GT3 or Other 6 Pot Calipers on a C2
05-14-2019, 07:39 PM
#17
Drifting
I can't verify the exact weight, but I can tell you those Cayenne calipers are massive and heavier than hell. At one point I had a set that I was going to install on an Audi S4, it was one of the trick upgrades that people were doing.
Last edited by cds72911; 05-14-2019 at 08:22 PM.
05-15-2019, 10:19 AM
#19
Instructor
Thread Starter
Standard C2 discs are 317mm Front, 298mm rear.
I currently run Giro which are 340mm front, 325mm Rear.
996.1 GT3 runs 330mm Front & Rear.
I agree with Quaz in that I feel 350mm is the sweet spot, based on performance and adding unsprung weight. - As already pointed out the weight of the Cayenne caliper is what has pushed me away from this solution.
Caliper choice also has to have a good selection of quality pads available, no point fitting a large caliper only to find there are no pads available, I currently run Pagid RS29.
Quadcammer, for fast road use the standard setup is more than adequate, add high temp fluid, good pads and 997 GT3 ducts and you have a solid setup, indeed on track, with Yoko AD08R or Michelin Cup2 I can bring the ABS in, so there is definitely enough power in the standard calipers, however it the heat management after prolonged use I am looking to improve. - And although a secondary point, I dig the look of the 6 pots.
You will need a larger 27mm 997 GT3 master cylinder one to give better pedal feel and be able push the extra fluid required by the larger front brakes.
Quaz, are you able to get the 996 GT3 6 pots to work with a bracket or do you feel the Macan calipers are a better way to go? - And which Macan 6 pots are you thinking of? Are they all the same?
My concern with the 996 GT3 is that the mount hole centres are circa 145mm, so only maginally bigger than the C2 130mm which may make fashioning an adapter difficult.
I currently run Giro which are 340mm front, 325mm Rear.
996.1 GT3 runs 330mm Front & Rear.
I agree with Quaz in that I feel 350mm is the sweet spot, based on performance and adding unsprung weight. - As already pointed out the weight of the Cayenne caliper is what has pushed me away from this solution.
Caliper choice also has to have a good selection of quality pads available, no point fitting a large caliper only to find there are no pads available, I currently run Pagid RS29.
Quadcammer, for fast road use the standard setup is more than adequate, add high temp fluid, good pads and 997 GT3 ducts and you have a solid setup, indeed on track, with Yoko AD08R or Michelin Cup2 I can bring the ABS in, so there is definitely enough power in the standard calipers, however it the heat management after prolonged use I am looking to improve. - And although a secondary point, I dig the look of the 6 pots.
You will need a larger 27mm 997 GT3 master cylinder one to give better pedal feel and be able push the extra fluid required by the larger front brakes.
Quaz, are you able to get the 996 GT3 6 pots to work with a bracket or do you feel the Macan calipers are a better way to go? - And which Macan 6 pots are you thinking of? Are they all the same?
My concern with the 996 GT3 is that the mount hole centres are circa 145mm, so only maginally bigger than the C2 130mm which may make fashioning an adapter difficult.
05-15-2019, 11:58 AM
#20
going superfast has a 997 turbo kit on the same page previously linked. still big $. if you are looking for cooling, that's the rotors not the calipers. you can get larger rotors and keep the same calipers with spacers and longer caliper bolts (or go to studs). adds more clamping via the longer lever arm on the rotor as well. girodisc does it and gets you lighter rotors as a bonus, or i am pretty certain some research will find you oem rotors that are larger diameter but same width/offset and you just need to fabricate the spacers.
but really, no need to justify; if you want 6-pot then good luck, but not sure you will find a solution - "strong, light or cheap, pick two."
but really, no need to justify; if you want 6-pot then good luck, but not sure you will find a solution - "strong, light or cheap, pick two."
05-15-2019, 12:15 PM
#21
Instructor
Thread Starter
I already run Giro Discs, front and rear, in addition to 997 GT3 front lower ducts & front upper ducts with modified rad cowls to allow the air to run through the rads and into the wheel well, as well as custom brake ducting from the front bumper to the front calipers. - Rear runs 997 GT3 ducts.
