Ready to become first time 911 owner - reliable commuter?
#16
I live in DC and our 996.2 was our sole car for commuting and road trips for about 4 years, from 65k to 106k miles where it is currently. It's has been pretty dang reliable for an old german car, but it costs money to keep it that way. The only 2 times I needed a tow truck was due to cracked coils and horrible misfires that started overnight, and then later bad gas. That said, I've proactively run through many maintenance items to keep the car this reliable. Clutch, flywheel, RMS, a 2nd replacement IMSB, AOS, catalytic converters, 2 water pumps, alternator, wheel bearing, and various other small things (not including standard consumables). These days I only commute in it about once or twice a week as DC roads are so incredibly atrocious that it really just shakes the car to pieces. It only feels worth driving if I can get out to the countryside/mountains or an autocross or driving event, which I do as often as possible.
If I didn't care about denting wheels, destroying my LCAs, wearing out my Ohlins and just generally beating up the car on rough city roads, I'd still daily it. If I had a more freeway or suburban based commute, I'd still be daily driving it. In my use case, I don't care about adding wear and tear to the car, but I'd want it come from hard driving with a big smile on my face and not a mundane event like surprise pothole at 30mph, so I've confined my use as such. I think your answer might lie in what conditions your specific commute offers you
If I didn't care about denting wheels, destroying my LCAs, wearing out my Ohlins and just generally beating up the car on rough city roads, I'd still daily it. If I had a more freeway or suburban based commute, I'd still be daily driving it. In my use case, I don't care about adding wear and tear to the car, but I'd want it come from hard driving with a big smile on my face and not a mundane event like surprise pothole at 30mph, so I've confined my use as such. I think your answer might lie in what conditions your specific commute offers you
#17
Guys, thank you for giving a valuable insight and sharing your personal experiences. This is very informative. Although I still work on my cars myself (as long as no lift or power tools is required), I now understand yearly maintenance cost of a 996, even if I do some work myself, compared to my BMW and wife's Cooper (which is quite unreliable but fun), will be noticeably more money. Driving a 911 daily is certainly an emotional decision, but rational part of me still asks whether I am willing to pay the cost. My wife of course, tell me, just buy and enjoy one. I am ready to pay the cost, but I am asking myself now whether I'd be better off buying something newer, use my savings as a down payment and finance the difference, because newer car will need less repairs just due to its age.
I agree, I should drive a 996 and not assume it will be similar to driving a 991.
I live in Yonkers, NY, commute up to Connecticut, drive to NYC sometimes for work. I destroyed 2 sets of 17" rims on runflat tires thanks to potholes. I have since, reluctantly, switched to 16" rims with regular tires, which pretty much solved the pothole problem, but the car certainly lost its sharpness when cornering.
I'd be more comfortable having all wheel drive given I sometimes drive in inclement weather and my AWD BMW never left me stranded even in a worst snow storm. I have an 8 y.o. kid who is fine in a back of a MINI, and I expect should be fine in back of 911.
I will read up on the materials you guys mentioned and will try to educate myself better on the cost of ownership, so that my emotional and rational sides could live in peace.
I agree, I should drive a 996 and not assume it will be similar to driving a 991.
I live in Yonkers, NY, commute up to Connecticut, drive to NYC sometimes for work. I destroyed 2 sets of 17" rims on runflat tires thanks to potholes. I have since, reluctantly, switched to 16" rims with regular tires, which pretty much solved the pothole problem, but the car certainly lost its sharpness when cornering.
I'd be more comfortable having all wheel drive given I sometimes drive in inclement weather and my AWD BMW never left me stranded even in a worst snow storm. I have an 8 y.o. kid who is fine in a back of a MINI, and I expect should be fine in back of 911.
I will read up on the materials you guys mentioned and will try to educate myself better on the cost of ownership, so that my emotional and rational sides could live in peace.
