Anyone ever fight a paced speeding ticket?
04-08-2004, 07:31 PM
#19
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FWIW, I was just reading something in the UK (Autocar or a motoring section in the newspaper), and apparently Porsche drivers are the most frequently ticketed by speed cameras. Wasn't too much detail about how they got at that, but seemed to be based on number of tickets for each make divided by some unknown denominator serving as a proxy for ownership (I guess)
04-09-2004, 03:03 PM
#20
Rennlist Member
Here's a little FYI. I guess you could consider me an expert. (check out my screen name)
In regards to calibration, tire pressure and all that other stuff has nothing to do with pacing a vehicle. Officers don't check their cars at the begining of a shift with a radar gun either. Speedos are typically calibrated twice a year. The certificates are kept in the vehicle's file. Copies of the certificate are always brought to court as part of the evidence against the speeder. Same goes for radar units. Although radars are always checked with tuning forks at the begining of a shift and the end of the shift. You can pace a car on city streets or the highway. All you need is a reasonable distance. There is no such distance specified by statute. Most officers maintain a pace for at least ten seconds, as that is usually enough to verify the speed if you are close enough. All you need to do is maintain a speed long enough where the car in front is neither gaining nor losing distance.
With regards to pacing from a plane, it is extremely accurate and tough to beat. The pilot has nothing to do with clocking the vehicles. They employ a spotter who records the times and relays them to ground units.
Tickets are very tough to beat in general. It's not impossible, but not likely. Most cops will show as they typically are disciplined for not appearing. Besides, it is often overtime for them to be there.
On the other hand, if you do go to court, you won't beat it but you will probably get some sort of reduction. This ususally requires an attorney to accomplish this. You have to way out the cost of the attorney vs. the reduction in sentencing.
Hope this was helpful. Feel free to ask any questions.
In regards to calibration, tire pressure and all that other stuff has nothing to do with pacing a vehicle. Officers don't check their cars at the begining of a shift with a radar gun either. Speedos are typically calibrated twice a year. The certificates are kept in the vehicle's file. Copies of the certificate are always brought to court as part of the evidence against the speeder. Same goes for radar units. Although radars are always checked with tuning forks at the begining of a shift and the end of the shift. You can pace a car on city streets or the highway. All you need is a reasonable distance. There is no such distance specified by statute. Most officers maintain a pace for at least ten seconds, as that is usually enough to verify the speed if you are close enough. All you need to do is maintain a speed long enough where the car in front is neither gaining nor losing distance.
With regards to pacing from a plane, it is extremely accurate and tough to beat. The pilot has nothing to do with clocking the vehicles. They employ a spotter who records the times and relays them to ground units.
Tickets are very tough to beat in general. It's not impossible, but not likely. Most cops will show as they typically are disciplined for not appearing. Besides, it is often overtime for them to be there.
On the other hand, if you do go to court, you won't beat it but you will probably get some sort of reduction. This ususally requires an attorney to accomplish this. You have to way out the cost of the attorney vs. the reduction in sentencing.
Hope this was helpful. Feel free to ask any questions.
04-09-2004, 08:48 PM
#22
Burning Brakes
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I have a couple points of interest as well. All of my comments refer to the State of California, and all of my Law Enforcement info refers to Anaheim PD.
1. You can complete Traffic School online. I guarantee you that paying for and completing traffic school is much less expensive than hiring a lawyer. The only negative to this is that you lose a couple hours of your time by doing traffic school online (you lose a whole day of your time if you do traffic school in person). You are eligible for TS every 18 months
2. A good friend is a patrol sgt and he said that the only speedos that get calibrated regularly are the traffic enforcement speedos. The department rarely spends the money to recalibrate the "regular" patrol speedos. This will buy you 5-10 MPH of "wiggle room". It WILL NOT get you out of doing 60 in a 25 zone.
3. If you get nabbed for going less than 10 over the limit, you can claim that your speedo is uncalibrated, and therefore your speedo indicated that you were going within the speed limit. The older your car is, the better this will work. It won't work on a 2004 996.
It's even better if you can get a speedo shop to give you a "certification" letter than your speedo is out fo whack. Again, if you were nabbed for less than 5 over, depending on how your speedo is layed out, you can claim that your speedo does not display speed by the individual MPH, but in every 5MPH increments. This is common in some trucks and most cheaper vehicles.
4. With all due respect to deputydog, I have had 3 traffic infractions in 8 years and in each case, the officer did not show up to court. One of them was even a CHP officer!
5. You DO NOT need to hire an attorney to help you win a traffic ticket. If the cop doesnt show up, you win. Period. If the cop does show up, you are more than likely screwed, with or without an attorney. IMHO, I would only hire an attorney for a serious violation such as reckless, DUI, or other violation where my driving privileges are at stake. In cases such as these, good attorneys will run you about $1000.
1. You can complete Traffic School online. I guarantee you that paying for and completing traffic school is much less expensive than hiring a lawyer. The only negative to this is that you lose a couple hours of your time by doing traffic school online (you lose a whole day of your time if you do traffic school in person). You are eligible for TS every 18 months
2. A good friend is a patrol sgt and he said that the only speedos that get calibrated regularly are the traffic enforcement speedos. The department rarely spends the money to recalibrate the "regular" patrol speedos. This will buy you 5-10 MPH of "wiggle room". It WILL NOT get you out of doing 60 in a 25 zone.
3. If you get nabbed for going less than 10 over the limit, you can claim that your speedo is uncalibrated, and therefore your speedo indicated that you were going within the speed limit. The older your car is, the better this will work. It won't work on a 2004 996.
