Air Cooled Porsche Market
12-13-2015, 11:16 AM
#1
Pro
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Greater Seattle (via NH)
Posts: 552
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Air Cooled Porsche Market
Watching Chasing Classic Cars yesterday, Wayne Carini mentioned he had sold a 356 based Speedster for over $300,000.
Then, on the live Mecum Auction (I think Austin Tx) all the air-cooled 911s were selling for stratospheric prices.
Given the money these cars are bringing, they could not possibly be used as daily drivers. So what that tells me is that our 996s and 997s will hold their value as Porsche enthusiasts rediscover them.
Then, on the live Mecum Auction (I think Austin Tx) all the air-cooled 911s were selling for stratospheric prices.
Given the money these cars are bringing, they could not possibly be used as daily drivers. So what that tells me is that our 996s and 997s will hold their value as Porsche enthusiasts rediscover them.
12-13-2015, 11:49 AM
#2
Race Director
12-13-2015, 12:10 PM
#3
Pro
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Greater Seattle (via NH)
Posts: 552
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
At the prices you've listed certainly could be driven daily. But what I've seen are double or triple the numbers you've listed. At those values, they will not be daily drivers.
12-13-2015, 02:20 PM
#5
Race Director
Nah, I use the 7tt as a daily. No reason I couldn't use the 3tt, but i only drive a mile to the train station
12-13-2015, 04:18 PM
#6
Pro
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2002
Location: Greater Seattle (via NH)
Posts: 552
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
There's a '94 cabriolet listed in today's Seattle Times (under 20k miles) for $225k. Canepa (N. Ca) has several air cooled cars listed for well over $100k.
Clearly these are asking prices.
Clearly these are asking prices.
12-13-2015, 07:04 PM
#7
I drive my 993 to work often but I realize if it gets totaled or stolen that will probably be it for 993s and me.
Trending Topics
12-13-2015, 07:33 PM
#8
Well, for one thing production numbers for the 911 jump significantly with the introduction of the 996. Supply and demand is pretty simple, all other arguments about the 996 aside. Prices may stabilize, and good, lower mileage cars will find buyers at fair prices, but the crazy numbers for some aircooled cars will most likely not happen for the post-1998 cars.
12-13-2015, 10:08 PM
#9
Pro
Watching Chasing Classic Cars yesterday, Wayne Carini mentioned he had sold a 356 based Speedster for over $300,000.
Then, on the live Mecum Auction (I think Austin Tx) all the air-cooled 911s were selling for stratospheric prices.
Given the money these cars are bringing, they could not possibly be used as daily drivers. So what that tells me is that our 996s and 997s will hold their value as Porsche enthusiasts rediscover them.
Then, on the live Mecum Auction (I think Austin Tx) all the air-cooled 911s were selling for stratospheric prices.
Given the money these cars are bringing, they could not possibly be used as daily drivers. So what that tells me is that our 996s and 997s will hold their value as Porsche enthusiasts rediscover them.
12-13-2015, 10:49 PM
#10
Race Director
Because if somebody T-bones your S Class you simply go to the Mercedes dealer and pick out a new one. Replacing the 964 that took you six months to find (along with the PPI and other potential buyers wanting to buy the same car) won't be nearly as easy. See the WTB ads for air cooled cars.
I drive my 993 to work often but I realize if it gets totaled or stolen that will probably be it for 993s and me.
I drive my 993 to work often but I realize if it gets totaled or stolen that will probably be it for 993s and me.
12-14-2015, 12:24 PM
#12
It's possible to find a nice-looking late-80s G50 cab or targa in the $30K range, a bit more for a coupe. It'll have over 100K on the clock, but there's no reason it couldn't be at least as reliable a DD as a low-mileage 996/997, because the major issues plaguing the M96 can occur at fairly low mileage if they occur at all.
I think the appeal of a 996 or 997 as a DD is less about economics than creature comforts.
I think the appeal of a 996 or 997 as a DD is less about economics than creature comforts.