#18
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Nope. Go ahead and get the early 996, but also get a Subaru, Prius C, or Honda for commute duties. By the time you add up your running costs for the 996 DD, it will have paid for a used econobox. Save the 996 for when you want to enjoy driving, not force it.
#19
Hi! I have been dreaming about a 911 for years (hoping to buy 991.1 within next 3-4 years), and I figured I do not need to wait that long to own a 911, as 996 has gotten affordable and I've got some savings allowing me to actually buy one now. I see 996s are selling for around $25K, give or take, with relatively low miles for their age (40K-80K). I would be using the car as my daily driver. I commute about 40 miles one way, and I drive about 25K miles a year. This forum has a wealth of information and from what I gather, once IMS/RMS preventive work is done, these cars are quite reliable. I'd be looking to buy a manual transmission equipped car, even though my commute involves some stop and go traffic.
My question is, if I buy a 996 with about 60K on odometer (give or take 20K miles), can I count on this car to take me to 160K or even 200K miles without any expensive repairs, granted I do preventive work and stay on top of maintenance? My prior BMW E30 has been quite reliable (bought with 196K, drove to 240K), and my current 2011 BMW 328i has been quite reliable as well (bought with 23K, currently 166K).
Another question, I rented through Turo a 991.1 in Vegas few months ago and was intoxicated with the exhaust note (do not think it had factory sport exhaust because there was no button on center console to activate it). What are the options of getting great sound out of a 996?
I am presently watching the rennlist classifieds as well as bringatrailer.com too see what's up for sale, ready to make a move if right color combo pops up.
Thanks for any input on buying and enjoying a 996.
My question is, if I buy a 996 with about 60K on odometer (give or take 20K miles), can I count on this car to take me to 160K or even 200K miles without any expensive repairs, granted I do preventive work and stay on top of maintenance? My prior BMW E30 has been quite reliable (bought with 196K, drove to 240K), and my current 2011 BMW 328i has been quite reliable as well (bought with 23K, currently 166K).
Another question, I rented through Turo a 991.1 in Vegas few months ago and was intoxicated with the exhaust note (do not think it had factory sport exhaust because there was no button on center console to activate it). What are the options of getting great sound out of a 996?
I am presently watching the rennlist classifieds as well as bringatrailer.com too see what's up for sale, ready to make a move if right color combo pops up.
Thanks for any input on buying and enjoying a 996.
Beater cars are cheap and easy to find. Use one of those for a grocery getter and a work car, it will take all the door dings and scratches you can throw at it and you won't care.
#20
I love my C4S. I only put about 3K miles on it a year. It has not been a maintenance hog but the numerous little things add up pretty quickly. One of the big things about the C4S is the little thing called the frunk. My standard carry on bag will not fit in the frunk and has to go on the back seats folded down. It is rare I drive it to the airport but the few times my backup became the primary my carry on suitcase and tote filled the backseat shelf. It is not as practical as the C2 on space.
#21
And you will be working on a 996... regardless of the mileage on the car you buy. They are old complicated cars. And that’s not to say they aren’t relatable, I’d feel fine about jumping in mine and driving it across the country tomorrow.
If if you want an analog 911 as a DE (determined best by driving a few), go for it. Just hang on to the e30... just in case.
#22
I purchased my 996 in Sept 2017.
It had 50K on it.
I daily drive it about 1000 miles per month.
It now has 70K on it.
It has been very reliable.
Year 1 maintenance & repair costs were: $1121.31
Year 2 maintenance & repair costs so far are: $2275.30
Year 1 modification costs were: $7405
Year 2 modification costs are so far: $7013
I do all my own work, so that's just parts costs, not labor.
It had 50K on it.
I daily drive it about 1000 miles per month.
It now has 70K on it.
It has been very reliable.
Year 1 maintenance & repair costs were: $1121.31
Year 2 maintenance & repair costs so far are: $2275.30
Year 1 modification costs were: $7405
Year 2 modification costs are so far: $7013
I do all my own work, so that's just parts costs, not labor.
