BAD.TAG

Hi all,
Long time lurker looking for some experienced input. I am a longtime Audi fan for year round transportation, current ride is a 99 A4 2.8 Manual and its a tank in the snow with the right tires.

When the time comes I initially considered a 2008-2009 A5 V6 Manual as a logical choice. But looking at prices of 2003 era C4/S they fall into about the same range with similar mileage.


I have seen videos on Youtube of C4S's in the snow, but they were short and not very informative (or it looked like the car was a 2WD and not AWD)

So my question is how would they compare for inclement weather given snow tires on each? Has anyone done a similar comparison before?

Thanks for any input

Dr Mitch

I had a few audis A4s, Coupe and A6 - loved them, amazing AWD system.
If you're talking about long drive into ski country, I'd take the Audi.
Is it a daily driver? Where are you located?
The C4S is very good in the snow - even in some deeper crud (it's fun to throw around)- but even with "thinner" winter tires, is still easy to shoot the back end out. I felt much more confident in blizzards and on ice in the A4 with my Nokia Hak 10's than in the C4S - but I have not spent nearly as much time in the C4S in really deep snow (that's what I have a Volvo V70R for).
The C4S has been MUCH more capable in inclement weather than I initially gave it credit for though.
The A5 is beautiful, my friends wife has an S5 convertible - and they love it, she traded from a Boxster S as they wanted a back seat and awd.

Invius

Bad Tag, you need to talk to Capt. Obvious. He is a Audi fanatic, and has a (I believe) C4S, so he should be able to help immensely. I had a B6 S4 a few years back, but I live in Florida, so I won't be able to help with any pertinent information regarding snow. That said, all thing being equal, I had the best of what Audi had to offer in that variant, and love my 996 quite a bit more. There is more of a connected feel when driving, and as a DIY fan, it's a very easy car to work on.

GL in your search,

DS

xman95

My buddy has a 991 S 2wd in wisconsin as a daily driver. You just need to get snow tires. They get alot of snow in germany and the 911 has heavy weight in the back with a rear engine. I had a S4 and if it was me I would go for C4S an Audi is an Audi and there quality is more on par with VW than porsche. my 2 cents.

luvmy911

I personally have owned 5 Audi's: A4's, S4, A6's. All of them were fantastic in the snow and I never feared any weather, ever. I live in Pittsburgh where we get all four seasons and again for the climate here, the Audi rules.

I currently own a C4S and I drive it mostly every day with the exception of snowy days so I do have a bit of hesitancy there. As for the over all quality, that is a tough one to compare. Either way, as you likely already know, plan on $1000 for any time you need to take either car to the shop.

In the end, I say it depends on your climate. Lots of snow/rain - go for the Audi. Otherwise, I would go for the C4S any day!

Good luck!

EDoyle

Another point to consider: The A5 will continually depreciate for some while whereas the C4s has already hit close to bottom.

KrazyK

You will love the C4S. It handles like a dream. If you drive it to the limits as I do, you will be more than pleased with it. Actually I havent driven mine in a few weeks because it keeps raining.

targa996

I drove rs5 ... Engine is amazing .. But still does not feel as good to drive as 911. Audi is good looking and capable in snow .. But not without water pump, window regulator and other annoying problems ..and will continue to depreciate. Porsche is a special car .. Will be fun on track .. Less depreciation .. Higher regular maintenance unless you DIY and sometimes subject to very expensive failures but in general reliable . I would not want to use as dd in snow however ..get a beater for that ....

BAD.TAG

Thanks for the reply's everyone. Input is much appreciated.

I should say that I live in the Albany region of NY and we tend to get a fair amount now and then (though this year is proving to be light, like last year). I do ski but not every weekend and then mostly in VT so no long treks to middle of nowhere typically.

This would be serving the purpose of an all year round car, and I do love driving in the snow. Have done several ice events in NH and can never seem to make it home on a snowy night without a detour to an empty parking lot. The A4 will go through more powder than you will be able to see through.

That said, given the nature of a C4S I would expect some compromise on the pure snow going capability in return for a more rewarding driving experience. Audi's have always been more fun in the snow than in the dry =)

Right now I am just trying to gauge how much I would gain/lose on both fronts.

That is a good point about the depreciation on the C4S. And I do as much maint as I can short of dropping an engine or something so that also helps.

I know the key issues are the IMS and the RMS, so those would be budgeted for.

Thanks again for the responses. Maybe Capt Obvious will chime in ?

wwest

Post the use of TC and/or VSC (PSM) (~2000) but prior to the 997.2 the C4, C4S, had NO F/awd functionality, even, mostly with those nanny features turned off. The VC's of that era did not stiffen quickly enough to be of any real help with preventing wheelspin/slip at the primary, rear, drive wheels. In point of fact some level of rear wheelspin/slip was actually REQUIRED to force the stiffening of the VC front drive coupling. TC, obviously, if on, would always act to prevent the VC from ever providing increased coupling.

That's why almost all modern automatic type, no driver intervention, "awd" systems have abandoned the VC as a viable solution and adopted the electromagnetically actuated clutch.

Oh, and be sure that any Audi you purchase isn't primarily FWD, as most are. Those can turn dangerous, possibly HAZARDOUS(***), in the blink of an eye on wintertime roadbed conditions.

*** VW has developed a new safety feature (yes, yet another "nanny") for their FWD models equpped with manual transmissions. Should the driver downshift far enough to result in so much engine braking that wheel skid results, would result, the new feature will automatically uprev the engine as a preventative safety measure. Since Audi is division of VW....

BAD.TAG

The impression I am getting is that the C4S with traction control off is essentially a RWD car, is this correct ?

So in a sense, turning traction control on is like pushing a 4WD button, but that also kills any chance to have fun

Is there any known changes that can be done to the VC? Thicker viscosity fluid maybe to provide a lower threshold of engagement ?

For the record the 2008-2009 A5 would use the 5th Gen of Quattro which has the
Torsen type 3 (Type "C") centre differential, 40:60 'default' split front-rear,

Automatically apportioning up to 80% of the torque to one axle using a 4:1 high-biased center differential. With the aid of ESP, up to 100% of the torque can be transferred to one axle.

jumper5836

No, the opposite. Say you get stuck in snow. TC will prevent rear wheels from spinning. Turn off TC and rear wheels can spin freely, if they spin fast enough then it will engage the fronts at more then 5% power that the front wheels normally get.

Capt. Obvious

I've had quite a few Audis and I'm a huge fan of the brand and their cars. I also love my C4S. I haven't driven my C4S in the snow, but the AWD 996s are known for being darn good snow cars.

Personally, I love the A5s and they're one of my favorite cars on the road right now; but in the end I bought a C4S if that tells you anything.

KrazyK

I know this for a fact. With my C4S on jack stands all 4 wheels do spin if put into gear. I assume because there is little resistance but it tells me the AWD is working.

Sneaky Pete

Finally agreeing with the K man Also with PSM even if you turn it off it is still there in the back ground.