hankster66

I have a 90k 2000 996.1 6-speed that I am trying to determine how deep into the engine I need to get based on new discoveries (metal) in oil sump...

Background

• Project began as IMS/RMS, Flywheel/Clutch project... effectively just dropping the tranny.
• Chose LN option, and then as part of pre-qual, discovered I had a cam deviation... so now dropping engine and tranny to replace wear items. At this point the plan is to fix deviation (cam to cam chains, guides/rails, tensioners, etc.). And "while I'm in there, take care of AOS, pumps, etc.
• Continuing along the LN process, I drop the oil sump to inspect oil and conduct cylinder borescope. In so doing, I find a penny sized non-ferrous metal object (picture below). After my freak-out subsided I sent my oil for analysis and reached out to LN, who said the particulates in my filter and oil were normal, the plastic bits were from the guides, and the large metal piece likely from manufacturing process that just recently broke off. Sent them borescope picks and no borescoring evident, so that was promising. And the Blackstone analysis came back "better than good".
• Prior to project, there was no indication of any problems other than the clutch and a subtle whining sound that would go away after car warmed up that folks suggested might be related to the throwout bearing, which I planned to replace. No knocking, no ticking, no rough idle, no start-up smoke or other symptoms that caused concern.

Next Steps???

So now I am trying to decide how deep into the engine I need to go, or at least the key steps to follow to help me decide where I am safe to stop without incurring unnecessary "while I'm in there" costs. My primary concern is either tracking where that piece of metal came from and/or eliminating the possibility that it (or something else) might be set to do some harm. Thoughts?

hbdunn

I think once you get the cam covers off you'll be able to see if that's the top of a lifter. Would be surprised if it is since the engine sounds normal. From the other thread I don't see much else I would do, some things on there I wouldn't but that's me.

It's possibly that piece has been in there for the past 20 years.

SealG996

I don't think it's a reasoned argument. It's whether you view your purchase as a mistake now (detail and flip it) or at the other extreme as Jake Raby says you "love your car" enough for a ticket on his waiting list. I believe there are "in between" zones. Being in Australia where all 911s are viewed as special yes air cooled "more special" cars are still not an investment category. For me in between is an LN Nickasil cylinder elective complete rebuild (JR points out even Nickies may be banned environmentally), and IMS solution etc. I'm not contemplating resale and getting money back, but view the 996 as a better authentic entry into Porsche than front engine 924/944/968/928 or SUV, or new/newer finance and loans. My attempts at other sport cars from TR7 to Mercedes 380 SL, have not succeeded. My other keepers are sedans. My 996 has been a very straight forward fun car. I want to electively rebuild and stock critical spares as they get NLA etc. (now is a critical time) -make it a keeper.

The 996 is a practical Porsche in reality, but decisions are personal about how you view the car. How far you want to go? how long do you want to own it?

hankster66

That sounds sensible as a minimum baseline. Thanks.

hankster66

Thanks for responding. On part 1 of your response, I may have inadvertently provoked a philosophical response because of how I titled my thread. I love my car, intend to keep it, and intend to keep it strong and healthy. As a newbie into this world I was merely looking for practical advice on my particular situation. Not sure that going with an LN Nickie's overhaul applies in my case if the engine is healthy (bores, pistons, etc.). Sure, doing that would be an "upgrade" of sorts with additional performance opportunities, but I'm not tracking this car or looking for more than came stock.

Your closing comment is spot on with my scenario. I don't plan to sell (as far as I can see), I love to tinker and maintain things to keep them performing well (if not slight better), but nothing over the top. I also don't feel like I have to do it all at once and since I plan on doing all the work myself, I'm not worrying about the additional labor costs to go in there twice. My wain worry is eliminating the concerning source/impact of the metal object, and doing as much that makes sense on an otherwise well performing engine without having to drop the engine for another 3 years or 25k miles.

Any additional thoughts on how to assess how deep into the engine to go or the things I should minimally do to eliminate concerns that might arise over the next few years?

dporto

The only way to get “deep into the engine” is to drop it and do an invasive recon mission. If you’ve got some space and don’t drive it during the winter months, this is a nice way to go, and a valuable learning experience. If you just want to check out the cylinders, a bore scope can get you there. It seems like you’ve got a pretty good handle on maintenance and general needs. Very few parts are truly NLA at this point (you can always go the used route) and now that the 996 fits into the “Porsche Classic” category more should become available (albeit at a price…). Just remember that the suspension is a big part of the charm and abilities of these cars… good luck 👍

hankster66

Thanks. On suspension, that will likely be the next project. With the wheels and bumper off, the rear is screaming for attention. The previous owner put 19" wheels on, but the suspension seems all stock / original. What would you suggest to return it to its glory for street use?

frederik

From your initial post, it sounds like you've already confirmed that you don't need to worry about the bits you found. Why not do the tensioners, install the IMS solution, AOS, water pump, maybe injectors and plugs/coils, reinstall the engine and enjoy it? Since you have the sump off, probably a good idea to borescope it and hopefully find you don't have bore scoring.

Camarocane

for your peace of mind, this was found in my sump a while back and it was determined to be part of the manufacturing process.

TheChunkNorris

Wonder where the hell it came from in the manufacturing process.

oregondave

he already mentioned borescoping happened and no scoring was found.

Camarocane

The explanation given to me was that Porsche has a terrible housekeeping policy.
For mine, the theory is that something was drilled out and a piece was stuck to the useable part. When the engine was assembled, this shaving was then displaced with whatever occupied that hole, falling into the sump. Unfortunately I'm new to these cars and engines so I wouldn't begin to guess there that hole would be located.

theprf

That's the end layer of a drilled hole, the piece that breaks off when the drill passes through the part. It's absurd that these get left inside the engine.

frederik

Awesome!

Chris(MA)

Those thin aluminum parts look to me like machining errors that can happen occasionally, they could be flash from the casting that is supposed to be cleanly cut away via CNC, however a small % of them can bend away from the tooling rather than be cleanly cut away (more likely if the engine was made at the end of the tooling life before its swapped for new/sharper tools), they can hang on for a short or long time then eventually break off and enter the oil