#23
I have DD my c4s, generally 4-6 months at a time when school is out for the kids. 25 miles each way. Put 1-2k Miles a month when driving it. It isn't the most comfortable ride but it is fun. Gets 22 mpg for mixed hwy city driving according to the dash monitor. 60k miles on it now, 40k when I bought it. Couple years in there I was deployed and car wasn't driven much.
Change the oil 1-2 per year depending on Miles driven. I hate the CEL because it's generally expensive or a nuisance. Nothing in between. Came on again today for o2 sensors again. This is after replacing all o2's last year, full new exhaust 2 years ago including headers, cross over cats and fabspeed cans. Other stuff just maintenance. Fluid changes (trans, brakes, etc). Next is the IMS service and debating keeping the car or passing along to someone before shelling out the money for it. Tires get expensive. Two sets in 7 years of ownership. $1k per set +/-. I don't have a total spent overall. It is higher than my truck by a good margin. I do my own maintenance mostly but I'll pay someone for the ims service if I keep it.
I live in SW. Hardly rains, rarely snows. 330 sunny days a year. No humidity. Not near the ocean. About as ideal as you can get for sports car DD. I still wouldn't DD it year round. I wouldn't if it was a longer commute. Much longer and I would be getting gas twice a week which is a pain. Better mpg than my truck but requires premium so cost is a wash and truck is much smoother nicer quieter ride.
Can it be DD as a primary car? Sure. Just understand it isn't a Honda Civic. It's alot more fun but can be maddeningly frustrating like when you need an inspection including emmisions and the o2 sensor pops the CEL seemingly when it knows it is due.
Hope this helps.
Change the oil 1-2 per year depending on Miles driven. I hate the CEL because it's generally expensive or a nuisance. Nothing in between. Came on again today for o2 sensors again. This is after replacing all o2's last year, full new exhaust 2 years ago including headers, cross over cats and fabspeed cans. Other stuff just maintenance. Fluid changes (trans, brakes, etc). Next is the IMS service and debating keeping the car or passing along to someone before shelling out the money for it. Tires get expensive. Two sets in 7 years of ownership. $1k per set +/-. I don't have a total spent overall. It is higher than my truck by a good margin. I do my own maintenance mostly but I'll pay someone for the ims service if I keep it.
I live in SW. Hardly rains, rarely snows. 330 sunny days a year. No humidity. Not near the ocean. About as ideal as you can get for sports car DD. I still wouldn't DD it year round. I wouldn't if it was a longer commute. Much longer and I would be getting gas twice a week which is a pain. Better mpg than my truck but requires premium so cost is a wash and truck is much smoother nicer quieter ride.
Can it be DD as a primary car? Sure. Just understand it isn't a Honda Civic. It's alot more fun but can be maddeningly frustrating like when you need an inspection including emmisions and the o2 sensor pops the CEL seemingly when it knows it is due.
Hope this helps.
#24
Its cool to see you looking at purchasing the 996 as a daily driver. I have been daily driving my 911s and other sports cars for a while now. I would recommend to have a thorough PPI performed on the car. These cars can hold up really well if maintained for the performance they offer. I will list a few things we see frequently in the shop to look for that affects performance of the cars.
Components frequently replaced
These are just some things I am thinking of off the top of my head and it is quite late for me so I’m sure I missed something. Feel free to PM me or email me if you would like a list, quotes, or want to ask questions!
Components frequently replaced
- IMS Bearing (single row every 40,000, dual row 60,000 miles, or life time direct oil fed bearing which doesn’t need replacement.