12-14-2015, 04:56 PM
#13
Rennlist Member
It's possible to find a nice-looking late-80s G50 cab or targa in the $30K range, a bit more for a coupe. It'll have over 100K on the clock, but there's no reason it couldn't be at least as reliable a DD as a low-mileage 996/997, because the major issues plaguing the M96 can occur at fairly low mileage if they occur at all.
I think the appeal of a 996 or 997 as a DD is less about economics than creature comforts.
I think the appeal of a 996 or 997 as a DD is less about economics than creature comforts.
This makes sense. My SC and 993 experiences did not relate well to everyday driving as "useful" transportation like my 996 does. The damp mist that passes for a/c is lacking, and there will usually be the scent of oil present, from leaking and burning off or otherwise. Lots of other factors make them a little less practical for everyday use. They are certainly an excellent motoring experience, but not as good for a heavy traffic commute for lots of reasons. In no way am I bashing the air-cooled cars, it's just a different deal. I love to drive my '74 Trans Am regularly, but the cammed up 400 and no a/c is not much fun in downtown Nashville traffic in July. Our S class AMG is much better suited to that situation. In my own experience and opinion, of course.
12-14-2015, 06:52 PM
#14
Race Director
Caveat: I love my 996. It's my favorite car, ever. Hands down.
Porsche made a sh*t ton of 996's, and they scurried away from the "mistake" of non-911 headlights and a couple of other styling choices that, to many, puts the 996 in a "it's a 911, but not exactly a real 911" category that includes at least one other car I can think of...the 912.
The 912 has been appreciating for the last couple of years, a halo effect as all "real" 911's continue to price themselves out of reach for many people. While I am in no way impugning the 996 as a properly good sports car, how many articles come through here repeating the same hackneyed slogans that the 996 is the perfect starter 911 / the perfect "first" 911 / the most underestimated Porsche ever? I lost count a year or so ago.
The 912 was THE car for the "I can't afford an early 911, but I'll take one of those cars that 99%-of-the-people-on-the-street-will-think-is-a-911 anyway" crowd. The 996, similarly, is the "it's just as good...and I don't believe anyone else knows the difference" choice. Only when the 911's that bracket the 996 on both ends - meaning both the preceding air-cooled cars and the 997's and 991's that followed - finally price themselves out of reach, the 996 may finally enjoy a halo effect...but it's going to be a long, long time coming. Remember that Porsche made (excluding turbos, GT2's, and GT3's) about 5x more 996's than they did 912's; there are also a LOT of 997's and 991's that need to become valuable until it finally becomes time to include your 996 on your net worth worksheets...
For the record, I'm not badmouthing the 996 or suggesting that I believe my car is a lemon or something other than a "real" 911. My personal feelings about the car aside, though, the mindset just does not currently exist for the 996 to become a collectible car. I suspect that the models bracketing the 996 on both ends will be the driving force behind the ultimate collectible value of the 996, and not the 996's own qualities. I don't think that's fair - the 996 was a great stride forward in many ways - but life isn't fair, and finance is even less so...
Porsche made a sh*t ton of 996's, and they scurried away from the "mistake" of non-911 headlights and a couple of other styling choices that, to many, puts the 996 in a "it's a 911, but not exactly a real 911" category that includes at least one other car I can think of...the 912.
The 912 has been appreciating for the last couple of years, a halo effect as all "real" 911's continue to price themselves out of reach for many people. While I am in no way impugning the 996 as a properly good sports car, how many articles come through here repeating the same hackneyed slogans that the 996 is the perfect starter 911 / the perfect "first" 911 / the most underestimated Porsche ever? I lost count a year or so ago.
The 912 was THE car for the "I can't afford an early 911, but I'll take one of those cars that 99%-of-the-people-on-the-street-will-think-is-a-911 anyway" crowd. The 996, similarly, is the "it's just as good...and I don't believe anyone else knows the difference" choice. Only when the 911's that bracket the 996 on both ends - meaning both the preceding air-cooled cars and the 997's and 991's that followed - finally price themselves out of reach, the 996 may finally enjoy a halo effect...but it's going to be a long, long time coming. Remember that Porsche made (excluding turbos, GT2's, and GT3's) about 5x more 996's than they did 912's; there are also a LOT of 997's and 991's that need to become valuable until it finally becomes time to include your 996 on your net worth worksheets...
