High RPM might be good for IMS bearing!
10-06-2009, 03:36 PM
#31
from 1st post: An oil with extreme pressure additives like Moly might also further assist in increasing bearing life.
If the Ims bearing sees no engine oil, how does the above comment help with bearing life?
Question to Jake
If the Ims bearing sees no engine oil, how does the above comment help with bearing life?
Question to Jake
10-06-2009, 05:17 PM
#32
Burning Brakes
The IMSR bearing is a splash lubricated component.. The area surrounding the IMS drive is flooded with oil at pretty much any RPM, hence the reason for IMS/ RMS leakages... We took advantage of that.
With the bearing in factory sealed form different engine oils can only effect the lubricity of the remainder of the valve train components through friction reduction..
Valve train components that see friction reduction also reduces the load placed on the IMS bearing, which COULD help it live a few days longer.
Other than that I make no comments on oil selections, way too many people get their panties in a wad over this subject!
If the Ims bearing sees no engine oil, how does the above comment help with bearing life?
Valve train components that see friction reduction also reduces the load placed on the IMS bearing, which COULD help it live a few days longer.
Other than that I make no comments on oil selections, way too many people get their panties in a wad over this subject!
10-07-2009, 02:43 AM
#33
Race Director
One of my test cars saw 74,000 in range one and 53,000 rev counts in stage two before I pulled it's IMS bearing and retrofitted it earlier this year..
That bearing was in near perfect condition.. After I'd sometimes drive it 5 miles in second gear against the (elevated) rev limiter at 7,700 RPM.. I fired it up on a 9 degree morning and held it WOT for 11 minutes solid.
My Wife drove it to work today.... Its one of the best running M96s I have ever experienced.
But if I blow an engine its a tax write off and a true learning experience..
That bearing was in near perfect condition.. After I'd sometimes drive it 5 miles in second gear against the (elevated) rev limiter at 7,700 RPM.. I fired it up on a 9 degree morning and held it WOT for 11 minutes solid.
My Wife drove it to work today.... Its one of the best running M96s I have ever experienced.
But if I blow an engine its a tax write off and a true learning experience..
Some use no oil. Some use alot. Some run and run and run with treatment and servicing that would be judged abuse. (WOT at cold operating temperature is abuse. That the engine survived is impressive to be sure.)
And some blow up, soon, way too soon.
Years ago when I was using Weber carbs I came across a tuning book for Webers written by an Englishman -- wish I could remember his name and the title of the book and wish I'd kept the book -- who would have liked to had the time and opportunity to tear into otherwise identical engines that were on either end of the performance spectrum to see if he could learn just what the differences were and which ones were significant in order to duplicate the differences and improve all engines.
One has to be careful in condemning a population of engines based on the horrible results of a few engines, and neither should one apply to a population of engines the sort of treatment that apparently one exceptional engine is able to tolerate with no apparent ill effects. At least so far.
Sincerely,
Macster.
10-07-2009, 10:05 AM
#34
While that is impressive one can't apply that engine's treatment to a population of engines. Otherwise identical engines off the same line will behave differently.
Some use no oil. Some use alot. Some run and run and run with treatment and servicing that would be judged abuse. (WOT at cold operating temperature is abuse. That the engine survived is impressive to be sure.)
And some blow up, soon, way too soon.
Years ago when I was using Weber carbs I came across a tuning book for Webers written by an Englishman -- wish I could remember his name and the title of the book and wish I'd kept the book -- who would have liked to had the time and opportunity to tear into otherwise identical engines that were on either end of the performance spectrum to see if he could learn just what the differences were and which ones were significant in order to duplicate the differences and improve all engines.
One has to be careful in condemning a population of engines based on the horrible results of a few engines, and neither should one apply to a population of engines the sort of treatment that apparently one exceptional engine is able to tolerate with no apparent ill effects. At least so far.
Sincerely,
Macster.
Some use no oil. Some use alot. Some run and run and run with treatment and servicing that would be judged abuse. (WOT at cold operating temperature is abuse. That the engine survived is impressive to be sure.)
And some blow up, soon, way too soon.
