Should I buy 40th Anniversary 911?
11-01-2011, 12:25 PM
#16
Burning Brakes
I loved my 40th that I bought used from Porsche North Houston. FYI mine also had paint repair to the passenger rear quarter panel that they did not disclose. Might be a pattern there???
I found out about it when I went to sell it. I got $29k for with just under 70k miles.
I found out about it when I went to sell it. I got $29k for with just under 70k miles.
11-02-2011, 01:28 AM
#17
Drifting
Thread Starter
Im really starting to wonder about this dealers tactics. Heres what happened in the email after the trip to dealer.
Me to them:
Tino,
After thinking about this and talking it over with my wife, I have a few questions for you. Firstly, I was very disappointed in the outcome of our tentative deal on the 911 knowing the reputation of Porsche and after hearing your assurance the vehicle would be as described. My expectations were high knowing the car was being offered for sale at a Porsche dealership. That is why I asked so many specific questions before I made the trip as to not waste my time or yours. Granted, you probably were not expecting a customer that had received formal training in looking for paint, body work, over-spray, or tool marks on vehicles, I still have reservations on how a trained Porsche technician could have missed what we both saw. I'm not accusing you or the dealership of knowing about the paint but it took me all of 30 seconds to see it when I approached the right side. Secondly, after discovering the flaws, is your dealership obligated to repair it or just simply disclose it to the next customer?
My questions are, would your manager consider any other option that does not increase the cost to me that would be mutually beneficial? I know a repaint of that side would be extremely costly and I'm not sure if you want to invest more money into the car. What is the chance of having a quality paint technician give an opinion? As we have no idea when this work was done, my concern is that the paint may continue to lose adhesion as it has done so in the lower area near the side skirting. I don't know if I would be willing to take that chance but I might consider a discount on the price that we had previously agreed on. Lastly, I would consider that if a customer had the side repainted and did not disclose it to you before you bought it, what else would he be hiding?
I would still be willing to consider purchasing the vehicle with two conditions. A price concession commensurate with what an estimated repair / repaint / touchup, of the noted areas, or possibly the $1800 applied to the price you offered on the warranty. A thorough inspection done by myself on a hoist (if possible) with your inspecting technician present of course. Sorry to be a bother but after purchasing numerous new and used vehicles, I have learned that a prudent customer does not fall in love with any car but must keep the mindset that he is willing to walk away from any deal. Thank you for your time and consideration. Please call me any time.
Their reply:
Keith,
Please once again accept my sincere apologies for the outcome of your trip to our dealership. I again share with you that there was sincerely no malicious intent on our part but rather an innocent oversight on the part of our technicians and although I understand out of your frustration it may be difficult to believe, but human errors do occur, even at a Porsche dealer. Please know that we are not happy when mistakes occur, however we are humble enough to admit them and make every effort to correct them and move forward with the integrity of a lesson learned. I understand completely your decision to walk away from the deal. I probably would have done the same especially when there are other vehicles in the market.
Our plan of action for this vehicle is to have our factory approved body shop perform the repainting of damaged panels to meet Porsche pre-owned quality standards. At this point we are not inclined to moving forward with anyone on a deal until we know the cost of repair. If once the repairs have been preformed and we deem it mutually beneficial to move forward with you on a deal at our agreed upon sales price we will be in contact with you.
Kind regards,
Tino Minetos
They now relisted the car with this disclaimer:
"Disclosure: There is cosmetic repaint of the passenger door, passenger rear quarter panel, and passenger front fender"
Guess I should just write this one off? Sure hate to think Porsche is just like every other dealer out there.
Me to them:
Tino,
After thinking about this and talking it over with my wife, I have a few questions for you. Firstly, I was very disappointed in the outcome of our tentative deal on the 911 knowing the reputation of Porsche and after hearing your assurance the vehicle would be as described. My expectations were high knowing the car was being offered for sale at a Porsche dealership. That is why I asked so many specific questions before I made the trip as to not waste my time or yours. Granted, you probably were not expecting a customer that had received formal training in looking for paint, body work, over-spray, or tool marks on vehicles, I still have reservations on how a trained Porsche technician could have missed what we both saw. I'm not accusing you or the dealership of knowing about the paint but it took me all of 30 seconds to see it when I approached the right side. Secondly, after discovering the flaws, is your dealership obligated to repair it or just simply disclose it to the next customer?
My questions are, would your manager consider any other option that does not increase the cost to me that would be mutually beneficial? I know a repaint of that side would be extremely costly and I'm not sure if you want to invest more money into the car. What is the chance of having a quality paint technician give an opinion? As we have no idea when this work was done, my concern is that the paint may continue to lose adhesion as it has done so in the lower area near the side skirting. I don't know if I would be willing to take that chance but I might consider a discount on the price that we had previously agreed on. Lastly, I would consider that if a customer had the side repainted and did not disclose it to you before you bought it, what else would he be hiding?