05-15-2019, 12:16 PM
#22
Rennlist Member
Good old RockAuto always has specs of calipers and rotors posted, gotta love it. Anyway, the Macan GTS and Turbo calipers seem to be the same, but depending on year they spec 350-370mm rotors. ????? So I will have to dig into that a bit more. The bolt hole spacing is 205mm compared to the 145mm of the GT3 caliper and the 130mm for the standard Carrera. This is significant because there should be enough room to actually make the adapter and not modify the caliper as they do to fit the turbo/GT3/Cayanne units. I have seen the GT3 kit and it is pretty hokey in my opinion. Then comes the pistons, they are 36/36/36 compared to 44/36. This is where I need to crunch some numbers and see how much that will screw up the bias and pedal travel. Pretty sure the Macan caliper is the way to go here though. I am on the road for the next couple of days so I can research more when I get back home.
01-01-2020, 12:16 PM
#25
Yeah the Cayanne kit isn't overly desirable for a couple of reasons. First the calipers are very heavy, so you put quite a bit of unsprung weight on the front. They are meant for a truck. Second the pad size is not appreciably bigger than the standard C2 caliper pad. You can accomplish much of the same thing by just putting 330mm rotors with the stock calipers. The GT3/Macan 6pots have a much larger swept area and a pretty light weight caliper. Overall it just makes for a better solution. Not to mention you don't have to machine the calipers to make them fit, so off the shelf calipers will bolt right on. The ideal kit is a set of 350mm GT3 rotors, set of adapters and Macan calipers/pads. All bolt on and a true upgrade. Master cylinder is optional if you plan to track it. At least that is what I am thinking. I need to do some math on all this when I get some time maybe this weekend.
06-08-2020, 04:59 PM
#26
Cheers! For those who are interested I created an adapter set to fit 380mm 6Pot caliper/discs to our 986/996s using only the adapter and other OEM parts. Works fine!
High strength steel adapters to fit 380mm discs and 6 pot 997.2 GT2/3/RS with 225mm distance to 130mm 996/986 wheel carriers. These are made out of the same steel as Epytec is using for the german certificated brake adapter kits and are additionally coated.
The adapters allow usage of Cayman GT4 discs which benefits in a much cheaper price compared to 997 GT3 steel discs (997 GT3 steel discs have also a bigger bore hub than the 996s) and improve the brake clearance by ~2mm. By this more wheels or less thick spacers can be used to fit the wheels.
Additionally using this adapters allows OEM only usage of bolts and brake lines. No aftermarket parts are required. (e.g. OEM bolts used in 997s with the OEM adapters are used to fit these adapters, OEM hard brake lines are used attaching to the same holder and the OEM 996 brake lines)
Road tested in Germany up to 300km/h for some time now.
High strength steel adapters to fit 380mm discs and 6 pot 997.2 GT2/3/RS with 225mm distance to 130mm 996/986 wheel carriers. These are made out of the same steel as Epytec is using for the german certificated brake adapter kits and are additionally coated.
The adapters allow usage of Cayman GT4 discs which benefits in a much cheaper price compared to 997 GT3 steel discs (997 GT3 steel discs have also a bigger bore hub than the 996s) and improve the brake clearance by ~2mm. By this more wheels or less thick spacers can be used to fit the wheels.
Additionally using this adapters allows OEM only usage of bolts and brake lines. No aftermarket parts are required. (e.g. OEM bolts used in 997s with the OEM adapters are used to fit these adapters, OEM hard brake lines are used attaching to the same holder and the OEM 996 brake lines)
Road tested in Germany up to 300km/h for some time now.