Years ago when I was using Weber carbs I came across a tuning book for Webers written by an Englishman -- wish I could remember his name and the title of the book and wish I'd kept the book -- who would have liked to had the time and opportunity to tear into otherwise identical engines that were on either end of the performance spectrum to see if he could learn just what the differences were and which ones were significant in order to duplicate the differences and improve all engines.
One has to be careful in condemning a population of engines based on the horrible results of a few engines, and neither should one apply to a population of engines the sort of treatment that apparently one exceptional engine is able to tolerate with no apparent ill effects. At least so far.
Sincerely,
Macster.
10-07-2009, 11:11 AM
#39
Three Wheelin'
What if the guys running the casting equipment were actually drinking on the job?
Beer has lots of carbonation and the early boxsters suffered from porous cases?
Somebody spilled some beer into the mold!!!!
10-07-2009, 11:19 AM
#40
Race Car
10-07-2009, 01:33 PM
#41
Pro
Thread Starter
One has to be careful in condemning a population of engines based on the horrible results of a few engines, and neither should one apply to a population of engines the sort of treatment that apparently one exceptional engine is able to tolerate with no apparent ill effects. At least so far.
Sincerely,
Macster.
Sincerely,
Macster.
(I'm trying to find where I saw that stat, so you won't think I'm pulling data out of my a**!
But I remember it was on a Porsche-affiliated site. Scary.)
10-07-2009, 02:12 PM
#42
Race Car
But, let us not forget that these "few engines" consist upwards of 10% of all M96 motors. That's far from a 'few' in my book.
(I'm trying to find where I saw that stat, so you won't think I'm pulling data out of my a**! But I remember it was on a Porsche-affiliated site. Scary.)
(I'm trying to find where I saw that stat, so you won't think I'm pulling data out of my a**!
But I remember it was on a Porsche-affiliated site. Scary.)
10-07-2009, 02:38 PM
#43
Pro
Thread Starter
FWIW, I do remember the site that I saw it on had no affiliation with a repair part or services to do it. I always take with a grain of salt data that is coming from a place that supports their own agenda. That was not the case here.
Regardless, I just want to say to everyone, Long Live Your IMS!!
10-07-2009, 02:54 PM
#44
Race Car
I truly hope that's the case!! But remember too that all Boxters are potentially at risk, which is where I first heard about this issue from, actually. That opens up the data pool quite a bit as compared to 911-only.
FWIW, I do remember the site that I saw it on had no affiliation with a repair part or services to do it. I always take with a grain of salt data that is coming from a place that supports their own agenda. That was not the case here.
Regardless, I just want to say to everyone, Long Live Your IMS!!
FWIW, I do remember the site that I saw it on had no affiliation with a repair part or services to do it. I always take with a grain of salt data that is coming from a place that supports their own agenda. That was not the case here.
Regardless, I just want to say to everyone, Long Live Your IMS!!
If your talking of IMS bearing failure, I doubt there has even been 1/4% and that is being generous to those selling the repair kits.
Remember, potential and reality are two differnt things. Potential is used to create fear and generates sales. Reality is the 99%+ of these engines that have no problems and people just enjoy their car and don't worry about potential problems.
So what is this site that claims 10% failure rate?
10-07-2009, 03:31 PM
#45
Burning Brakes
I have applied the IMSR to SAVE more failed/failing engines than for preventives.
No one knows the percentages because there are no positive numbers of the production of the M96 engine that have been released. The percentages of failures doesn't matter..
What does matter are the three phone chats I have lined up this evening with those who have experienced failures since last Friday and want to know what they can do.
I have decided to start asking the people that I have conference calls with if I can record the conversation so it can be edited and posted... You'll see that its the same story over and over again.
No one knows the percentages because there are no positive numbers of the production of the M96 engine that have been released. The percentages of failures doesn't matter..
What does matter are the three phone chats I have lined up this evening with those who have experienced failures since last Friday and want to know what they can do.
I have decided to start asking the people that I have conference calls with if I can record the conversation so it can be edited and posted... You'll see that its the same story over and over again.