I would still be willing to consider purchasing the vehicle with two conditions. A price concession commensurate with what an estimated repair / repaint / touchup, of the noted areas, or possibly the $1800 applied to the price you offered on the warranty. A thorough inspection done by myself on a hoist (if possible) with your inspecting technician present of course. Sorry to be a bother but after purchasing numerous new and used vehicles, I have learned that a prudent customer does not fall in love with any car but must keep the mindset that he is willing to walk away from any deal. Thank you for your time and consideration. Please call me any time.
Their reply:
Keith,
Please once again accept my sincere apologies for the outcome of your trip to our dealership. I again share with you that there was sincerely no malicious intent on our part but rather an innocent oversight on the part of our technicians and although I understand out of your frustration it may be difficult to believe, but human errors do occur, even at a Porsche dealer. Please know that we are not happy when mistakes occur, however we are humble enough to admit them and make every effort to correct them and move forward with the integrity of a lesson learned. I understand completely your decision to walk away from the deal. I probably would have done the same especially when there are other vehicles in the market.
Our plan of action for this vehicle is to have our factory approved body shop perform the repainting of damaged panels to meet Porsche pre-owned quality standards. At this point we are not inclined to moving forward with anyone on a deal until we know the cost of repair. If once the repairs have been preformed and we deem it mutually beneficial to move forward with you on a deal at our agreed upon sales price we will be in contact with you.
Kind regards,
Tino Minetos
They now relisted the car with this disclaimer:
"Disclosure: There is cosmetic repaint of the passenger door, passenger rear quarter panel, and passenger front fender"
Guess I should just write this one off? Sure hate to think Porsche is just like every other dealer out there.
11-02-2011, 02:29 AM
#18
RL Community Team
Rennlist Member
Rennlist Member
You should look for a car from a PCA concours enthusiast instead.
11-02-2011, 11:42 AM
#19
Burning Brakes
Porsche North will use Rapid Body Works in Spring. They do very good work and are Porsche certified body shop.
If you like the car. Tell Tino you will wait for word back from the body shop.
If you like the car. Tell Tino you will wait for word back from the body shop.
11-02-2011, 12:00 PM
#20
Drifting
Thread Starter
Look at earlier post:
They now relisted the car with this disclaimer:
"Disclosure: There is cosmetic repaint of the passenger door, passenger rear quarter panel, and passenger front fender"
Thats what puzzles me about this dealer. He said they would pull from market and fix but there it is relisted with same problem. At least they are telling potentional customers now.
What I was mostly bothered with was my wasted time, credit inquiries, all for nothing. Then they relist the car with the same problem. I think you were guys were right. DONT BUY FROM A DEALER!
They now relisted the car with this disclaimer:
"Disclosure: There is cosmetic repaint of the passenger door, passenger rear quarter panel, and passenger front fender"
Thats what puzzles me about this dealer. He said they would pull from market and fix but there it is relisted with same problem. At least they are telling potentional customers now.
What I was mostly bothered with was my wasted time, credit inquiries, all for nothing. Then they relist the car with the same problem. I think you were guys were right. DONT BUY FROM A DEALER!
11-02-2011, 12:41 PM
#21
Three Wheelin'
Look at earlier post:
They now relisted the car with this disclaimer:
"Disclosure: There is cosmetic repaint of the passenger door, passenger rear quarter panel, and passenger front fender"
Thats what puzzles me about this dealer. He said they would pull from market and fix but there it is relisted with same problem. At least they are telling potentional customers now.
What I was mostly bothered with was my wasted time, credit inquiries, all for nothing. Then they relist the car with the same problem. I think you were guys were right. DONT BUY FROM A DEALER!
They now relisted the car with this disclaimer:
"Disclosure: There is cosmetic repaint of the passenger door, passenger rear quarter panel, and passenger front fender"
Thats what puzzles me about this dealer. He said they would pull from market and fix but there it is relisted with same problem. At least they are telling potentional customers now.
What I was mostly bothered with was my wasted time, credit inquiries, all for nothing. Then they relist the car with the same problem. I think you were guys were right. DONT BUY FROM A DEALER!
Well, they're under no obligation to sell you this car. There will be many many other people who would probably buy this car.
Most people buying Porsche's aren't necessarily on this forum.
11-02-2011, 01:37 PM
#22
Three Wheelin'
Porsche with body damage cannot be "Porsche" certified pre owned.
