the driving in PCA DEs, in the higher run groups, to be generally very good. FCA event drivers IN GENERAL tend to be more laid back and conservative, perhaps less experienced and not as interested in getting close to the edge. It's not that they are poseurs - I'd think poseurs are unlikely to take either Ferraris or Porsches to the track. In my limited experience, FCA events also host drivers with very extensive track & racing experience in a variety of cars - but probably not as many club hotshoes you might find at the typical popular PCA DE.

As for the Ferrari F1, I believe it has improved significantly over time. My 360 Challenge car shifted better than my '99 360. The Stradale seems to shift even better than the 360C, but I have not yet had it to a track. I understand your preference for the classic manual transmission - as you can see from my signature, I have a 5 speed 964 I love. I guess the F1 is somewhat closer than the manual to the increasingly popular sequential gearboxes one finds even on lower level race cars.

Forza Ferrari.

brh986

Hey now, I never said I could beat anybody that drives a ferrari with a lessor car or even that I could beat any ferrari driver in the same car. All I said was from my limited expirience that the ferrari drivers I encountered didn't have a clue how to drive their cars. This is from the small subset that actually drive them at all and the even smaller subset that take those cars to the track. It would seem like about 1% of ferrari owners even have a clue what the cars designed for, granted you sound like you're in that 1%.

Quote:

To be fair, I've found the driving in PCA DEs, in the higher run groups, to be generally very good. FCA event drivers IN GENERAL tend to be more laid back and conservative, perhaps less experienced and not as interested in getting close to the edge. It's not that they are poseurs - I'd think poseurs are unlikely to take either Ferraris or Porsches to the track. In my limited experience, FCA events also host drivers with very extensive track & racing experience in a variety of cars - but probably not as many club hotshoes you might find at the typical popular PCA DE.

There's alot of Porsche owners that definitely as I described above but also alot that aren't. I find even the green run group at PCA events to be driving considerably quicker than the intermediate ferrari guys, granted that was only based on 2 events. In all it just seems incredibly sad that so few that are privilidged enough to own ferraris actually drive them and fewer still drive them as intended.

tdf360

I test drove an F1 360, thinking that would be my choice in gearboxes. Didn't like it, bought the 6 spd. The F1 didn't seem to do what I expected/wanted. I'll grant a short test drive is not definitive and I know a lot of F1 drivers are very satisfied, it just wasn't for me.

Gary

skl

Had a M3 SMG before the GT3- yes, it got old pretty fast. Would never buy it again. Drove the DSG in the Audi TT and it was seamless but I still prefer the manual obviously- as noted above, thank God this is a tip-free zone

brh986

I just wonder where does it all end? Today the car shifts for you and matches revs for you... Tomorrow will the latest ferrari adjust your steering inputs to make sure you hit the apex?

GrantG

I like the manual much better too, although the new Ferrari system that was on the 575M Maranello I drove was much improved over the systems on the F355, F360 and M3. The 2-pedal setups will improve with time to be more efficient, fast and smooth, but nothing matches the driver involvement of the 3-pedal setup and the fun of learning the heel-toe techniques on the track

1988952

That gated Ferrari shifter is SLOWWW, the F1 shifts much faster, more"driver involvment " usually amounts to slower laptimes,technology goes forwards not backwards .
If you care to watch Formula 1 you will get the point,they dumped that manuel shifter a long time ago in favor of the paddleshifter.

BTW,the Stradale's software is much better calibrated than the rest of the Ferrari line up and comparing it to the BMW Smg, well let's just say it's not in the same league.

brh986

So what?

I'll bet they could even put little magnets in the road and the cars could drive themselves and they would probably be even faster. What's the point of going faster if half the work is done by a computer? Technology is fine up the point where it starts driving for you. Maybe that's a good thing in basic transporation but certainly not in a sports car.

tdf360

Do you speak from recent experience? My 360 6 spd is as slick-shifting as any manual I've ever owned, which includes several 911's, Turbo Carrera's, and M3's (E36 and E46). I'd heard stories of slow shifters in earlier Ferrari models, but on the 360 test drive I loved it, bought it, and have never regretted it. I can give it the highest gearbox praise: it is completely transparent.

Gary

brh986

I can't comment on the others but the M3 is awful in the shifter department.