For the record, I'm not badmouthing the 996 or suggesting that I believe my car is a lemon or something other than a "real" 911. My personal feelings about the car aside, though, the mindset just does not currently exist for the 996 to become a collectible car. I suspect that the models bracketing the 996 on both ends will be the driving force behind the ultimate collectible value of the 996, and not the 996's own qualities. I don't think that's fair - the 996 was a great stride forward in many ways - but life isn't fair, and finance is even less so...
12-15-2015, 09:03 AM
#15
Race Director
Caveat: I love my 996. It's my favorite car, ever. Hands down.
Porsche made a sh*t ton of 996's, and they scurried away from the "mistake" of non-911 headlights and a couple of other styling choices that, to many, puts the 996 in a "it's a 911, but not exactly a real 911" category that includes at least one other car I can think of...the 912.
The 912 has been appreciating for the last couple of years, a halo effect as all "real" 911's continue to price themselves out of reach for many people. While I am in no way impugning the 996 as a properly good sports car, how many articles come through here repeating the same hackneyed slogans that the 996 is the perfect starter 911 / the perfect "first" 911 / the most underestimated Porsche ever? I lost count a year or so ago.
The 912 was THE car for the "I can't afford an early 911, but I'll take one of those cars that 99%-of-the-people-on-the-street-will-think-is-a-911 anyway" crowd. The 996, similarly, is the "it's just as good...and I don't believe anyone else knows the difference" choice. Only when the 911's that bracket the 996 on both ends - meaning both the preceding air-cooled cars and the 997's and 991's that followed - finally price themselves out of reach, the 996 may finally enjoy a halo effect...but it's going to be a long, long time coming. Remember that Porsche made (excluding turbos, GT2's, and GT3's) about 5x more 996's than they did 912's; there are also a LOT of 997's and 991's that need to become valuable until it finally becomes time to include your 996 on your net worth worksheets...
For the record, I'm not badmouthing the 996 or suggesting that I believe my car is a lemon or something other than a "real" 911. My personal feelings about the car aside, though, the mindset just does not currently exist for the 996 to become a collectible car. I suspect that the models bracketing the 996 on both ends will be the driving force behind the ultimate collectible value of the 996, and not the 996's own qualities. I don't think that's fair - the 996 was a great stride forward in many ways - but life isn't fair, and finance is even less so...
Porsche made a sh*t ton of 996's, and they scurried away from the "mistake" of non-911 headlights and a couple of other styling choices that, to many, puts the 996 in a "it's a 911, but not exactly a real 911" category that includes at least one other car I can think of...the 912.
The 912 has been appreciating for the last couple of years, a halo effect as all "real" 911's continue to price themselves out of reach for many people. While I am in no way impugning the 996 as a properly good sports car, how many articles come through here repeating the same hackneyed slogans that the 996 is the perfect starter 911 / the perfect "first" 911 / the most underestimated Porsche ever? I lost count a year or so ago.
The 912 was THE car for the "I can't afford an early 911, but I'll take one of those cars that 99%-of-the-people-on-the-street-will-think-is-a-911 anyway" crowd. The 996, similarly, is the "it's just as good...and I don't believe anyone else knows the difference" choice. Only when the 911's that bracket the 996 on both ends - meaning both the preceding air-cooled cars and the 997's and 991's that followed - finally price themselves out of reach, the 996 may finally enjoy a halo effect...but it's going to be a long, long time coming. Remember that Porsche made (excluding turbos, GT2's, and GT3's) about 5x more 996's than they did 912's; there are also a LOT of 997's and 991's that need to become valuable until it finally becomes time to include your 996 on your net worth worksheets...
For the record, I'm not badmouthing the 996 or suggesting that I believe my car is a lemon or something other than a "real" 911. My personal feelings about the car aside, though, the mindset just does not currently exist for the 996 to become a collectible car. I suspect that the models bracketing the 996 on both ends will be the driving force behind the ultimate collectible value of the 996, and not the 996's own qualities. I don't think that's fair - the 996 was a great stride forward in many ways - but life isn't fair, and finance is even less so...