Zookie

bro just call up Behbehani and ask them...

PS: all the info you need is on the Porsche Website...

John Henry III - AZ

I always wondered why the C4S did not get a few extra HP..At least to compinsate for the extra weight. On allmost all other P cars the "S" equals more ponies. Why do you suppose that is?

dresler

because the 996 C4S is so awesome even with the same engine, it would have defied the laws of nature and god to give it more power.

Riad

There's nothing about this sentence I didn't like.

dmw

+2

Ray S

You are correct, he is only half right.

The full truth is that additional drivetrain losses and a higher coeficient of drag also factor in (along with the higher weight). Porsche's published data indicates that the C4S is a tenth slower to 60mph and has a top speed that is 5mph slower.

But as I have said before the C4S is better looking (my opinion) and will undoubtably perform better in inclement weather.

ArneeA

Benjamin Choi

Ray, Ray, Ray... must you force me to pull out the tried and true 'Ring card?

htny

...because you're not gonna sell a lot of X51 kits that way! Imagine Porsche's margin on that little check box.

Ray S

Ben, come on now. You can mag race if you want, but unless you are really going to compare laps that were driven by the same driver, on the same tires (we both know you are not) in similar conditions what are you really comparing?

I love the C4S and it has a lot of strengths, but lets not fib about it's weaknesses.

Benjamin Choi

Ray, see how frustrating and silly it is? People pull out the 'Ring card on me.

And, yes, it's all hairsplitting. It IS a half truth. Some scenarios the pork4s is quicker than the regular carrera and vice versa. It is not outright faster like comparing a GT3 to either one.

Ray S

Ben I disagree,in the dry a C2 is outright faster. In the wet, a C4 is outright faster. On the street, I'll admit the difference is small. However, if you drive them back to back at a track (I have, but I wonder how many that proclaim to the high heavens in threads like this also have) the difference is brutally obvious.

It is NOT a half truth. Even Porsche's published performance figures show a difference.

Why do you believe you can add AWD and get something for nothing? Do you honestly believe there is zero penalty?

I'll agree to disagree with you.

Benjamin Choi

ray you know i'm trying my best to stick up for the c4s rennlisters!

and i've said time and time again the next 911 i get it'll be rwd. not necessarily because i care about laptimes, but i do miss the feel of rwd.

but i'm going to point out things you've already heard here before. the c4s isn't bigger heavier and that's it. stock for stock (who does that?) it's got bigger brakes. better suspension. wider track. more grip. this compensates for the weight gain and makes it a HALF TRUTH that the rwd carrera, the more lighter, skinnier brother is faster.

palting, where are you when i need you?

j/k

Palting

Lets deal with the facts first. The only "S" in the 996 NA line is the C4S. Here, the "S", relative to the non-S C4, has larger brakes, wider tread, wider tires, sportier suspension, wider body, all leather interior, upgraded headlights/turbo-look, more weight than the C2, less weight than the turbo. If you compare it to the C2, it's has all of the above, plus it has AWD.

The "S" version of the 997 has more HP/torque than the non-S, but they have the same suspension, same tires, same brakes, same interior, body, body style.

OK, now that that's settled, let's move on to the fun stuff . Opinions .

The stock out of the box 996 C4S, with it's better brakes, suspension, tires, wider tread, all these more than make up for it's extra weight and is faster than the stock out of the box 996 C2. The Porsche AWD was designed more to enhance performance and less for climatic conditions. Personal experience is that the AWD lets me get around the apex and out to the corner faster. So, in addition to my original statement that the "S" performance extras more than compensate for the extra weight, now with the AWD enhanced cornering, the C4S is faster than the C2 and the C4 in the wet AND in the dry.

There are several anecdotal supports for this opinion. Ben has alluded to the "ring card", and Ray countering. For those who have not had the pleasure or agony of previous extended and repeated and repeated arguments, this is a list circulating on the net listing ring times, where the C4 is slower than the C2 which in turn is slower than the C4S. Another supporting point is the infamous Stig, who drove both a C2 and a C4S on a closed track, and he went faster in the C4S.

Then of course, there are the multiple anecdotal personal experiences, and you can pick any one you like. Here' mine. As I progressed up the ranks in DE, the C4S consistently was faster than any other car on the run group. I'd like to say it was because I was a better driver than anyone else in my class, but the truth is that the C4S, with all it's "S" and AWD enhancements, was just that much more easy to drive fast than anything else out there. In the DRY.

Here's another opinion on what the "S" gets you. It gets you the best looking 996 out there, bar none. Of course, this is a totally impartial, unbiased opinion, and has nothing to do with the fact that I own one .

One more thing that the "S" get you. It gets you a bargain, despite the higher price. If you add the cost of the all leather interior, the wider wheels, wider tires, sport suspension, better brakes to a stock C2, you'll end up spending more money. It was true then when I bought the C4S new in 2002, and it is likely still true in todays used car market. Especially where you follow the trend where the C4S is holding it's own better against depreciation.

So that, IMHO, is what the "S" in a 996 gets you.

Benjamin Choi

that's my boy who just hit it out of the park