smackboy1

Why is it that virtually all manual cars use an "H" shifter mechanism? Why are cars not manufactured with sequential shifter mechanisms like motorcycles or race cars? Are there any advantages to the "H" shift? It seems to be slower, more susceptible to operator error, less ergonomic etc.. Is it a historical, marketing, cost, what?

ivangene

you are asking the "general public" to change - it takes time, interest, money and purpose for that to happen.









or a new law by the government

Dave!

I would hate driving a sequential in bad traffic--on my motorcycle it gets to be a hassle upshifting and downshifting because you just can't pop into neutral when traffic backs up again. I guess it just comes down to versatility for day to day driving.

SKooT1027

I like being able to choose the gear. Sequential shifting works fine for a bike b/c it's really the only option, but I think having the choice in a car has more benefits.

You really want to start messing with people, start swapping things so your gear selector is by foot and clutch by hand - in the car.

CosmosC4S

And so the Tiptronic was created.........

smackboy1

It's different with bikes where it's 1, N, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6. Actually I kind of liked it a half click between 1 and 2 for stop and go traffic. I mostly never needed to go from anything higher than 2 straight to N.

For a car I assume it would go R, N, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6. OK, apart from being able to block shift from 6 to 2, what else is it good for?

It just seems like the H shifter is a bit of an anachronism, an idea which might have made sense years ago, but doesn't really make sense anymore. Sort of like the qwerty keyboard or Communism or MTV or the Federal Reserve (OK, one of those was a joke).

Can you tell I'm really bored and trying to avoid work?

Bob Rouleau

Yes you must be bored. Have you driven a car with a sequential gear box? If you had, you would not be asking the question. In addition the serquential transmissions in the cup cars are fussy and require a ton of maintenance.

Everyone adopted the H pattern gear box because it is simpler, more reliable and lower maintenance. Since shifting speed is not an issue on the street, the slower gear changes are not an issue, whereas having to go from 4th -3rd-2nd-1st and then to Neutral would cause additional wear on the gear box, the synchros and the clutch.

Dave!

And when you think about it, what's limiting shift speed is not the speed at which you throw the lever, it's the flywheel.

Bob Rouleau

Sequentials in race cars are no-lift-shift which makes them very fast. The only equivalent is PDK

htny

not all sequentials are no lift shift, there are even some which retain clutch pedals today as we've recently seen, and plenty early ones did. The shift can even be the multiple push/pull button strangeness seen in many of the 90s drag applications. Some of these design decisions are due to user interface, and some to gearbox design, and era. For example an early sequential in a racecar with no reverse gear, helical cut gears, dog clutches, and a drag application can look markedly different than for example the modern electronics and bump stick of the cup car sequential.

Maintenance issues have less to do with the sequential nature of the shifter, which is kind of arbitrary, and more to do with the design of the box, the gears, the clutch or clutch packs, the intended teardown rebuild interval for the application, and the control parameters (how much slip, hydraulic/pneumatic/twin clutch etc, duration of throttle cutout, etc)

The answer is, to the OP's question, because it's easier that way, everyone knows how to drive a bike with a sequential, and a car with a standard h, but someone complains about every single paddle shift implementation because they are all slightly different in the way they handle certain issues, like creeping, holding hills, grabbing neutral or reverse, etc. take a survey, which direction do you want to press the lever to upshift, up or down (or like the benz implementation was left or right)? which paddle should shift up or down, or should they both do both? You'll get a bunch of different answers from different people based on what they personally think is best for their own application. the lack of standards leads to confusion, anger, some people cry about it, whatever, so standard H or pick your poison with pdk/smg/f1/dsg/etc

incidentally i have driven bikes with way different shift implementations, from quads & dirt bikes w/ shift-on-grip weirdness to an Indian bike called the bullet that is totally reversed, both for braking/shifting feet and directions up/down. Let's say it takes a little getting used to, and I was very unhappy on my first ride!

hamilton

I would prefer a cursive "f" pattern. Or maybe a "3."

nycebo

Can you clarify this for me? I ride a motorcycle and think that sequential shifting is vastly better shifting. Indeed, I love the idea in a car of clutch in (assuming that you aren't driving a PDK), two taps forward, clutch out, and bingo, I just dropped from 5th to 3rd gear. As for stop and go traffic, pulling the lever on an H gearshift to the neutral detante is easy, yes. But, so is pushing the lever all the way to the N.

Anyway, I hate to say it because I love shifting as much as the next guy, but if I get a 997 next year (don't worry boys, in addition to my 996), it will definitely have PDK. Gotta advance with the time eventually. I am sure I will miss the interactive nature of driving with a foot clutch.

smackboy1

I didn't really mean using a race car sequential dog box for a street car. I mean't a regular street car transmission with synchros and a clutch for up and down shifts but instead of an H gated user interface, a sequential up/down lever.

Van

You make it, I'll stand in line to buy it!

nycebo

BMW gave it a go in the e46 M3 with their SMG.