06-08-2020, 05:46 PM
#27
Hey all...this may go a little OT on the 6-pot question, but I've been looking at BBK upgrades too and balancing against rebuilding my OEM brakes with stainless pistons and hi-temp boots vs a StopTech or Brembo BBK. I'm pretty sure both make 4-pot and 6-pot options although I was mainly looking at the 4-pots. Until, that is, I spoke with Stoptech and learned that their ST-40 based BBK for the 996 uses 34/38 pistons up front. So...essentailly their $2K BBK "upgrade" is really a downgrade in terms of piston size and brake fluid volume. Seemed Strange to me!!
Has anybody run any of the below options and have real butt dyno experience with the results? I've heard a thousand times here even from heavy track guys that the OEM gear is more than enough for the track 90% of the time. Is there a way to get to 95% without breaking the bank?
- Upgraded OEM calipers with Stainless Steel pistons and a high grade 600 deg brake fluid (SRF, Motul. StopTech)
- StopTech or Brembo BBK kits, preferably 4-pot versions due to budget.
- Either of the above with a 997 GT3 Master Cylinder. I know Kickshu and someone else tried this and I think it finally worked without ABS lights with a proportioning valve.
Pretty sure there's also a way to move the front OEM calipers to the rear, so if you can increase front piston volume you can retain a stock-ish 60/40 F/R ratio.
Has anybody run any of the below options and have real butt dyno experience with the results? I've heard a thousand times here even from heavy track guys that the OEM gear is more than enough for the track 90% of the time. Is there a way to get to 95% without breaking the bank?
- Upgraded OEM calipers with Stainless Steel pistons and a high grade 600 deg brake fluid (SRF, Motul. StopTech)
- StopTech or Brembo BBK kits, preferably 4-pot versions due to budget.
- Either of the above with a 997 GT3 Master Cylinder. I know Kickshu and someone else tried this and I think it finally worked without ABS lights with a proportioning valve.
Pretty sure there's also a way to move the front OEM calipers to the rear, so if you can increase front piston volume you can retain a stock-ish 60/40 F/R ratio.
06-08-2020, 05:52 PM
#28
Race Car
06-08-2020, 06:23 PM
#30
Race Director
Hey all...this may go a little OT on the 6-pot question, but I've been looking at BBK upgrades too and balancing against rebuilding my OEM brakes with stainless pistons and hi-temp boots vs a StopTech or Brembo BBK. I'm pretty sure both make 4-pot and 6-pot options although I was mainly looking at the 4-pots. Until, that is, I spoke with Stoptech and learned that their ST-40 based BBK for the 996 uses 34/38 pistons up front. So...essentailly their $2K BBK "upgrade" is really a downgrade in terms of piston size and brake fluid volume. Seemed Strange to me!!
Has anybody run any of the below options and have real butt dyno experience with the results? I've heard a thousand times here even from heavy track guys that the OEM gear is more than enough for the track 90% of the time. Is there a way to get to 95% without breaking the bank?
- Upgraded OEM calipers with Stainless Steel pistons and a high grade 600 deg brake fluid (SRF, Motul. StopTech)
- StopTech or Brembo BBK kits, preferably 4-pot versions due to budget.
- Either of the above with a 997 GT3 Master Cylinder. I know Kickshu and someone else tried this and I think it finally worked without ABS lights with a proportioning valve.
Pretty sure there's also a way to move the front OEM calipers to the rear, so if you can increase front piston volume you can retain a stock-ish 60/40 F/R ratio.
Has anybody run any of the below options and have real butt dyno experience with the results? I've heard a thousand times here even from heavy track guys that the OEM gear is more than enough for the track 90% of the time. Is there a way to get to 95% without breaking the bank?
- Upgraded OEM calipers with Stainless Steel pistons and a high grade 600 deg brake fluid (SRF, Motul. StopTech)
- StopTech or Brembo BBK kits, preferably 4-pot versions due to budget.
- Either of the above with a 997 GT3 Master Cylinder. I know Kickshu and someone else tried this and I think it finally worked without ABS lights with a proportioning valve.
Pretty sure there's also a way to move the front OEM calipers to the rear, so if you can increase front piston volume you can retain a stock-ish 60/40 F/R ratio.