Mickey356

I do apoligise, I searched, I promise I did!

I'm in love with a car. It's a 2003 C4. It had the engine and clutch replaced about 20K ago by the first owner (apparent IMS failure). The current owner has had the car about a year. I'm close on selling my SC (all but done) and I'll be ready to pull the trigger on a C4 in the next week or so.

On to the PPI issue - I know it's an "absolute" in the Porsche world. And I'm not totally against having one done, but I had a bad experience with my last Porsche PPI and now I'm a little "unimpressed" with the value of them. I guess the best way I could put it is "A PPI is only as good as the shop doing it". I had one done on my SC by an independent who gave it a clean check. I found out when I got the car home it was 7 qts low on oil and thats not even the beginning, I'll spare you the gory details, plus I don't like thinking about it, it's too painful.

So, here I am, now considering another Porsche AND another PPI. The plan is the current owner is going to scan and email all the service records to me tomorrow and he's already offered the name and number of the Porsche dealership service manager so I can speak with him. How much more can,or should, I expect from an independent shop? I mean if all the records check out and the service manager says the car is solid, whay should I go further?

I know a PPI is to cover your bases and make sure the car isn't going to grenade on you driving it home, but being that basically happened to me the last time I did this I'm left wondering how much time, money and effort I should put into one.

Oh, and I guess this would be the time to ask where's a place close to DC would be to take the car for a PPI?

Thanks,

kromdom

1. OPTION 1: skip the PPI and you hope/wish/pray that current available info is enough to give you peace of mind (fingers crossed)

2. OPTION 2: spend around $300 for a PPI and have a chance to catch issues before spending THOUSANDS to buy the car. And maybe spare yourself the THOUSANDS more in repairs before you take ownership of the car.

Yes , a PPI is not an absolute guarantee but most definitely better than none IMHO. At a minimum, review this:
https://rennlist.com/forums/911-foru...immermann.html

TerpsRED

There are a number of dealers in the area, Rockville, Tysons, Annapolis, Silver Spring. There are also some independent shops with very good reputations. Intersport for one in Tysons is a very nice little shop with a great reputation in the area.

p5th

^+1,Arlington is pretty good

ltdan12a

bzzt

Jim Richards

This is the guy I trust the most in the DC metro area

http://taylorchapman.com/default.aspx

DDL24

Do you have specific area in mind? there are few in Montgomery county, Maryland as well....

Mickey356

Thanks. I was hoping maybe there was a more updated version of Peters PPI check list. Something specific to 996s.

A lot of the things such as clutch, brakes, rubber, panels, paint, all switches, lights, etc.. working, can be checked out by someone who knows what they're looking at.
The things I'm concerned about are the things I don't know what (or where) to look for.
I can guess that the RMS and ISB are biggies. Would they drop the trans to check these items, or just look for dripping oil? How would one know where the oil is coming from (ISB or RMS) as one is over the the other, aren't they?
I'm going to assume they would be doing an oil and filter change, yes? I see quotes of $150-$200 for an oil change on a 996. How is a PPI gonna cost a couple hundred bucks then? I would assume a good PPI is more than just an oil & filter change.
How much, or better yet, what are the most important things on a 996 to be checked by a qualified technician? What are they going to be looking for that will save me thousands down the road.
It may seem as if I'm being skeptical, and I guess I am to some extent (afterall, I've had this done before, and by a "qualified Porsche tech", and my 6 yr old daughter could have done a better inspection), but if I'm going to pay someone $200-$300 to look at a car (which still doesn't add up with an O&F change being $150) I want to know they're 'really' looking. I guess if someone said "It'll cost you about $500 to have someone thoroughly inpsect the car" it would make more sense.

The car is in Ashburn, VA. The plan is for me to take the train down and be picked up by the owner in DC. Check the car out. If it's all good, I drive it home. If not, I take the train back. I could either have the owner take the car to a shop of my choice ahead of time and have it looked over, but then I just have to assume they did what they said; what do they have to lose? It's not as if they're gonna get me as a regular customer, I'm a hundred miles away. They could just put the thing on a lift, look around, take it for a spin down the street, and say "it's good". Or, I could take the train down and take the car myself to a shop and ask to be present for the inspection, though I'm not sure that's common practice.

So I welcome your continued advice.

And I guess shops closer to DC if I take the car for a PPI, and shops closer to Ashburn if the owner does it for me.

DDL24

Micky,
I know how you feel. I am not sure if there is any PPI or inspection that can totally eliminate/identify IMS issue. In terms of quality of PPI, it's really just the shop's reputation; unless you are there watching them...even then, you can't be 100% certain. PPI price typically doesn't incl oil change. You pay extra for that and with permission of current owner....if you do oil change...you might as well send the oil sample in for an oil analysis.
I just went thru similiar experience, purchased a 997 cab from an out of state owner...there is risk involved, no matter which way you go. I didn't find any good indy in the area where the previous owner lives...so I just went with the local P car dealer. I asked for a PPI but it's really just a superfical checklist they performed...but they only charged me $125. I bot a CPO car from a private party, so it's not as risky as out of warranty purchase. What I really believe is that during your communication with the current owner...you should develop a sense of his/her profile and trustworthiness....and then you roll the dice. buying used car is a gamble, always. PS. not sure if you looking at C4 only...I passed on a 2002 C2 Cab locally in very good condition, blue/tan, less tahn 30k miles. PM me for details if you want details. good luck.

kromdom

+1000, agree 100% Before I bought my car, I asked the seller (who manages a luxury/exotic car speed shop) a bazillion questions and he patiently answered all of them. In fact, he was "pleased" that he was dealing with an informed/educated buyer who had done his research (asked about RMS, IMS, AOS, WP, coolant intermix, etc.).

Sounds like buying an aftermarket warranty may give you the peace (although expect to get a 50/50 split in opinion on this one) so you can have a buffer/cushion/safety net if anything catastrophic (read expensive) does happen.

Best of luck.

Mickey356

Many thanks again, gentleman.
I'm just getting into the data gathering on this car. As things move forward I'll be getting more inquisitive. He is supposed to scan and email the mait records to me and once he does, I'll pour through them looking as to whats been done and what hasn't. The first owner was an attorney from Texas. Apparently there are extensive records of everything done to the car, I heard he was obsessive about making sure everything that would/could be covered under warranty was.

The current owner is a car guy in the sense that he takes very good care of his cars like washing, always garaged, interior immaculate, etc... but doesn't strike me as the DY maintainence person, but he has always had service(s) done at a Porsche dealership.