- Air oil separator (40-80k mile range or every 10-12 years is the pattern I see)
- Rear main seal leaks (depends on if the crank bore is wearing off center, usually only high mileage cars)
- Water Pump (40-80K miles)
- Rear wheel bearings (60-100k miles)
- Shocks (50-80k miles)
- Rubber brake lines (10-15 years old)
- Engine mounts (60-80k miles or around 10-12 years)
- Transmission mount (80,000 miles or 12+ years)
- Expansion tanks (120,000 miles or 15+ years old)
- Coolant Hoses (Similar to above)
- Clutch/flywheel (30k-60k some cases higher if the driver is really good with clutch engagement)
- Top hats at C4 (75k miles or more usually)
- Window Regulators (50,000 miles or so. These tend to vary)
- Oil leaks exc. RMS (70,000 or around 12 years old)
These are just some things I am thinking of off the top of my head and it is quite late for me so I’m sure I missed something. Feel free to PM me or email me if you would like a list, quotes, or want to ask questions!
#25
Its cool to see you looking at purchasing the 996 as a daily driver. I have been daily driving my 911s and other sports cars for a while now. I would recommend to have a thorough PPI performed on the car. These cars can hold up really well if maintained for the performance they offer. I will list a few things we see frequently in the shop to look for that affects performance of the cars.
Components frequently replaced
These are just some things I am thinking of off the top of my head and it is quite late for me so I’m sure I missed something. Feel free to PM me or email me if you would like a list, quotes, or want to ask questions!
Components frequently replaced
- IMS Bearing (single row every 40,000, dual row 60,000 miles, or life time direct oil fed bearing which doesn’t need replacement.
- Air oil separator (40-80k mile range or every 10-12 years is the pattern I see)
- Rear main seal leaks (depends on if the crank bore is wearing off center, usually only high mileage cars)
- Water Pump (40-80K miles)
- Rear wheel bearings (60-100k miles)
- Shocks (50-80k miles)
- Rubber brake lines (10-15 years old)
- Engine mounts (60-80k miles or around 10-12 years)
- Transmission mount (80,000 miles or 12+ years)
- Expansion tanks (120,000 miles or 15+ years old)
- Coolant Hoses (Similar to above)
- Clutch/flywheel (30k-60k some cases higher if the driver is really good with clutch engagement)
- Top hats at C4 (75k miles or more usually)
- Window Regulators (50,000 miles or so. These tend to vary)
- Oil leaks exc. RMS (70,000 or around 12 years old)
These are just some things I am thinking of off the top of my head and it is quite late for me so I’m sure I missed something. Feel free to PM me or email me if you would like a list, quotes, or want to ask questions!
#26
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Man, I look at that list above, and think about my 2012 Prius C. It's coming up on 200k miles and except for filters and tires and wipers, NONE of that stuff has worn out. I think some folks have a rather obscure definition of "DD". I can't even calculate the number of days the car would be up on blocks, or torn apart each couple years.
#27
[QUOTE=docmirror;15889892]Man, I look at that list above, and think about my 2012 Prius C. It's coming up on 200k miles and except for filters and tires and wipers, NONE of that stuff has worn out. /QUOTE]
If you can afford it drive a McLaren. It's all about what you are willing to pay to have fun behind the wheel. Just keep the Prius out of the left lane
If you can afford it drive a McLaren. It's all about what you are willing to pay to have fun behind the wheel. Just keep the Prius out of the left lane
#28
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I kinda think what's going on with some people dabbling in 996 ownership is that they look at the price of entry, and think; 'gee I could buy a decent used Subaru for $18k, or - I could buy this shiny bauble made by Porsche. What to do?' If they buy both, then that's a lot of scratch, but one 996 is the same price as the Subie! So, they want to have a 996, and operate it like a Subaru. Gas, oil, tires, wipers and a timing belt at 100k. Like you said, if one wants to pay the money, and down time, might as well DD a 06 Stanley Steamer. It can be done.
#29
I kinda think what's going on with some people dabbling in 996 ownership is that they look at the price of entry, and think; 'gee I could buy a decent used Subaru for $18k, or - I could buy this shiny bauble made by Porsche. What to do?' If they buy both, then that's a lot of scratch, but one 996 is the same price as the Subie! So, they want to have a 996, and operate it like a Subaru. Gas, oil, tires, wipers and a timing belt at 100k. Like you said, if one wants to pay the money, and down time, might as well DD a 06 Stanley Steamer. It can be done.