It's even better if you can get a speedo shop to give you a "certification" letter than your speedo is out fo whack. Again, if you were nabbed for less than 5 over, depending on how your speedo is layed out, you can claim that your speedo does not display speed by the individual MPH, but in every 5MPH increments. This is common in some trucks and most cheaper vehicles.4. With all due respect to deputydog, I have had 3 traffic infractions in 8 years and in each case, the officer did not show up to court. One of them was even a CHP officer!
5. You DO NOT need to hire an attorney to help you win a traffic ticket. If the cop doesnt show up, you win. Period. If the cop does show up, you are more than likely screwed, with or without an attorney. IMHO, I would only hire an attorney for a serious violation such as reckless, DUI, or other violation where my driving privileges are at stake. In cases such as these, good attorneys will run you about $1000.
04-10-2004, 06:45 AM
#23
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well....
i must say i will hire an attorney EVERY time!
my reasoning:
1) it only cost me $500
2) missing a day of work would cost me more than twice that
plus i could not be bothered to go to court (waist of time) if i happened to be off.
3) my guy gets a lot of stuff done at pre-trial conference and often gets stuff dismissed or gets people who should not be eligible traffic school
4)The lawyer may know the judge and or prosecutor and get "a favor"
My case was dismissed but i WILL use a lawyer from here on out!
i must say i will hire an attorney EVERY time!
my reasoning:
1) it only cost me $500
2) missing a day of work would cost me more than twice that
plus i could not be bothered to go to court (waist of time) if i happened to be off.
3) my guy gets a lot of stuff done at pre-trial conference and often gets stuff dismissed or gets people who should not be eligible traffic school
4)The lawyer may know the judge and or prosecutor and get "a favor"
My case was dismissed but i WILL use a lawyer from here on out!
04-11-2004, 12:01 PM
#24
Speeding tickets
My blood pressure rises every time I read a speeding ticket post. Most of the tickets do nothing to improve road safety. They are a form of taxation. Any township, city, state govt. etc. will tell you that.
Regarding traffic "safety:"
How many times have you seen someone driving "stupid" (e.g. tailgating, weaving in and out of traffic, cutting people off) and thought aloud, "that deserves a ticket for dangerous driving." Instead, I regularly see motorists pulled over in rush hour for going 10 over while moving in traffic (yes, it happened to me), creating massive commuter "gawker" delays.
As long as there are "quotas" for tickets, there will be frivolous enforcement.
Regarding traffic "safety:"
How many times have you seen someone driving "stupid" (e.g. tailgating, weaving in and out of traffic, cutting people off) and thought aloud, "that deserves a ticket for dangerous driving." Instead, I regularly see motorists pulled over in rush hour for going 10 over while moving in traffic (yes, it happened to me), creating massive commuter "gawker" delays.
As long as there are "quotas" for tickets, there will be frivolous enforcement.
04-12-2004, 06:00 PM
#25
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Pointless to try to fight a paced ticket anywhere in Europe. The cops will show up in court with a video tape, show a nice footage of your speeding car, the camera system calculating speeds, top and average, distances and every other parameter you can think of. Nah, you're done if your plate shows and the cops have stopped you.
That said, the consensus in the States is much more relaxed when it comes to speeding. You guys have no idea about radars and cameras until you've lived in Switzerland. My current ticket pace seems to be 1/mo. The funny thing being, I've yet to receive a ticket with the Porsche as so far it's been just with the Audi (a diesel one even).
As for penalties, going more than 40kph excess on highway and you'll be likely to spend a few days in jail and be licenseless for months, even years if you're a repeater. The worse part is that after a certain threshold, your fine will be a certain percentage of your annual income and a sure court case (++expenses).
Luckily the insurance rates are not affected by the # of tickets..
That said, the consensus in the States is much more relaxed when it comes to speeding. You guys have no idea about radars and cameras until you've lived in Switzerland. My current ticket pace seems to be 1/mo. The funny thing being, I've yet to receive a ticket with the Porsche as so far it's been just with the Audi (a diesel one even).
As for penalties, going more than 40kph excess on highway and you'll be likely to spend a few days in jail and be licenseless for months, even years if you're a repeater. The worse part is that after a certain threshold, your fine will be a certain percentage of your annual income and a sure court case (++expenses).
Luckily the insurance rates are not affected by the # of tickets..
04-13-2004, 03:32 PM
#29
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Originally posted by 996THIS
I go to court on 4-20-04, CHP 91 freeway. 80 in a 65, but don't have representation. Anyone know someone?
I go to court on 4-20-04, CHP 91 freeway. 80 in a 65, but don't have representation. Anyone know someone?
http://www.ellison-law.com/
If it has to do w/ radars
http://stantheradarman.com/
Peter
04-13-2004, 04:21 PM
#30
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Re: Speeding tickets in Europe
Originally posted by Wazoo
Makes you wonder, if insurance rates don't go up with a speeding ticket in Europe, why do they go up here?
Mmmmm...
Makes you wonder, if insurance rates don't go up with a speeding ticket in Europe, why do they go up here?
Mmmmm...
I lived in switzerland for 2 years during the early '90's. Insurance was easily 2 x what I was paying in Illinois. I moved to Belgium, and the rate was 50% more than Switzerland. A colleague moved to Belgium and brought his 928GT with him. The first few insurance quotes he received were for $1000...............per month! I can't even recall how high the annual road tax was, but it would make your nose bleed.
Trust me, you don't want to trade insurance rates with Switzerland or any country in Europe.
Cheers,