The dealer can call the car CPO, and sell you a warranty,but the warranty will only apply at that dealership.
Repairs won't be honored at other dealerships as it is not "Porsche" CPO
The dealer can call the car CPO, and sell you a warranty,but the warranty will only apply at that dealership.
Repairs won't be honored at other dealerships as it is not "Porsche" CPO
11-02-2011, 02:44 PM
#23
Race Director
If the car is listed as having a CPO warranty the warranty has to apply at any Porsche dealer. There is no fine print in the warranty paperwork that limits the coverage to the originating dealer.
Sincerely,
Macster.
11-02-2011, 04:19 PM
#24
Three Wheelin'
From KrazyK's other post on IMS
"I was offered a Porsche backed 2 year / 24,000 mile warranty for $1800 on the 2004 911 AE (
30,000 miles) I was looking at but now I'm scared to proceed any further. I don't see how I can risk dropping that kind of money on this car then just waiting for it to frag. Would IMS failure even be covered? "
Some dealers here mostly BMW "dealer certify" their cars, but call them Certified Pre Owned.
What I'm trying to say is beware of the fine print in who is the certifier and what and where does it cover.
Damaged cars are not knowingly certified by Porsche as Porsche CPO.
Isn't the AE out of the CPO warranty window also?
What kind of warranty was this dealer trying to sell the OP? For $1800
"I was offered a Porsche backed 2 year / 24,000 mile warranty for $1800 on the 2004 911 AE (
30,000 miles) I was looking at but now I'm scared to proceed any further. I don't see how I can risk dropping that kind of money on this car then just waiting for it to frag. Would IMS failure even be covered? "
Some dealers here mostly BMW "dealer certify" their cars, but call them Certified Pre Owned.
What I'm trying to say is beware of the fine print in who is the certifier and what and where does it cover.
Damaged cars are not knowingly certified by Porsche as Porsche CPO.
Isn't the AE out of the CPO warranty window also?
What kind of warranty was this dealer trying to sell the OP? For $1800
11-02-2011, 04:52 PM
#25
Drifting
Thread Starter
The warranty was $3600. They agreed to pay half because of the trouble this caused me. Apparently they had to get some kind of special permission to get the 2004 covered but it only had 30,000 miles anyway. The paint on the right side rocker panel was peeling due to poor adhesion / poor prep work. No one there knows why the work was done or who did it.
In 2008 the car was sold to a customer who was in the Houston area for work. He then sold the car back to dealer before he went back home overseas. Yes, I know makes it impossible to contact the previous owner. Before that, the car was bought in a Florida auction by Houston Porsche. (The dealer didnt mention this)
Honestly I think they are going to have trouble selling this car to a careful buyer. Too many unanswered questions. Luckily I read the 911 buyers guide before I made the trip to get it.
In 2008 the car was sold to a customer who was in the Houston area for work. He then sold the car back to dealer before he went back home overseas. Yes, I know makes it impossible to contact the previous owner. Before that, the car was bought in a Florida auction by Houston Porsche. (The dealer didnt mention this)
Honestly I think they are going to have trouble selling this car to a careful buyer. Too many unanswered questions. Luckily I read the 911 buyers guide before I made the trip to get it.
11-13-2011, 12:52 AM
#27
There seems to be plenty of low mileage, nice examples around. My #335 has been with me for almost 3 years and I've been really happy with it. Purchased with 8,900 miles in perfect condition. No problems and drives wonderfully. Just returned from Rennsport IV and about 1,000 mile round trip. I now have a whopping 15,000 miles on it! Everyone notices the 40th even though there seems to be several around at various CA Porsche events. The Anniversary package makes it a great performer. Lots of pep, handles great, and gets noticed. Keep looking for the right one and be patient.
11-14-2011, 06:46 PM
#28
Drifting
Thread Starter
I was almost in love with this car and had all details worked out including warranty, insurance, and financing of only 3.09% for 72 months. I really hated to back out but I just couldnt buy it with the side repaint for unknown reasons. Even though its a 40th AE, I think they are going to have trouble selling this car since they now disclose the repaint issue to potential buyers. The 40th is a great package so Im really bummed. I guess Im still looking but disappointed with the 996 problems. Might hold out for a 997.
11-27-2015, 09:47 PM
#30
Gonna guess that since this thread was from 2011 that the subject car has been sold. Maybe multiple times. WTF is it with the necro threads lately??? 
And don't worry, I think it's a safe bet that KK will never buy another 996. Though he won't shut up about them and move on with his life
And don't worry, I think it's a safe bet that KK will never buy another 996. Though he won't shut up about them and move on with his life